Is this a legal sign?

[stepside454]

I typically am respectful of the business owners wishes of no guns in his establishment by not going in at all. The business owner has & should have the right to restrict guns on his property . As I have & should have the right to not take my business to him

 

[Bighouse Doc]

In Oklahoma, the sign only means that if discovered, they can ask you to leave.

-Doc

 

[araczynski]

as has been said, yes, they're perfectly legal signs, and you'd be smart to typically obey them. its private property, so its up to the owners. otherwise go ahead an get into a pissing match with someone there about it, get the cops called on you, and see what happens to your concealed permit

if you don't like it, move on to a different mall.

 

[cwebb74]

Most malls are built with some government grants so they aren't private property. If the signs meet the criteria then it's legal. But thats am observation you'll have to make based on your states laws. As for the posts about some so called whining and nit picking, as long as our constitution, which I am a big believer in, allows us to have legal grounds to stand on I'm going to live by the words.

 

[Gary Clark]

It does not apply to retired peace officers. A retired peace officer can go anywhere with a CW. Except on a plane. You must be an active on duty peace officer to carry on any airplane.

 

[Berta]

as has been said, yes, they're perfectly legal signs, and you'd be smart to typically obey them. its private property, so its up to the owners. otherwise go ahead an get into a pissing match with someone there about it, get the cops called on you, and see what happens to your concealed permit

if you don't like it, move on to a different mall.

In SC this is NOT a legal sign. As I said in my previous post I did disarm before going in because I was meeting someone at that particular mall. If a business does not allow CCW I won't patronize it. I never said I would challenge or disobey the rules of an establishment.

 

[17Load]

In South Carolina, this is not a legal sign - you can carry. As TacticalPirate defined above, it isn't the right color, too low and not on the door - at a minimum, those reasons alone make this a sign which isn't the legitimate one.

It may be the owner's attempt to appease both sides of the argument. The anti-gun weenies are going to see that and feel good about their narrow views and think they have won and simultaneously, those of us who are educated on what the sign must look like will smirk at it while we calmly walk on by without concern. I view this as a business trying to make themselves look good and still allow us to carry. These business are multi-million dollar businesses, if they truly didn't want us to carry within their establishments, their lawyers would have made sure it was the legitimate sign meeting all of the parameters as set by state laws. Example: Regal Entertainment Group movie theaters post the legit signs on their doors. They do not want our business...

 

[NotTwoShure]

Yes, but one must have a man with a red flag run ahead of you and check out the backstop for endangered politicians who may wish to read, use and follow that old document, the Constitution.

 

[FN1910]

The sign is legal and there is nothing wrong with it, however it does not carry any weight of the law. In SC for a sign to carry the weight of the law and serve as a trespassing notification it must meet the requirements spelled out in the code of laws. A business can put any kind of sign up they want to and it is perfectly legal for them to do so.

If a business puts up a sign meeting the requirements of the law and you ignore the sign carrying inside the business then you can be immediately arrested and charged. They do not have to give you any additional warning or ask you to leave. There may also be some problem with stand-your-ground protection if the sign meets the requirements since you are now in violation of the law by carrying where you have been notified that you are not to carry.

If the sign does not meet the requirements of the law then it is only a request and carries no weight of the law. There is nothing illegal about the sign but is merely a request by the business. If you carry anyway and are discovered then they can ask you to leave. If they ask and you do not then you are trespassing and can be arrested.

The difference between the two signs is that if it meets the SC code then it serves as proper notification without any additional request by the business owner. If if does not meet the requirements then it is nothing more than a request and they must then ask you to leave before you can be arrested.

 

[wolf_fire]

On private property they can make whatever rules they want. One poster asked are they legally displaying the sign correctly *shrugs*.

The questions that I have are:
- Can you open carry in SC? If so, what would the mall do since the sign says no concealable weapons? However, let's go to my second question.
- Do you wish to patronize a mall that has this feeling toward a Constitutionally protected right?
- Would you be able to bring a rifle or shotgun in with you instead? That's definitely not concealed either. But, go back to my second question.
- Are you able to still conceal carry in that mall as long as they don't know about it without breaking any local or state laws? Again, go back to my second question.

I personally would shrug my shoulders, flip em the bird, and find somewhere else to shop.

 

[rrman12280]

This is the true sign by law. Except that it is within forty inches of door bottom. At least it appears that way in the photo.

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

 

[NotTwoShure]

Malls are to teenie boppers, old valley girls and folks that do not buy in bulk for the long haul. Just kidding, I do not go into malls because "I'm not into that" life-style. My duds are for long-term wear, not show, the places that I go to really could care less if I am packing or not, but, I live in a small town with only one Walmart, Home Depot and the like.

 

[David Mitchell]

On private property they can make whatever rules they want. One poster asked are they legally displaying the sign correctly *shrugs*.

The questions that I have are:
- Can you open carry in SC? If so, what would the mall do since the sign says no concealable weapons? However, let's go to my second question.
- Do you wish to patronize a mall that has this feeling toward a Constitutionally protected right?
- Would you be able to bring a rifle or shotgun in with you instead? That's definitely not concealed either. But, go back to my second question.
- Are you able to still conceal carry in that mall as long as they don't know about it without breaking any local or state laws? Again, go back to my second question.

I personally would shrug my shoulders, flip em the bird, and find somewhere else to shop.

- No, Open carry is illegal in SC and the sign says "NO CONCEALABLE WEAPONS" because state law requires it to have that verbiage.

- This is a personal choice but in my way of thinking, most legally armed citizens wouldn't want to do business with someone who doesn't respect their rights.

- No, As in the answer to your first question, open carry is illegal in SC and there are only two options for carrying a weapon; open or concealed.

- Because the sign doesn't meet the legal requirements, it does not hold the weight of law. That said, would you want someone coming into your house and doing something that you didn't like?

---

There has been a lot of talk in this thread about "It is concealed, so no one should know". I understand this idea and my CWP instructor even made the same comment. However my question to my fellow readers is what is more important to you? Being Sea-Lawyers and finding loopholes that benefit you and our group that think alike or upholding the integrity of this group of law abiding citizens by respecting the rights of everyone, even those who disagree with us?

If there was no other option than to shop in an establishment with a sign like this, I would honor it. The simpler answer is to just go somewhere else.

 

[kelcarry]

no it is not legal because it does not meet all of the specifications that it needs to have, look up the laws in SC for the specs for the legal signs, i'd walk right in there with mine in my pocket

That is your answer, pure and simple. If they do not want you to have your firearm, the least they can do is follow the law like you do. Want to teach them a lesson and make a few bucks--tell them they have the wrong sign, refuse to leave, get arrested and sue um.

 

[NCIC105]

Since you posted in SC forum, I can tell you wanted an answer relating to SC Law...Not Texas, Wisconsin or any other state...


In SC, it is not legal...Keep in mind in mind they can always ask you to leave, and you must obey.

 

[The_Outlaw]

Went to a mall in Columbia today and saw this sign on the door, is this a legal sign?

Link Removed

In Texas, that particular sign is meaningless and a waste of window space.
If it is legal in your state, then don't give those fascist scumbags your hard earned $$.

 

[hp-hobo]

That is your answer, pure and simple. If they do not want you to have your firearm, the least they can do is follow the law like you do. Want to teach them a lesson and make a few bucks--tell them they have the wrong sign, refuse to leave, get arrested and sue um.

Every time you fire up your keyboard, crap just falls out of it. In South Carolina, if you're inside a business that is either not posted or improperly posted, you are carrying and refuse to leave upon request, you are in violation of the law. If they want you out and have told you, you have been given actual notice are at a minimum guilty of criminal tresspass. So, you could go to jail and buy your lawyer a new boat. And you could "sue um", but there is no way you could prevail.
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Isn't learning how the law works fun?

 

[AndeyHall]

Ok perhaps there is some misunderstanding about how the sign thing works. In SC, signs hold the weight of law ONLY if they are properly posted as listed in the law books. If the sign is legal, then that eliminates the store owner or his employees' obligation from verbally having to ask you to leave. Therefore if you enter when the sign is legal, you are trespassing by law. If the sign is NOT legal, then they have not legally asked you to leave, and if they do not want your business then they must then verbally ask you to leave. If you then refuse, then because they have the right to refuse business to anyone they choose, you are then trespassing by law.

So in summary, if the sign is legal and you enter, you are trespassing. If the sign is not legal, they must first verbally ask you to leave, and if you refuse then you are trespassing.

 

[apvbguy]

Every time you fire up your keyboard, crap just falls out of it. In South Carolina, if you're inside a business that is either not posted or improperly posted, you are carrying and refuse to leave upon request, you are in violation of the law. If they want you out and have told you, you have been given actual notice are at a minimum guilty of criminal tresspass. So, you could go to jail and buy your lawyer a new boat. And you could "sue um", but there is no way you could prevail.
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Isn't learning how the law works fun?

In fact in just about any state if a property owner or business owner requests you to leave and you refuse that could be grounds for an arrest or warning, here in FLA refusal to comply with a request to leave will result in an arrest for ARMED trespass and with that you can kiss your permit bye bye. I wouldn't be surprised is the laws were similar in most other states

 

[SCfromNY]

I do not understand all the replies from other states, many incorrect. In SC the size and character of the sign is specific. All other signs are meaningless. You of course can be asked to leave by the owner. Many companies have a "start up" package that goes to all their branches regardless of state. Decals for no guns, no smoking, and such are just generic and I am sure they do not take the time to check each states requirements.