What if someone grabs your firearm while you are Open Carrying?

[NavyLCDR]

You are correct but take it the other way around. No one suggested less situational awareness while CCing. I just think it behooves one to have greater situational awareness OCing because of unique situations that are presented while carrying in that manor.

I fail to see how you can have it both ways. If you are suggesting more situational awareness while open carrying than concealed carrying, then you MUST also be suggesting less situational awareness when carrying concealed than if open carrying. Most of us who mix open carry and concealed carry are just as aware whether we are concealing or carrying openly and even when not carrying at all, such as at a school event for our children - at least I am, and most of those I have talked to are as well.

 

[Firefighterchen]

I fail to see how you can have it both ways. If you are suggesting more situational awareness while open carrying than concealed carrying, then you MUST also be suggesting less situational awareness when carrying concealed than if open carrying. Most of us who mix open carry and concealed carry are just as aware whether we are concealing or carrying openly and even when not carrying at all, such as at a school event for our children - at least I am, and most of those I have talked to are as well.

That's exactly what I'm saying. Thank you for answering it so well.

By saying open carrying you need greater sa, greater than what? Greater than when concealed carrying? A > B can not also be A = B or A < B at the same time.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app

 

[MyFred]

Your SA should always be the best it can be....OC....CC or NOC....always be prepared

 

[whodat2710]

Originally Posted by CapGun
You are correct but take it the other way around. No one suggested less situational awareness while CCing. I just think it behooves one to have greater situational awareness OCing because of unique situations that are presented while carrying in that manor.

I fail to see how you can have it both ways. If you are suggesting more situational awareness while open carrying than concealed carrying, then you MUST also be suggesting less situational awareness when carrying concealed than if open carrying. Most of us who mix open carry and concealed carry are just as aware whether we are concealing or carrying openly and even when not carrying at all, such as at a school event for our children - at least I am, and most of those I have talked to are as well.

In his defense, (though I think SA should be continuous, carrying or not), there are unique circumstances to be aware of. If my CC happens to be pocket carry, or appendix, or even deep concealed IWB, I might not have a gun grab as my primary concern when evaluating any given situation. does that mean I need to be less aware? hell no, just aware of different things. For example, when CC'ing I will pay a little more attention to things a little farther away from me, since my draw will be slower than OC.
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I guess I am agreeing with you both, but I do that with the perception that he just misspoke with good intentions.

 

[mappow]

What would you do? Im curious to know what can be done, and your thoughts.

Depends...............Within those few tenths of seconds, that's of course because you haven't been diligent of your surroundings. You connect hand to hand. Hand to throat, hand to nose and or fingers to eyes. You're not restricted to defense. But you dam well better commit cause it never should have gotten this far.

 

[SirTapparuni]

What are some ways you can improve your SA?

sent from a Samsung Galaxy S4

 

[Firefighterchen]

What are some ways you can improve your SA?

sent from a Samsung Galaxy S4

Preparation. Most of the time I've been to a place that I'm going to again. I think beforehand where I want to try and park, what side of the street I want to walk on, etc. Being prepared makes keeping your sa higher easier, without increasing the stress.

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[wolf_fire]

I don't understand why it should be considered okay to have less situational awareness when concealed carrying then with carrying openly. Seems very irresponsible if you carry concealed with situational awareness not being at it's best.

There was a time when my wife dragged me along to a trip to *gasp* NY state. I had to leave my hardware behind. My situational awareness was even more heightened since I knew if something happened, my only recourse would be to either fight unarmed or flee.

 

[CapGun]

I fail to see how you can have it both ways. If you are suggesting more situational awareness while open carrying than concealed carrying, then you MUST also be suggesting less situational awareness when carrying concealed than if open carrying. Most of us who mix open carry and concealed carry are just as aware whether we are concealing or carrying openly and even when not carrying at all, such as at a school event for our children - at least I am, and most of those I have talked to are as well.

That would be disjointed thinking if you actually believe one thing that you MUST believe the opposite of that thought. I must be stupid since as you put it I am suggesting less situational awareness. Who or what rational person would suggest that?! I am suggesting the requisite situational awareness when open carrying. This might not fit your thought process that everything must be couched in equal but OPPOSITE postulates;
Is carrying concealed vs open carry the exact same thing? By your comment we would have to accept that premise. I don't think even you or Chen would try to make that point.
Go back and read what I said. You will see that I said "open carry" presents it's own or different concerns, situations. If you don't believe that please state that case.
When carrying concealed there is at least one less (and there are more, pick and choose what you want) consideration you need to be more aware of then when open carrying.
It is not axiomatic that if one states you need more or a higher degree of situational awareness when open carrying that you are advocating less situational when you are carrying concealed. By that thought process I must hate chocolate ice cream because I say I like vanilla best.
Make the point in a cogent manner that I "'MUST be suggesting less situational awareness when carrying concealed"! You said that you do both, open and conceal carry.
To prove that what I said means I must be suggesting less situational awareness by explaining that open carry is the same as concealed carry and that you make no different provisions for carrying either way with the exception of what you do differently to conceal your weapon. Yes Chen this goes for you also.

 

[CapGun]

That's exactly what I'm saying. Thank you for answering it so well.

By saying open carrying you need greater sa, greater than what? Greater than when concealed carrying? A > B can not also be A = B or A < B at the same time.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app

Really Chen? You must have missed my post previously where I responded to you with your quote where I said this>>>>>>

You are correct but take it the other way around. No one suggested less situational awareness while CCing. I just think it behooves one to have greater situational awareness OCing because of unique situations that are presented while carrying in that manor.

Please tell me how there are no differences between OC and CC.

 

[CapGun]

In his defense, (though I think SA should be continuous, carrying or not), there are unique circumstances to be aware of. If my CC happens to be pocket carry, or appendix, or even deep concealed IWB, I might not have a gun grab as my primary concern when evaluating any given situation. does that mean I need to be less aware? hell no, just aware of different things. For example, when CC'ing I will pay a little more attention to things a little farther away from me, since my draw will be slower than OC.
-
I guess I am agreeing with you both, but I do that with the perception that he just misspoke with good intentions.

Thanks but I didn't misspeak. Please read my posts just above. Your thought process is correct when comparing OC to CC. You acknowledge a difference between the two modes of carry. You have determined that adjustments are viable. It's just that NavyLCDR and Chen are having trouble understanding what I said because they are stuck on trying to defend their reasoning that one thing must mean the opposite is true. Not so if you look at the whole picture.

 

[Firefighterchen]

Thanks but I didn't misspeak. Please read my posts just above. Your thought process is correct when comparing OC to CC. You acknowledge a difference between the two modes of carry. You have determined that adjustments are viable. It's just that NavyLCDR and Chen are having trouble understanding what I said because they are stuck on trying to defend their reasoning that one thing must mean the opposite is true. Not so if you look at the whole picture.

I think I understand what your saying. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Open carriers have a unique consideration of a gun grab that concealed carriers don't, hence why greater awareness for that aspect.

Concealed carrying has a unique consideration of keeping the firearm concealed that open carrying doesn't have, hence why greater awareness for keeping it covered.

While I don't completely agree...ie that a gun grab is not a possibility for concealed carriers, or that open carriers don't need to be aware that their firearm isn't covered...I may be understanding what you are saying better.

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[Chris Rakes]

i have carried for over 30 years, and never had anyone try a GG on me. i have had a couple of kids want to touch it. i don't know if there are any GG in the record, wouldn't doubt if it hasn't happened. though i have never heard of a successful one. i have heard several challenges, proven there has been one.

as SA goes i don't let anyone stand behind me. even if i am in a line, i turn sideways to keep people in sight

 

[FTG-05]

Outlaw has pretty much covered everything about open carrying. But the main things to remember about open carrying is: To be aware of your surroundings and others at all times. Second you should never open carry with out a plan of physically recovering your weapon in the event somone grabs at your firearm,if you can't physically protect it don't flaunt it. And last but not least always have a good reason for carrying your firearm in the open, law enforcement frowns on people who open carry just because they want to.

Excuse me? According to you, I now have to have a "good reason" to enjoy my 2nd amendment rights? Based on what justification?

And what does "law enforcement frowns" on people who open carry mean? Does that mean it's illegal to enjoy my 2nd amendment rights - unless of course - I have a "good reason". If it's legal, why do they "frown" on it? What happens when a law enforcement officer "frowns" on someone enjoying their 2nd amendment rights? Do they get shot, arrested, thrown in jail, what?

Please explain this - no offense - nonsensical drivel.

 

[thru]

the ccw'd knife is a LOT lower than just using natural weapons, unless your hand is ON an fixed blade. anyone with some training can throw 8 punches per second. your ccw knife draw is no faster than your ccw gun draw, ie, 1/2 second or slower.

 

[CapGun]

I think I understand what your saying. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Open carriers have a unique consideration of a gun grab that concealed carriers don't, hence why greater awareness for that aspect.

Concealed carrying has a unique consideration of keeping the firearm concealed that open carrying doesn't have, hence why greater awareness for keeping it covered.

While I don't completely agree...ie that a gun grab is not a possibility for concealed carriers, or that open carriers don't need to be aware that their firearm isn't covered...I may be understanding what you are saying better.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app

You almost have it. Actually you do have it correct but you screw things up by adding stuff that we are not talking about or things that seem obvious.
Nowhere did I say that CCing eliminates a gun grab. You print then someone might be thinking gun grab. You let your situational awareness down and end up in a physical altercation while CCing then a gun grab is possible.
Even while OCing a gun grab is not likely but more possible then when CCing. We were, or I was not discussing all possibilities just what situation was more likely. Hence different situational awareness for.... are you ready? Different situations!
You get it. Just stop adding stuff. If you want to say that a gun grab is possible due to printing and/or a physical altercation that's fine but that isn't what the topic was that I was commenting on.
BTW situational awareness works best when you trust your own gut instinct and do not second guess yourself. For instance, maybe you should cross to the other side of the street instead of saying "nah, what could happen broad daylight". If you get that strange feeling do not ignore it. Works for any scenario you come up with, not just my example.

 

[Firefighterchen]

You almost have it. Actually you do have it correct but you screw things up by adding stuff that we are not talking about or things that seem obvious.
Nowhere did I say that CCing eliminates a gun grab. You print then someone might be thinking gun grab. You let your situational awareness down and end up in a physical altercation while CCing then a gun grab is possible.
Even while OCing a gun grab is not likely but more possible then when CCing. We were, or I was not discussing all possibilities just what situation was more likely. Hence different situational awareness for.... are you ready? Different situations!
You get it. Just stop adding stuff. If you want to say that a gun grab is possible due to printing and/or a physical altercation that's fine but that isn't what the topic was that I was commenting on.
BTW situational awareness works best when you trust your own gut instinct and do not second guess yourself. For instance, maybe you should cross to the other side of the street instead of saying "nah, what could happen broad daylight". If you get that strange feeling do not ignore it. Works for any scenario you come up with, not just my example.

You never said, "a gun grab wasn't possible"...but you did say it's a "unique situation" for open carry. Do you see how I came to that conclusion? How can it be possible for cc, if it's unique to oc. Maybe we define unique differently.

We will have to agree to disagree on the possibility being greater, as I've read gun grab stories about both methods, and they are quite rare on both fronts. But...If I were to say which has a higher theoretical possibility, I would have to see which method gets chosen more as intended victims. Since more concealed carriers use their firearm in self defense, the possibility has to be higher when cc'ing.

Imo, S.A. shouldn't change due to different situations. If S.A. is at its best, all information being processed is important, not just specific aspects. I suppose you can say my definition of S.A. is broad, instead of situational or aspect specific.

When you feel we aren't looking at the big picture, or we are just defining it to fit our views, you have to know those thoughts and feelings are reciprocated. No ill intent though, just trying to be honest.

In the end, to each their own.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app

 

[50SR9]

Outlaw has pretty much covered everything about open carrying. But the main things to remember about open carrying is: To be aware of your surroundings and others at all times. Second you should never open carry with out a plan of physically recovering your weapon in the event somone grabs at your firearm,if you can't physically protect it don't flaunt it. And last but not least always have a good reason for carrying your firearm in the open, law enforcement frowns on people who open carry just because they want to.

Law enforcement frowns on people who open carry just because they want to? HUH? I open carry because I want to. I have had nothing but supportive and favorable reactions from all.....law enforcement included. Pass on the next hit dude.

 

[mmcglone]

In Ohio, if I'm wrong, someone please correct me, if someone tries to take your firearm he means to hurt or kill you. Now your life is in danger and you have the right to use deadly force to prevent your firearm form being taken.

I OC and CC a 1911 using an IWB holster which keeps my firearm tight against my hip. Takes a good pull to remove my firearm. It's all back to knowing your surroundings and awareness.

 

[BC1]

Never met a ghetto-rat scumbag that was afraid of a gun. Have seen plenty of them dare an armed person to shoot them. How many have grabbed for the gun of the LEO arresting them? Never say never. Never say can't. Never say won't.