Why Competion and Bullseye Shooting Will KIll You

[Deanimator]

You can't miss fast enough to win a gunfight.

Between my ability to hit the ten ring at fifty feet (on a regulation fifty foot target), my knowledge of what cover and concealment are (and the difference between them), and my willingness to use overwhelming deadly force to defend my life, I think I've got what it takes to stay alive.

But that's ok. I know for a fact that there are a lot of people who spend all of their time watching dummies hurt themselves on YouTube, who laugh at me because I'm reading a book of first hand accounts of the Boxer Rebellion. I don't lose any sleep over it.

 

[apvbguy]

If you live in SC and attempt a citizen's arrest AT NIGHT (Only at night), based on the supposition or reality that someone is committing a felony, and they decide to evade your arrest, you can STOP THEM BY ANY MEANS POSSIBLE INCLUDING DEATH. This means that if the BG is retreating you can shoot him in the back. Not for me and not for you but can be for anyone else.

why would any sane person attempt to make a citizens arrest?

 

[NavyLCDR]

Some posts in this thread seem to be flirting around or inside the edges of a bizarre post I saw in another forum a couple of years ago. After several members talked about how much they enjoyed shooting in competition and with friends and family trying to achieve respectable groups, and the like, a self-appointed, self-anointed expert posted something pretty much like the following: "I didn't know for awhile what you guys are talking about with references to 'fun' and 'recreational shooting.' I ONLY train. There isn't a single time when I load a gun, draw when I have a holster, go to the ready position, or pull the trigger when I don't have a specific training objective in mind. That's right, every shot. In my opinion, if you don't have a 100 per cent training mindset and consistently TRAIN, then you have no business owning or shooting a gun."

Which would be like saying race car drivers should never drive the family car on public highways.

 

[r1derbike]

Amsdorf, I'm still waiting for clarification of your comments. Are any forthcoming?

 

[r1derbike]

People work on their triggers to get a buttery smooth and light pull. In an emergency situation any factory trigger will suffice. All my carry pistols are stock, like they came out of the factory. When I go to the range I practice at 7 yards and point shooting.

No carry sidearm of mine will ever have the trigger pull lightened from stock. That's Darwin award or jail time territory.

 

[Deanimator]

No carry sidearm of mine will ever have the trigger pull lightened from stock. That's Darwin award or jail time territory.

There's no way on earth my Glock 22 was going to retain its vile "New York trigger". Unlike the NYPD, I don't have a union lawyer and a bottomless pot of taxpayer money to use because I substitute a miserable trigger for basic marksmanship skill and good judgment.

I've never shot myself nor gone to jail with my Ghost 3.5lb trigger, nor do I expect to.

 

[r1derbike]

There's no way on earth my Glock 22 was going to retain its vile "New York trigger". Unlike the NYPD, I don't have a union lawyer and a bottomless pot of taxpayer money to use because I substitute a miserable trigger for basic marksmanship skill and good judgment.

I've never shot myself nor gone to jail with my Ghost 3.5lb trigger, nor do I expect to.

Well, we've both said our piece, haven't we! :sarcastic:

 

[apvbguy]

No carry sidearm of mine will ever have the trigger pull lightened from stock. That's Darwin award or jail time territory.

why is it darwinism or jail time?

 

[apvbguy]

There's no way on earth my Glock 22 was going to retain its vile "New York trigger". Unlike the NYPD, I don't have a union lawyer and a bottomless pot of taxpayer money to use because I substitute a miserable trigger for basic marksmanship skill and good judgment.

I've never shot myself nor gone to jail with my Ghost 3.5lb trigger, nor do I expect to.

you really sound clueless, the NYPD mandates 10+ llb trigger pull on their patrolmen's weapons.

 

[Deanimator]

you really sound clueless, the NYPD mandates 10+ llb trigger pull on their patrolmen's weapons.

It's pretty obvious that I replaced the NY trigger with a 3.5lb. Ghost connector. If anybody's "clueless" it's you.

 

[r1derbike]

why is it darwinism or jail time?

Light unsafe trigger, possible ND striking the owner.

Shoot a person in self-defense with a modified hair-trigger sidearm, the prosecution may have a field day explaining to the jurors that the defendant modified his already usable weapon into a killing machine like no other.

That's how it looks from here...just covering all the bases, no matter the subject.

There are those who may not have the skillset to manage a hair trigger, especially if they are under duress of attack.

An exception, that I've handled, are quality 1911s that come from the factory with the sweetest triggers I've ever pulled. There is no way a prosecutor could claim deadly modifications to those sidearms. Yes, I want one. A range toy.

If it matters, I carry half-and-half. IWB or OWB. The hidden hybrid holster carries the duty sized XDm IWB or OWB. It can be done, but getting behind the wheel lets you know it's there. Carried it all day today all over northwest Arkansas.

XD-S is carried OWB with a custom holster, IWB with a Nate Squared Pro holster. I forget it's there...a lot.

My XD-S .45 punishes my nearly 60 year old arthritic hands after a box or so of range ammo. No pain, no gain, I suppose? My XDm 9mm 4.5 is a pussycat compared to the XD-S. It just keeps eating ammo, and doesn't remind me about it.

 

[NavyLCDR]

I don't clean my self defense gun because I don't want the prosecution to use that to say that I was obsessed with guns and just itching to shoot someone. I also only carry with cowboy loads because I don't want the prosecution to claim that I was using super powerful man-killer rounds.

 

[r1derbike]

I don't clean my self defense gun because I don't want the prosecution to use that to say that I was obsessed with guns and just itching to shoot someone. I also only carry with cowboy loads because I don't want the prosecution to claim that I was using super powerful man-killer rounds.

I only use blanks in my sidearms so the prosecution can't make the case that I wanted harm to come to the attacker. I clean my gun often so the prosecutor won't use the, "you certainly do shoot a lot, I bet you could hit a human at 400 yards with all that practice"?

 

[Stengun]

Howdy,

It never ceases to amaze me how stupid conversations on gun fora are when it comes to the difference between combat accuracy and competition "bullseye" shooting.

Combat shooting is about placing EFFECTIVE hits on target, as much as necessary, to NEUTRALIZE the threat. What does "neutralize' mean? It means you have pumped enough lead into the bad guy to prevent him from doing anymore harm.

Talk to any true expert in this subject matter and they will tell you:

1) The handgun is a weak weapon to begin with.
2) Most handgun fights take place within 15 feet, and last no more than three seconds, and no more than three shot.
3) You have to be able to get shots off quickly, using your front sight only, and aim for center mass.

This drives the competition kind of shooters nuts. They think the ultimate goal of all shooting is to put rounds through the same hole in paper.

NO.

The goal is to make the EMT's job hard, or the coroner's job hard. If you are putting rounds in the same or close to the same hole, you are are not placing shots EFFECTIVELY.

The goal is to get as many shots into center mass as required to stop the bad buy.

Head shots? Cool, if possible.

Shots to the "electrical" or "hyraulics" system...yes, great.

Putting shots into the chest and stomach cavity as many as needed? Ideal. But put shots into the pelvis, and the guy is going DOWN. No question. Put four shots into the chest general area, and he is having a bad day. Don't stop shooting until he is down and not moving. Look for the hand so hang loosely, a sign he is dead or unconscience. Be ready to pump a couple more into the not not-moving bad guy if it looks like he is still squirming.

If you think that in a gun fight you will have time to get your sights aligned perfectly and squeeze off "perfect" shots, this will just get you dead, dead and ... dead.

The goal is to engage your threat with the front sight on target and squeeze off as many shots as required to neutralize the bad guy.

End of sermon.

WOW!!!!!

There's so much bad advice in the OP I'm not sure where to start nor do I have the time to explain.

Paul

P.S. Have you ever carried a gun for a living?

 

[apvbguy]

Howdy,



WOW!!!!!

There's so much bad advice in the OP I'm not sure where to start nor do I have the time to explain.

Paul

P.S. Have you ever carried a gun for a living?

you should keep shooting at static targets and making nice little groups, but don't even believe for a moment that NOT training for quick action, getting the gun into play and rounds into the target in less than a second or so is most foolish. 2 seconds in a gunfight is an eternity and all you target shootings are in for a big surprise, if you survive the encounter.

 

[apvbguy]

Light unsafe trigger, possible ND striking the owner.

bwahahaha. keep your finger off the bang swtich!

Shoot a person in self-defense with a modified hair-trigger sidearm, the prosecution may have a field day explaining to the jurors that the defendant modified his already usable weapon into a killing machine like no other.

any decent lawyer would have any prosecutor introducing that like of crap into lunch for the basement rats


[balance of nonsense snipped]

 

[r1derbike]

bwahahaha. keep your finger off the bang swtich!
any decent lawyer would have any prosecutor introducing that like of crap into lunch for the basement rats


[balance of nonsense snipped]

Tell those who need to know to keep their finger off the bang switch! While you're at it, perhaps you could spell "switch" properly, so they understand what you mean? You might include correct punctuation as well, so you don't look like a knuckle dragging primate.

Remaining part of my rebuttal snipped.

 

[NavyLCDR]

There are two things that I like to know about my defensive firearm and ammunition combination - where the consistent point of impact compared to my point of aim is, and what the maximum achievable accuracy is. The best way to determine those two things is through slow, deliberate shooting for accuracy. So if you want to call that a waste of time....go right ahead.

 

[Firefighterchen]

Some here draw and fire accurately faster than IDPA champions...better listen up...

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app

 

[Stengun]

Howdy apvbguy,

you should keep shooting at static targets and making nice little groups, but don't even believe for a moment that NOT training for quick action, getting the gun into play and rounds into the target in less than a second or so is most foolish. 2 seconds in a gunfight is an eternity and all you target shootings are in for a big surprise, if you survive the encounter.

Just out of idle curiosity.........

How many shootouts/gunfights have you survived?

How many times have you been shot at by someone trying to kill you?

How many times have you shot a gun at someone that was shooting back at you?

Unless your "score" on the above questions is significantly higher than mine, I'll pass on taking gunfighting/shootout advice from you and the OP.

Paul
Paul