Restaurant carry in SC


The only way to carry in SC is concealded carry, unless you are hunting or fishing.

That make the argument moot because it say's 'carry'.

The intent of the law is what matters here and the side of the argument that would acknowledge that you are obviousley NOT hunting or fishing while in a resturant, I believe, trumps any convoluted argument that the law states 'carry' instead of 'concealed carry'.

Those kind of arguments cost people money and waste taxpayers time.

KK
 

FN1910

New member
16-23-465 says in addition to penalties stated in 16-23-460. 16-23-460 says that this section does not apply to those with a CWP. So if 16-23-460 does not apply then how can 16-23-465 be an additional penalty? That is the question that is brought up about restaurant carry and I think a very good case.

On April 17, 2001 the AG issued an opinion at the request of Sled Chief Robert Stewart. In 2008 Sen. Robert Hayes asked for a new opinion but was just sent a copy of the original on Feb. 28, 2008. The Westlaw number appears to be WL 564590(S.C.A.G.) is you have access to Westlaw. I have a copy saved on my PC but it is too large to post here so I need some way to post it or convert it and make it smaller. The key was that the AG based his opinion on what he thought to be the intent of the Legislature rather than the wording of the law and it took him 6 pages rather then the normal 1-2 for opinions.
 
I get your point but I believe in respecting 'intent' and until someone with clout, a judge, says different, my model, and my 'free advice' to SC CWP holders is don't do it.

I think that with the fact that the original opinion was sent back, instead of a new opinion, means no new judge wants to opine differently.

KK
 

wwalker1187

New member
But you can carry your firearm into a restaurant that serves alcohol and sit and eat
without consuming. Handgunlaw.us recommends you not sit at the Bar or in the Bar area of such
restaurants. In some states it is illegal to be in the Bar area of such restaurants. Handgunlaw.us
believes you should never consume alcohol when carrying your firearm. In some states it is illegal to
take even one drink while carrying a firearm. If you want further info on carrying in places that serve
alcohol check your state laws.
 
But you can carry your firearm into a restaurant that serves alcohol and sit and eat
without consuming. Handgunlaw.us recommends you not sit at the Bar or in the Bar area of such
restaurants. In some states it is illegal to be in the Bar area of such restaurants. Handgunlaw.us
believes you should never consume alcohol when carrying your firearm. In some states it is illegal to
take even one drink while carrying a firearm. If you want further info on carrying in places that serve
alcohol check your state laws.

Your wrong but being that you feel your right, let me know how that ends for you. There a bunch of us waiting for just that very thing:):):)

I know the state law in SC and although a bit messy to figure out, it states you can't carry in an alcohol serving resturant.

It has to mean 'concealed carry' because it can't mean 'just plain carry' because you can't 'just plain carry' anywhere but on the lake or in the woods while hunting or fishing.

How do you get around that?

KK
 

FN1910

New member
A couple of years ago I got the info from a very reliable source that the SCAG asked that the word be passed around to LEO to not try and enforce the law on CC in a restaurant unless it involved some other offense. The reasoning behind this was that he was not sure that the opinion on CC in a restaurant that serves alcohol would stand up in court and did not want to try a test case opening the door for full carry. He felt that as long a people thought it was illegal they would usually try to obey it but if the opinion was overturned in court then there would be no option. So if you are sitting there having a meal and not bothering anyone minding your own business then you are probably not going to have problems with a LEO. In fact I have been told by more than one LEO in SC that as long as you "behave yourself" and not make a deal out of your gun they really don't care. Of course there is always the chance of running into the one that want to make a name for himself. Like the city cop here that would, and has, given his own mother a ticket for speeding.
 

SCfromNY

New member
I have to agree with "FN1910" because it also makes sense. I am not sure how the hunting and fishing info was called for. The subject had nothing to do with open carry only that a person with a CWP would NOT be illegally carrying his gun. The fact that in SC you can legally have a firearm in many spots without a CWP is what I believe this law is aimed at.

I hope and believe that the confusion on this law will addressed in the next legislature session after the 6 month vacation. Anyone reading who may be instrumental in crafting a law PLEASE keep it simple unlike last years far to comprehensive debacle.
 

wwalker1187

New member
Your wrong but being that you feel your right, let me know how that ends for you. There a bunch of us waiting for just that very thing:):):)

I know the state law in SC and although a bit messy to figure out, it states you can't carry in an alcohol serving resturant.

It has to mean 'concealed carry' because it can't mean 'just plain carry' because you can't 'just plain carry' anywhere but on the lake or in the woods while hunting or fishing.

How do you get around that?

KK

you can CC in a resturant, as long as you're not drinking alchol. you can also open carry on your property and on other people's property as long as they give you permission.
 
you can CC in a resturant, as long as you're not drinking alchol. you can also open carry on your property and on other people's property as long as they give you permission.

I'd like to see your source. Especially where it indicates 'as long as you are not drinking'.

As far as "most" cops being told not to pursue a cc in a resturant, if it's not ALL, there is a chance you may get your permit revoked by those who interpret the law as it seems stated to me.

Just saying you can do it doesn't make it so.

Yes, I agree you can open carry on private property with permission, my statement was for general, no permission purposes. For general purposes, without express permission, the only place you can open carry is while hunting or fishing. CC is not allowed anywhere unless you have a permit, in general.

You keep stating the same thing over and over. There are others who have posted the excerpt of the law but your only proof seems to be your statement.

I'm not telling you not to do it, I just think it is terrible advice to give someone the notion it is OK to do so with the fact that some people are looking for correct answers. I hope they understand that an internet forum is not the place to get the law straight unless you can put a link to a state gov't site that states the law.

KK
 

DLB1964

New member
you can CC in a resturant, as long as you're not drinking alchol. you can also open carry on your property and on other people's property as long as they give you permission.


It says without reserve you cannot CC in any establishment that serves alcohol. My instructor said no, and I have talked to numerous other CWP instructors who said its a definite no.

If you want to keep your CWP..I'd advise against carrying anyplace that serves alcohol.
 

NCIC105

New member
Interesting how folks don't mind giving their advice on this law...Bet if someone follows it and gets's busted, the giver of the advice will not be able to be found to assist with the legal bills for the "Bad Advice" they provided!

I live in SC and retired LEO and should be covered by HR-218. However, I will never test this law as I do not need the hassle of defending myself and the legal expense.

If someone feels the need to test this law let us know how it works out for you...You may prove your point but may piss away thousand or dollars to do so...
 

chiefpropellerhead

Chiefpropellerhead
I have decided that if I do not want to disarm myself to go into a restaurant selling alcohol that I chose a restaurant that does not sell alcohol. I realize that this limits my choices but that is the key. It is MY choice where I spend my money. When I chose not to eat at those establishments the interpretation of the law is a moot point. Not only that, but I certainly do not want to be a test case or lose my CWP because of an incident. It is not worth it.
 

NCIC105

New member
I have decided that if I do not want to disarm myself to go into a restaurant selling alcohol that I chose a restaurant that does not sell alcohol. I realize that this limits my choices but that is the key. It is MY choice where I spend my money. When I chose not to eat at those establishments the interpretation of the law is a moot point. Not only that, but I certainly do not want to be a test case or lose my CWP because of an incident. It is not worth it.

Sounds like you are a wise man!
 

FN1910

New member
Interesting how folks don't mind giving their advice on this law...Bet if someone follows it and gets's busted, the giver of the advice will not be able to be found to assist with the legal bills for the "Bad Advice" they provided!

I live in SC and retired LEO and should be covered by HR-218. However, I will never test this law as I do not need the hassle of defending myself and the legal expense.

If someone feels the need to test this law let us know how it works out for you...You may prove your point but may piss away thousand or dollars to do so...

I doubt that a thousand dollars will cover it unless you just want to plead guilty and pay the fine. Even then the additional costs down the road due to your record will probably cost a lot more later.

I have stated that I am willing to donate $50 toward the legal expenses when it reaches the Supreme Court. Now if we can get about 99 more to get it up to $5,000 that may cover the attorneys initial retainer fee. The last attorney I hired required a $10,000 retainer fee and that was used before we ever made it to a preliminary hearing.
 

SCfromNY

New member
Just a quick comment here. "Carrying" in the restaurant is not the whole issue. Yes bad things can happen in the restaurant but what could be more problematic is the walk back to your car in the parking lot.

I hope all will be clarified and solved in the new year.
 

FN1910

New member
Just a quick comment here. "Carrying" in the restaurant is not the whole issue. Yes bad things can happen in the restaurant but what could be more problematic is the walk back to your car in the parking lot.

I hope all will be clarified and solved in the new year.



Mr. Nail, meet Mr. Hammer. Whether it is a restaurant, mall, Wal-Mart or any other business etc. I am much more concerned about the parking lot than I am about being inside the business in most cases. This is something I see all the time in people discussing carrying. We get focused on the little things or very rare occurrence and forget about the real problems. How may Ludy's incidents are there compared to people being robbed or killed in the parking lots of restaurants.
 

50SR9

New member
I am not going to argue the meaning of the 2nd amendment. I don't think there is any reason to interpret its meaning. To understand the law about firearms and alcohol is somewhat common sense. Now before anyone jumps up and down screaming that they have the right to carry anywhere I will say. "I agree." The problem lies in the judgement breakdown of any person after consuming alcohol. How many fights have erupted from being drunk, 10 feet tall and bullet proof? How many accidents have happened from alcohol consumption? How many people have been shot due to alcohol's effect on the common sense part of the brain. I really don't think the law is there to violate yours or anyone else right to carry. It is proven over and over, just by reading about events on this site, how stupid people can be without alcohol. Toss in someone having a "few" and see how much more stupidity erupts. I hate to say it, but sometimes man has to be protected from himself. I am not saying that you or anyone else reading this will be at a bar, drinking and decide to pull out a gun and be stupid, but you well know as do I, that someone, somewhere will. One reason being caught under the influence of alcohol while carrying a weapon will probably result in the temporary loss, if not permanent loss of your CCW permit. In Okla, you can be in an establishment that serves alcohol as long as that is not the primary reason for business. I.E. a restaurant or other establishment that serves alcohol but primary business is eating. Violate this "no weapon" policy if you like, just remember one thing, when you violate the law of your CCW license you give the anti CCW crowd more ammo. I may not agree with some of the conditions of the CCW, but I do understand some of the reasons. OK, blast away at me!
 

NCIC105

New member
If a person is prone to violate the law, A law will not prevent them from doing it.

I have not had a beer in 10 years....Why can't I carry my weapon into Applebees?

For all that say you can have issues going to your car unarmed..Obvious!
 

xdmgator

New member
Just my .02 because most have said already but ... Why take the risk? I understand points from both sides of the issue, but shouldn't CWP holders be some of your most fervent law abiding citizens? I mean we are the ones under the microscope.
 

FN1910

New member
I am not going to argue the meaning of the 2nd amendment. I don't think there is any reason to interpret its meaning. To understand the law about firearms and alcohol is somewhat common sense. Now before anyone jumps up and down screaming that they have the right to carry anywhere I will say. "I agree." The problem lies in the judgement breakdown of any person after consuming alcohol. How many fights have erupted from being drunk, 10 feet tall and bullet proof? How many accidents have happened from alcohol consumption? How many people have been shot due to alcohol's effect on the common sense part of the brain. I really don't think the law is there to violate yours or anyone else right to carry. It is proven over and over, just by reading about events on this site, how stupid people can be without alcohol. Toss in someone having a "few" and see how much more stupidity erupts. I hate to say it, but sometimes man has to be protected from himself. I am not saying that you or anyone else reading this will be at a bar, drinking and decide to pull out a gun and be stupid, but you well know as do I, that someone, somewhere will. One reason being caught under the influence of alcohol while carrying a weapon will probably result in the temporary loss, if not permanent loss of your CCW permit. In Okla, you can be in an establishment that serves alcohol as long as that is not the primary reason for business. I.E. a restaurant or other establishment that serves alcohol but primary business is eating. Violate this "no weapon" policy if you like, just remember one thing, when you violate the law of your CCW license you give the anti CCW crowd more ammo. I may not agree with some of the conditions of the CCW, but I do understand some of the reasons. OK, blast away at me!

I can sum this up with that line that you ofter read in the paper when describing some incident that makes everyone go "Huh?" Alcohol was involved. I read a good article recently about a scientific study on how alcohol affects people differently. They are not sure exactly why but we have probably all seen it. When drunk some people get giggly and some people get mean. Others seem to get stupid and others.......... Either way when people get drunk they usually follow the same pattern of always getting mean or stupid or.......
 

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