Would you or wouldn't you?

[Rhino]

The bolded text simply isn't believable, Rhino. Sandy Hook happened in December 2012. Both the Guns.com article and the Link Removed piece they sourced their information from were published mid-May 2013. You're suggesting that just because Proctor is a small MN town that the Chief never heard a news story about the "panic buying" and ammo shortages across the country six months after it started. I don't believe him. He simply got caught unprepared.

I think it was more a case of him being incredibly naive and not thinking the shortage would affect him, because I agree that it's unlikely he had heard nothing at all of the ammo shortage. Sandy Hook didn't cause the shortage, but it was a contributing factor. And I didn't suggest the department size had anything to do with him hearing of the shortage. I was trying to point out that small towns with small departments have small budgets. There's less leeway and less room to readjust funds to accommodate unanticipated events when you have smaller budgets. Sorry I didn't make that more clear.
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Then it is just as "plain" that the Chief is a blithering idiot if he can't flip on a TV or radio or read a national newspaper to find out that six months after Sandy Hook happened, nobody could find especially .40 cal. and .223/5.56 ammo anywhere in the country, at least not at the retail level. Bigger agencies may be at the head of the line with distributors, and that might be a logical reason for saying the smallness of the Chief's department had a bearing on not being able to find practice ammo, but saying it was "plain that the Chief didn't know about the ammo shortage" five or six months after it started being reported daily is just not believable.

I'm far from a blithering idiot, and I had no idea what specific calibers were short, other than 380, and the only reason I knew about that one was because a friend had trouble finding it anywhere for quite some time. It should come as no surprise to you that many people don't watch much TV or read many newspapers. I don't watch network TV at all, with the exception of a very few shows that I record in advance so I don't have to watch all the other crap during the commercial breaks. I avoid network news like the plague, and I haven't read a newspaper in a very long time. I do those things because I learned long ago that those sources were not trustworthy. Many other people do the same, some for similar reasons and some for reasons of their own. To assume people to be blithering idiots because they don't consume the same news that you do is a totally illogical leap. I agree that he probably heard that there were some ammo shortages occurring, of that I have little doubt. But to assume he had detailed knowledge of what calibers were affected and how that would affect his department is a highly prejudiced assumption that has absolutely no factual basis.
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And you say "they received" 16 AR's for a seven-man department??? Where'd they get the money for more than twice as many rifles as they have men to shoulder 'em if they couldn't even find money in the budget to keep practice ammo on-hand??? Let me guess: The 16 AR's for a seven-man department came with the MRAP paid for by the federal government?

Actually I think you hit the nail on the head. I'd be willing to bet the ARs came from a federal grant and were thus not budgeted for. That would mean ammo for them was very likely not budgeted for either.
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I don't know, but nothing is adding up, and besides, the question here is would we donate or loan our respective LE agencies ammo, and regardless of the truth or dishonesty expressed in why they're asking for it, my answer would always be an unqualified, "Are you freakin' kidding me???" followed by a vociferous, "Get lost."

As I said before, everyone obviously would be free to make their own choice for their own reasons. I'm not trying to sway anyone's decision. I'm only trying to clarify the situation as best I can, and the way I see it of course, based on what we know. Unfortunately for all of us, there's obviously much we don't know.
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I don't have any .40 cal. firearms, but I do recall reading/hearing that it, along with .223/5.56, were the two least-available rounds at the height of the shortages. They are both still over-priced due to those shortages too, which is why I haven't replenished what I've used over the last year or so yet, or I should say, haven't *started* replenishing yet, because I have used a lot more of what I spent 20 years stockpiling of 5.56 and the pistol rounds I use than I could afford to replenish in one purchase.

I just bought $1600 worth of ammo today. Would have bought more if I had a job. :haha:
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If a two-person household can plan for ammo shortages, a seven-man LE agency that can afford more than twice as many rifles as they have personnel to use them should be expected to plan for shortages too. His excuses ring hollow, but more importantly, ring untrue to me.

I don't think they bought the rifles.

 

[Rhino]

I have plenty of ammo the police can't have any of it.

You know, now that I think about it, I don't think my local cops use the same calibers that I do. I have two 40 cals and my wife has a 9mm, but I'm not planning on keeping both calibers. So until my wife decides on whether she wants to carry the 9mm Glock 26 or the 40 cal Glock 27, I'm not stocking much of either of those calibers. I don't have any 5.56 rifles either. If they were looking for 45 ACP or 7.62, that would be another story, but none of them use those calibers to my knowledge, nor any of my other rifle calibers. I don't think any of them carry 357 anymore.

 

[longslide10]

And how exactly would you plan for your suppliers running out of stock? Your city doesn't give you extra money to stockpile, and they certainly aren't going to fund you to start manufacturing your own ammo. So how exactly would you plan to conjure up this ammo out of thin air when the suppliers ran out? There are well known and well publicized reasons why they couldn't get ammo. They're not full of excuses. Someone else might be full of something though.

One scary thought came to mind here. What if it went the other way and they started demanding ammo from those they know that have it such as those who carry. I believe my previous posts would become nullified at that point. "OH HELL NO" would then become my motto.

 

[Rhino]

One scary thought came to mind here. What if it went the other way and they started demanding ammo from those they know that have it such as those who carry. I believe my previous posts would become nullified at that point. "OH HELL NO" would then become my motto.

On the bright side, there probably wouldn't be any more disagreement in this thread.
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That wasn't a scary thought. It was a nightmare! Stop that!

 

[cds0699]

Disagreement is fine, heck that makes for good learning opportunities. I respect everyone's opinion, even if I don't agree.

Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk

 

[Rhino]

As do I. For example, Blues and I have disagreed on several occasions, but I respect his opinions as much as, if not more than, anyone else's opinions on this forum. Heck, I kind of enjoy debating back and forth with him sometimes, and I often learn things in the process just as you do. Why, it was only yesterday when he proved in another thread that I was not only senile, but blind too. :haha: Disagreement doesn't mean disrespect. At least it doesn't for me.

 

[Rhino]

I just bought $1600 worth of ammo today.

You know, I placed that order on Friday right before I made that post. I got that ammo yesterday afternoon (Saturday), and I chose normal shipping. Now, Lucky Gunner is in Indiana and I'm only in Ohio, but still, it's kinda hard to beat service like that. For any who may be wondering, it included 45 (defensive and practice), 357 (defensive and practice), 270 Win, 7.62 x 39 and 30-30. I still need to get some more 12 ga somewhere.

 

[S&W645]

The bolded text simply isn't believable, Rhino. Sandy Hook happened in December 2012. Both the Guns.com article and the Link Removed piece they sourced their information from were published mid-May 2013. You're suggesting that just because Proctor is a small MN town that the Chief never heard a news story about the "panic buying" and ammo shortages across the country six months after it started. I don't believe him. He simply got caught unprepared.



Then it is just as "plain" that the Chief is a blithering idiot if he can't flip on a TV or radio or read a national newspaper to find out that six months after Sandy Hook happened, nobody could find especially .40 cal. and .223/5.56 ammo anywhere in the country, at least not at the retail level. Bigger agencies may be at the head of the line with distributors, and that might be a logical reason for saying the smallness of the Chief's department had a bearing on not being able to find practice ammo, but saying it was "plain that the Chief didn't know about the ammo shortage" five or six months after it started being reported daily is just not believable.

And you say "they received" 16 AR's for a seven-man department??? Where'd they get the money for more than twice as many rifles as they have men to shoulder 'em if they couldn't even find money in the budget to keep practice ammo on-hand??? Let me guess: The 16 AR's for a seven-man department came with the MRAP paid for by the federal government? I don't know, but nothing is adding up, and besides, the question here is would we donate or loan our respective LE agencies ammo, and regardless of the truth or dishonesty expressed in why they're asking for it, my answer would always be an unqualified, "Are you freakin' kidding me???" followed by a vociferous, "Get lost."
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I don't have any .40 cal. firearms, but I do recall reading/hearing that it, along with .223/5.56, were the two least-available rounds at the height of the shortages. They are both still over-priced due to those shortages too, which is why I haven't replenished what I've used over the last year or so yet, or I should say, haven't *started* replenishing yet, because I have used a lot more of what I spent 20 years stockpiling of 5.56 and the pistol rounds I use than I could afford to replenish in one purchase.

If a two-person household can plan for ammo shortages, a seven-man LE agency that can afford more than twice as many rifles as they have personnel to use them should be expected to plan for shortages too. His excuses ring hollow, but more importantly, ring untrue to me.

Blues

I had no problem finding Federal .40S&W at the local Wally World in Ohio during that time. In fact it was the only rounds they did have. Most people don't care for that round and either buy 9mm or .45ACP. It is not the best round to handle in a gun like a S&W CS40 but it does just fine in a Sig P-250C or even better in a S&W 4006. 24 vs 37 ounces of gun weight makes a world of difference in felt recoil.

And maybe they are so inept that they need 16 ARs to make sure they can keep 7 working. Their planning leaves much to be desired. Did those guns come with ammo, bet not. So they'll be short on that too.

 

[BFP53]

They wouldnt want my ammo, cause they all carry 9mm around here and i have .45's....40 and 45 ammo around here at Walmart is plentiful... a week ago the had a pretty good supply of 9mm and .38's now they all gone.

 

[telpinaro]

Ha... Just found a scenario where I might donate if I had the right caliber. The county sheriff's office is currently collecting .22 for the 4-H Club Shooting Sports. Yeah, I'd donate to help kids shoot. :smile:

 

[Dave AA]

sell the ARs to buy ammo, or is that too obvious? Before the shouts of "PAPERWORK! BUREAUCRACY! CAN'T DO IT!" start, whose problem is that? doesn't seem to be the private sector's.

 

[Rhino]

And I just found several boxes of 40 cal in my inventory yesterday that I didn't know I had. Federal HST. Not enough that I'd spare for donations though.