Most Cops are Good?
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whodat2710
New member
I don't think that enough attention is paid to the attitude the general public takes into a situation with a cop, or any situation.
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In a customer service situation, I get great service, helpful employees and sometimes even save money because I am polite. Have you ever had the employee say "oh, there's a coupon for that" even if you don't have said coupon? Or maybe they offer that you could save money buying this instead, or if you get 2 it's cheaper because of our sale, or whatever. If you walk into the store with a "screw you" attitude towards the minimum wage help, you won't get the same service.
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SOME people on here like to throw the word "badgefluffer" around because it makes them sound all cool and anti-establishment. Chances are they don't act that way when confronting a cop, or if they do they are going to get a ticket instead of a warning, or a ticket for doing 80 instead of the cop saying "I'll write it up as seventy so you don't get points on your license"
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It ain't "badgefluffing", just common courtesy to someone that hasn't pissed me off yet. Here's a clue, if you are breaking the law and get stopped you can blame the cop all you want but you won't get the benefit of the doubt when they are deciding how to resolve the situation. Also, if you attack, run from, cuss at or otherwise escalate the situation, you are taking a chance that this is one of the 'bad cops" and you are giving them a reason to be a bad cop...at you.
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In a customer service situation, I get great service, helpful employees and sometimes even save money because I am polite. Have you ever had the employee say "oh, there's a coupon for that" even if you don't have said coupon? Or maybe they offer that you could save money buying this instead, or if you get 2 it's cheaper because of our sale, or whatever. If you walk into the store with a "screw you" attitude towards the minimum wage help, you won't get the same service.
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SOME people on here like to throw the word "badgefluffer" around because it makes them sound all cool and anti-establishment. Chances are they don't act that way when confronting a cop, or if they do they are going to get a ticket instead of a warning, or a ticket for doing 80 instead of the cop saying "I'll write it up as seventy so you don't get points on your license"
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It ain't "badgefluffing", just common courtesy to someone that hasn't pissed me off yet. Here's a clue, if you are breaking the law and get stopped you can blame the cop all you want but you won't get the benefit of the doubt when they are deciding how to resolve the situation. Also, if you attack, run from, cuss at or otherwise escalate the situation, you are taking a chance that this is one of the 'bad cops" and you are giving them a reason to be a bad cop...at you.
Firefighterchen
OC for Tactical Advantage
I'm curious, who you mean by, "some of you"...what you described doesn't fit the description for any of my encounters...last one being 8 years ago...then again I don't think you are talking about me.
I don't see anything equal about a cop lying on his report to reduce the penalty...and a cashier giving someone a coupon.
If only cops were trained to have the restraint customer service employees possess.
Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
I don't see anything equal about a cop lying on his report to reduce the penalty...and a cashier giving someone a coupon.
If only cops were trained to have the restraint customer service employees possess.
Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
I'll take it one step further -- if they would only "Protect and Serve," we all would be best of.
Deanimator
New member
Call me eccentric, but I've found that obeying the traffic laws, and laws in general, is the best way to avoid trouble with the cops, NOT kissing their behinds.
I want NOTHING to do with the police. That's why I go out of my way to avoid situations in which I will have to interact with them. I essentially got a co-worker fired the year before last because he lied to the cops and cited me as a witness to an alleged on the job altercation.
The BEST police encounter is the one that never happened in the first place.
There are people who seem to believe that they're ENTITLED to speed, drive drunk, and do a whole host of other stupid things, SO LONG as they're "respectful" to the cop(s) who have to deal with them.
As for me, I find it easier to just obey the law than to engage in ritualized shows of submission.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Whodat isn't badgefluffing......this time...... He just can't admit that a former Coast Guardsman is a back-shooting, murdering coward. So now we not only have to deal with the thin blue liners, but whodat has returned to lecture us from a thin red and white line perspective, or "Coastyfluffing" if you prefer.
One warrior of the unconstitutional "War on Drugs" unable to bring himself to believe what his lyin' eyes are telling him about another former War on Drugs warrior should surprise nobody. And of course, those of us who refuse to disbelieve our own eyes, are the problem with this (and others) story.
Un-freakin'-believable!
Blues
One warrior of the unconstitutional "War on Drugs" unable to bring himself to believe what his lyin' eyes are telling him about another former War on Drugs warrior should surprise nobody. And of course, those of us who refuse to disbelieve our own eyes, are the problem with this (and others) story.
Un-freakin'-believable!
Blues
vernsimpson
New member
I do the same. I try to obey all the traffic laws and not speed. I also check that all my lights on whatever I am driving are working. I have not been stopped for years now so I have not had any problems.
If I ever do get stopped I will be respectful and not be an a$$ to the LEO. IMHO you do not poke a Tiger with a sharp stick and then complain about getting mauled!
Firefighterchen
OC for Tactical Advantage
Responding to the bold:
I had a conversation recently with a coworker about respect/disrespect/indifferent and kind/mean. We settled the discussion agreeing on the following:
We can be any combination of above, but they shouldn't be synonymous.
Respect or disrespect is earned by the actions of the other, until then I'm indifferent of the stranger. Being kind or mean is solely on my part. I can be kind to a stranger, and still be indifferent or disrespect them. I can be mean to someone completely out of respect.
How can someone respect another when they have no idea who they are? Maybe I put more meaning into certain words, such as respect, friend, freedom, etc.
Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
whodat2710
New member
Why don't you try reading the damn reports again Blues, then revise your rant. Walter Scott, the VICTIM, was formerly in the Coast Guard. You can also work on your reading skills with my post, and tell me where I said anything even remotely favorable about Slager.
Oh yeah, I almost forgot...
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Un-freakin'-believable!
whodat2710
New member
You have used the "ritualized shows of submission" term frequently. Can you admit that being polite is not necessarily submissive? There is a difference between allowing someone to do their job and (if you were speeding or didn't signal or whatever) being polite as they do their job and being subservient and ritually submissive. Guess what? If the cop was having a bad day and decided that you going 5 miles over the speed limit down a hill was worth him pulling you over, he might be an a$$, but he is within the boundaries of the law. If you think arguing it will have better results than being polite then go for it. If you think that being as polite to a cop as you would be to ANY OTHER person you encounter in your daily routine is “badge-fluffing” then we just aren’t going to agree on this.
Deanimator
New member
I believe I've seen at least one report that they were BOTH in the Coast Guard.
Deanimator
New member
I'm going to have to recommend that you do what you recommended to somebody else. Actually READ what I said.
I don't want ANYTHING to do with the police. Therefore, I go out of my way to NOT do things which result in such contacts.
I said NOTHING about "arguing" with anybody. I'm POLITE to most strangers who merit it. I am NOT "friendly" or "respectful", just POLITE. Think of a really expensive Japanese lawyer deposing you for a lawsuit.
If I'm speeding, give me the damned ticket. I'm not entitled to speed, and I expect no "breaks" from cops. I'd rather drive the speed limit than tug at my forelock for not having done so.
whodat2710
New member
Chen, I see what you are getting at. I would toss in a military similarity that some on here get intuitively, some by being in the military, and some just don’t get at all.
There is respect for a position and respect for a person. In the cop instance, I can understand that it is a suck job. I can understand that 90% of the people they interact with hate them on spec. I can understand that most of the people they interact with have broken the law in some way shape or form, whether knowingly or inadvertently. I also know that because of this they have to make a snap judgement on the mindset of the person they are dealing with many times a day.
I can understand that it is a more difficult job than many others but in the end it is still a customer service position just like the guy selling you a car or the cashier at the store. I can respect the person that maintains a polite (not sarcastically polite) attitude while doing any crappy job. The minute they cross the that line of treating me like a customer, or in the cop instance like a human being with the same rights as them, I no longer respect them.
In the cop instance I still respect the position, even if it’s a moronic jackwagon doing the job. That moron has the same right to throw the book at you as the decent cop, and is more likely to do so out of spite. There is a difference between respecting the job and respecting the person doing it.
whodat2710
New member
I get what you are saying and did read it
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I’m also polite to homeless people, grocery store clerks and the mail lady. Go figure.
I drive the speed limit a well. I get a perverse pleasure out of seeing some impatient idiot behind me angry that I am following the law. Unlike you, I am not perfect. The one time I got pulled over in the past 30 years, I was on an unfamiliar road and I didn’t see the sign that dropped the speed limit from 45 to 35. I was polite; it ended up costing me nothing. I don’t see ritual submission, subservience or any other pro-establishment jargon applying, just basic politeness to a stranger.
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I’m also polite to homeless people, grocery store clerks and the mail lady. Go figure.
whodat2710
New member
You are correct, I didn't see that reported and I am in Charleston.
Shooting Victim Walter Scott, Police Officer Both Served In Coast Guard
Suffice it to say that the Coast Guard service of neither man had an bearing on my understanding of the facts pertaining to the case, regardless what Blues might think. So one was a bad cop ex USCG, the other was a non-child support paying ex USCG. Why would I bring up either?
BluesStringer
Les Brers
From the link I gave, as I nearly always do when citing a factoid:
Coasty and WoD warrior, just like I said.
While the same link mentions Scott's (the VICTIM's) status as a Coast Guard veteran, it says exactly zero about what his job was. Maybe he was a WoD warrior too, but I tend to give VICTIMS of WoD warriors a higher degree of benefit of the doubt than their freakin' murderers.
As far as the rest of the post of mine you're whining about....
You don't "think" he was fleeing armed, but you couldn't resist injecting the specter of that possibility into the discussion. Slager's original story was that Scott was armed with the murdering pig's own taser. The video shows as clearly as the nose on your face that that was a lie, so why even bring it up unless it's to lend some amount of credence to his original story? And how can you claim to be "thinking" about anything when the video betrays that any possibility of Scott being armed, and Slager being aware of it, is indeed a lie?
Upon what evidence do you base this rank conjecture?
And so now Axe is a "bad guy" because he posted a link to an unfriendly-to-cops website that posted a ton of statistics validating what they had to say about them? I'm a "bad guy?" Chen is a "bad guy?" Everyone who ever let a terse word pass their lips about cops is a "bad guy?"
Your outrage is held in check for a cop caught on video murdering a citizen, but held up in righteous indignation for citizens on this board exercising their First Amendment rights to say any damned thing they wish in opposition to current acceptable cop practices that are killing Americans at a greater rate over the last 13 or 14 years than the freakin' Iraq War!
My reading skills are working just fine. Yours on the other hand, well, you can't even "read" a video of a murder without having to "think" about whether or not the VICTIM deserved it. Pffft.
Blues
Coasty and WoD warrior, just like I said.
While the same link mentions Scott's (the VICTIM's) status as a Coast Guard veteran, it says exactly zero about what his job was. Maybe he was a WoD warrior too, but I tend to give VICTIMS of WoD warriors a higher degree of benefit of the doubt than their freakin' murderers.
As far as the rest of the post of mine you're whining about....
You don't "think" he was fleeing armed, but you couldn't resist injecting the specter of that possibility into the discussion. Slager's original story was that Scott was armed with the murdering pig's own taser. The video shows as clearly as the nose on your face that that was a lie, so why even bring it up unless it's to lend some amount of credence to his original story? And how can you claim to be "thinking" about anything when the video betrays that any possibility of Scott being armed, and Slager being aware of it, is indeed a lie?
Upon what evidence do you base this rank conjecture?
And so now Axe is a "bad guy" because he posted a link to an unfriendly-to-cops website that posted a ton of statistics validating what they had to say about them? I'm a "bad guy?" Chen is a "bad guy?" Everyone who ever let a terse word pass their lips about cops is a "bad guy?"
Your outrage is held in check for a cop caught on video murdering a citizen, but held up in righteous indignation for citizens on this board exercising their First Amendment rights to say any damned thing they wish in opposition to current acceptable cop practices that are killing Americans at a greater rate over the last 13 or 14 years than the freakin' Iraq War!
My reading skills are working just fine. Yours on the other hand, well, you can't even "read" a video of a murder without having to "think" about whether or not the VICTIM deserved it. Pffft.
Blues
Debray
New member
Here We Go Again
We all have an opinion and again we don't have all the facts. I saw some footage last night from the police car cam where Scott was originally stopped and when Slager took his license back to the cruiser he jumped out of the car and ran prior to the video of the shooting.
We all know there are good cops and bad cops the same goes for all people in general, the problem really is there are a lot more bad people now.
Mostly due to all the Government Give-me's that creates nothing but idleness and un-rest.
If we haven't walked in their shoes, we have no idea what they have gone thru.
A Vietnam Vet or a Afghan Vet that has lost friends and comrades at hands of the enemy look at Vietnamese and Afghans a whole lot differently then a civilian does.
Many of us don't live in a war zone, but today larger cities are just that.
Obama has done everything possible to create this racial un-rest and the media is fanning the flames, and using it for more Government take over of local police department.
It started with Prof. Gates and Sgt. Crowley ("the police acted stupidly" , Travon Martin, "could have been my son" Michel Brown (sent in Eric Holder to fan the flames), Eric Garner (Obama said, "This is an issue we've been dealing with for too long and it's time for us to make more progress than we've made), and now Walter Scott.
I'll give him one out of 5.
I think the President needs to focus on the real problem and it isn't the Police 72 Shot in Chicago in Wave of Holiday Weekend Violence | NBC Chicago
We all have an opinion and again we don't have all the facts. I saw some footage last night from the police car cam where Scott was originally stopped and when Slager took his license back to the cruiser he jumped out of the car and ran prior to the video of the shooting.
We all know there are good cops and bad cops the same goes for all people in general, the problem really is there are a lot more bad people now.
Mostly due to all the Government Give-me's that creates nothing but idleness and un-rest.
If we haven't walked in their shoes, we have no idea what they have gone thru.
A Vietnam Vet or a Afghan Vet that has lost friends and comrades at hands of the enemy look at Vietnamese and Afghans a whole lot differently then a civilian does.
Many of us don't live in a war zone, but today larger cities are just that.
Obama has done everything possible to create this racial un-rest and the media is fanning the flames, and using it for more Government take over of local police department.
It started with Prof. Gates and Sgt. Crowley ("the police acted stupidly" , Travon Martin, "could have been my son" Michel Brown (sent in Eric Holder to fan the flames), Eric Garner (Obama said, "This is an issue we've been dealing with for too long and it's time for us to make more progress than we've made), and now Walter Scott.
I'll give him one out of 5.
I think the President needs to focus on the real problem and it isn't the Police 72 Shot in Chicago in Wave of Holiday Weekend Violence | NBC Chicago
billt
Banned
It's a bit hard to see in the video because of the poor quality, (just once I'd like to see a criminal act shot with a high resolution camera, that didn't have the lens cleaned with Vaseline), but it appears you can see Taser wires extended as the guy is running away. This would indicate the Taser had already been fired. As far as I know Tasers are a one shot deal. They're not "magazine fed". So even if he took the Taser from the cop after it had been fired, it was totally useless at that point, and a non threat.
whodat2710
New member
Guess what? In MY OPINION, anyone that willingly condemns an entire group of people for the actions of a portion of those people is a bad guy. Disagree? Fine. You are entitled to your opinion as well. To stoop to name calling and questioning intelligence because you don't agree with someone, well, that is right in line with good ol' Saul Alinski. Think about it.
whodat2710
New member
Blues and others, here is something to consider as to what I base my opinion on. I was a cop in the Coast Guard. I was not bad. I have not met a bad cop in the Coast Guard, though some did enjoy the "power-trip" and were usually shut down by those in charge or placed on other duties. In recent history, there have been zero officer involved shootings in the Coast Guard. Google it if you don't believe me. There is one story of a CG guy and 2 CG women in a lovers quarrel or something, but not related to law enforcement. The media tends to refer to CG and Navy guys as "Officer" since they cannot comprehend rank structure.
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In my duties I also associated with local, state and federal LEO's and never met one that was a bad cop. Could they have been bad at other times? sure. I never saw it. We took them out on boardings if they had an outstanding warrant on someone at sea, some did ride-alongs and would enforce state maritime law, which we could not. We also transferred every BWI suspect to local authorities. As feds, we would have to take them to a federal magistrate (sometimes hours away and plenty of time for a BAC to drop) to process them for BWI, but we had MOI's with local LE that they would take them off our hands.
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All that said, I have never argued that all cops are good. I simply believe in personal responsibility. A bad cop isn't to be differentiated from any other criminal, except the punishment should be magnified because of the breach of trust issues involved. A cop that is a murderer is a murderer. If convicted there should be no chance of leniency. In a situation like Michael Brown, people jumped to conclusions based on hearsay. With Walter Scott it is not jumping to conclusions because there is video that is not subjective, BUT we don't have video o the entire event. There is still an investigation because the video is not the be-all end-all unless it captures the whole event start to finish. Is it likely something will turn up in Slagers' favor? Sure, and I might sprout wings too.
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Anyone that tries to condemn an entire group of people based on the actions of some of those people is a bigot. I don't care if you are stereotyping cops, blacks, gays, NASCAR fans or whatever. It makes no difference.
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In my duties I also associated with local, state and federal LEO's and never met one that was a bad cop. Could they have been bad at other times? sure. I never saw it. We took them out on boardings if they had an outstanding warrant on someone at sea, some did ride-alongs and would enforce state maritime law, which we could not. We also transferred every BWI suspect to local authorities. As feds, we would have to take them to a federal magistrate (sometimes hours away and plenty of time for a BAC to drop) to process them for BWI, but we had MOI's with local LE that they would take them off our hands.
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All that said, I have never argued that all cops are good. I simply believe in personal responsibility. A bad cop isn't to be differentiated from any other criminal, except the punishment should be magnified because of the breach of trust issues involved. A cop that is a murderer is a murderer. If convicted there should be no chance of leniency. In a situation like Michael Brown, people jumped to conclusions based on hearsay. With Walter Scott it is not jumping to conclusions because there is video that is not subjective, BUT we don't have video o the entire event. There is still an investigation because the video is not the be-all end-all unless it captures the whole event start to finish. Is it likely something will turn up in Slagers' favor? Sure, and I might sprout wings too.
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Anyone that tries to condemn an entire group of people based on the actions of some of those people is a bigot. I don't care if you are stereotyping cops, blacks, gays, NASCAR fans or whatever. It makes no difference.
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