God & the Bible, squaring belief with reality

[Shoobee]

Ringo, you mentioned several states have made gay marriage legal. The truth is when it's voted on by we the people it's not supported. Correct me if I'm wrong but we the people have not supported gay marriage in any state. It's the states politicians and the courts that have over ruled the will of the people.

Furh don't pay him no never mind. I doubt he has researched anything in his life.

 

[Shoobee]

Have We Crossed The Line? - By Grant Phillips

The President of the United States has made it official. He is in full support of marriage between same sex couples. The Vice-President first presented his support which nudged the President to make his support known now, instead of later at the Democratic convention. Poor VP, his jaws have no hinges.

Several States now support same sex marriage, as do many governors and past governors. Most of the Democratic leadership and some even among the Republican leadership also openly support same sex marriage.

Nearly all Hollywood celebrities, producers, directors, etc. support same sex marriage. Many in the music field have made their support public. Even among religious organizations, same sex marriage is supported and promoted.

Now that the one voice who speaks for all Americans has made his support known publicly, have we crossed the line with God? I personally believe we crossed the proverbial line years ago, but if not, we certainly have now. In my opinion, we are way beyond the line, headed toward destruction. There is no turning back.

I know what you’re thinking. Does not God say?

“If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.” (2 Chronicles 7:14)

Yes, that is what He promises, and He also says the following:

“So I gave them up unto their own hearts' lust: and they walked in their own counsels.” (Psalms 81:12)

“24Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 25Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. 26For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was meet.” (Romans 1:24-27)

Folks, it is my opinion that God has given us up to our own vile affections and there is nothing left to look forward to now, as a country, but judgment.

Yes it is true that every true Christian will soon be called up to meet the Lord in the air along with all those true Christians who have already physically died, but where does that leave everyone else? We call our “calling up to be with Jesus” the Rapture, but what follows, is a time of hell on earth unlike any time in history, a time so terrible that if it isn’t shortened by Jesus Himself, and it will be, there would be no flesh left alive upon the earth. That time is just around the corner.

How a man can stand before the nation and publicly support something so vile and yet claim to be a Christian, is the epitome of narcissism and spiritual ignorance. If this isn’t “thumbing ones nose” at God, then tell me what is.

The Lord God tells us exactly where we have gone wrong as a nation. Listen to these words.

“20Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! 21Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!” (Isaiah 5:20-21)

This, my friends, is the attitude coming from the highest pinnacle of our government and from many of its rank and file citizenry. This pompous Christ rejecting attitude is not going unnoticed by God Almighty. We may think it is, but following will be the bitter pill we will be forced to swallow.

“Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and the flame consumeth the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have cast away the law of the LORD of hosts, and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.” (Isaiah 5:24)

Oh I can hear it now, “but He’s talking to Israel, not us.” If anyone thinks for one miniscule of a second that we can get by with our rebellion against God, when the apple of His eye (Israel) could not, then you are in for a very rude awakening. It is commonly known as the time of Tribulation upon earth. It will last for seven years, and it will be arriving soon.

All throughout history God has never put up with homosexual activity. Every time it shows up, a nation falls, and we are going to fall. You can count on it. It is happening as we speak.


Let us not forget this verse.

“For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature [emphasis mine]:” (Romans 1:26)

Is it possible from the Word of God, for the judgment coming to at least be delayed? Yes, we see it over and over with Israel. They fell to sin. They were judged. They repented. They were restored. Then the cycle repeated itself.

Will judgment be at least delayed for this corrupt earth, and for our country? No, for two reasons, (1) we will not repent, and (2) because time has run out. God has already set in motion those things which must be for His soon, very soon, return. He will not delay His coming. When that last person is born again from above, Jesus Christ will come for His Church, and judgment will begin.

Those engaged in these depraved acts against God and even nature itself, do not want to repent and will not do so. They love their sins, and those very sins are piling up judgment upon one and all. Others who may not participate but yet openly support homosexuality are just as guilty. Yet there are many who neither participate nor openly support this degradation, but by their silence, their support is noted by God.

Let us not forget this verse.

“For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature [emphasis mine]:” (Romans 1:26)

Is it possible from the Word of God, for the judgment coming to at least be delayed? Yes, we see it over and over with Israel. They fell to sin. They were judged. They repented. They were restored. Then the cycle repeated itself.

Will judgment be at least delayed for this corrupt earth, and for our country? No, for two reasons, (1) we will not repent, and (2) because time has run out. God has already set in motion those things which must be for His soon, very soon, return. He will not delay His coming. When that last person is born again from above, Jesus Christ will come for His Church, and judgment will begin.

Those engaged in these depraved acts against God and even nature itself, do not want to repent and will not do so. They love their sins, and those very sins are piling up judgment upon one and all. Others who may not participate but yet openly support homosexuality are just as guilty. Yet there are many who neither participate nor openly support this degradation, but by their silence, their support is noted by God.

Have we crossed the line? It is my belief that we have crossed the line, and there is no turning back from God’s judgment, simply because we will not choose to repent.

Fanatic.

Illiterate misinformed brainwashed fundamentalist protestant fanatic.

 

[Shoobee]

according to this article fewer than 5% of people identify themselves as gay or lesbian. being gay isnt "normal" in that the vast majority of people are hetero. and strangely enough it happens in nature just as frequently... and animals didnt get the idea to be gay from watching mtv. but what happens to gay animals in nature? they die out and dont produce offspring. its natural...just not normal.

i swear, people act like they are reproducing and taking over the world. the difference is that its "socially acceptable" to be out of the closet.

The Bible says a lot of things. Menstruation makes women unclean to worship. And sitting on the same couch that a menstruating woman sat on would make you unclean to worship. And after the period she would have to offer a burnt and sin offering just to be clean again. Sodom and Gomorrah were also cities of debauchery and rape. They were destroyed because there was no law. No appreciation or sanctity of human life. Im sure they killed babies there too. Frankly i think its worse to rape someone than be a homosexual.

But hey, sin is sin right? and we are all sinners.

You may be right about the 5% going public, but that just means another 5% are in the closet.

As far as I can surmise, homosexuality has always existed and it has always run about 10% in all societies.

 

[Ringo]

Fanatic.

Illiterate misinformed brainwashed fundamentalist protestant fanatic.

Truth is like a rock thrown into a pack of rabid dogs, the one it hits barks the loudest.

 

[Shoobee]

Truth is like a rock thrown into a pack of rabid dogs, the one it hits barks the loudest.

So is illiteracy.

So is ignorance.

So is hell fire and dammnation preaching by protestant ministers seeking to up their collections.

 

[Ringo]

So is illiteracy.

So is ignorance.

So is hell fire and dammnation preaching by protestant ministers seeking to up their collections.

When I said that your Biblical knowledge was quite limited, I was being kind. Your statement of illiteracy and ignorance is a projection of your own lack of knowledge and inability to discern Biblical scripture. I'm not a Protestant minister and I don't seek any collection, but because you mention hell here's a freebee of truth to help you foam at the mouth.


Hell - By Grant Phillips

This is not a subject we delight in talking about, but in order to speak the truth, we must tell the whole truth, not just part of it. If we only tell part of the truth, then is it really the truth? No, it is not. Unfortunately, the subject of hell is ignored in most churches today. Rarely, does one hear it mentioned in the pulpits of America. Fifty years ago and earlier it was often preached upon. Twenty-five years ago, not so much. Today, not only is it rarely mentioned, but many are saying that there is no hell. Well, is there or isn’t there, and if there is, what is it like?

I realize that the Hebrew term “sheol” usually refers to the grave or death and not always specifically to hell. However, the Greek term “hades” usually refers to hell as a place of torment (Luke 10:15; 16:23) and the Greek term “gehenna” always refers to hell as a place of torment (Matthew 5:30; 23:33). In Revelation 20:14-15 the Apostle John writes of the “lake of fire,” where those who rejected Jesus Christ will be sent after the resurrection.

On the brighter side, are places mentioned in the Bible for those who put their faith in Jesus Christ while upon this earth. “Abraham’s bosom” (Luke 16:22) was a place of rest for believers prior to the cross. The thief on the cross who put his trust in Jesus went to “paradise,” after his death. The Apostle Paul mentions being “with the Lord” in Philippians 1:23; 1 Thessalonians 4:17 and 2 Corinthians 5:8 which is where all believers go after death. Then there is the “new heaven and new earth” of Revelation 21:1-4, where all believers will be after the resurrection.

Hell is a real place and everyone will go to either heaven or hell after physical death and exist forever. (Daniel 12:2; Matthew 25:46; John 5:28-29; Revelation 20:14-15) What determines our final eternal destination? The determining factor is whether or not we have put our trust in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (John 3:16, 36)

The Bible makes it clear that hell was originally prepared for Satan and his angelic followers. (Matthew 25:41; Revelation 20:10)

Some people believe that there just might be a hell, but if there is, they will get a second chance. To the contrary, hell is eternal and irreversible. Once there, there is no going back, or second chance. (Revelation 14:11; 20:14-15) Also, the next event following death is not a second chance but judgment (Hebrews 9:27).

Others think that there will be no suffering, but only a separation from God. However, Matthew 13:50; Mark 9:48 and Revelation 14:10 speak of conscious torment.

I’ve heard some say that mankind just dies like an animal. They’re dead and there is no further existence. However, this argument denies the resurrection of the lost and conscious torment mentioned above.

The popular belief today seems to be universalism, the belief that all mankind are children of God and all will be saved in the end. This belief is totally contrary to the Word of God. First of all, God is the Creator of all mankind, but He is not the Father of all mankind. He is only the Father of those who come to Him through faith in His Son Jesus Christ, denying all else and depending only upon Him.

Are there degrees of torment in hell? Yes, the Bible makes this clear. Jesus said in Luke 10:10-12, “But into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you not, go your ways out into the streets of the same, and say, Even the very dust of your city, which cleaveth on us, we do wipe off against you: notwithstanding be ye sure of this, that the kingdom of God is come nigh unto you. But I say unto you, that it shall be more tolerable in that day for Sodom, than for that city. Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works had been done in Tyre and Sidon, which have been done in you, they had a great while ago repented, sitting in sackcloth and ashes. But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you. And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell.” (Luke 10:10-15) He also said, “And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.” (Revelation 20:13)

The main objections I hear to the reality of hell are that (1) God is love and would not send anyone to hell, (2) it would not be fair and (3) the punishment is too severe for the crime.

1- It is true that God is love. It is also true that because of His love, He rescues those who seek Him through His Son Jesus.

2- I don’t believe being fair has anything to do with it. If God were fair, He would send us all to hell.

3- I also do not believe that hell is as much a “punishment” for sin, as it is a “result” of sin. In other words, it is not punishment in the sense of “penance,” but punishment in the sense of “penalty or consequence.”

I have already stated that hell was originally created for Satan and his followers. His followers consist of those angels who followed Satan in rebellion against God, and also those of mankind who choose Satan over God by denying His Son Jesus. This is rebellion against God. Hell is real, and those who die without Christ will spend eternity in torment because they choose this destination. To not choose Jesus Christ as the only way to the Father, is to choose hell. “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” (John 14:6)

God is holy. Sin is rebellion against God. Therefore sin is the antithesis of holiness. Sin and God cannot co-exist. Sin deserves hell. We are born in sin. Therefore, we deserve hell. What could God do to make it possible for sinful man to live in His presence? He had to make man holy too, by removing all his sin. How? By the sacrifice of His own Son, Jesus, all who come to the Father through His Son, will be made holy. (2 Corinthians 5:21) There is no other way. All who do not come to Him through His Son remain in their sin and cannot be in God’s presence. Those who refuse His Son choose to remain in their sin and choose hell as their eternal destiny. No one can live in God’s presence unless they are compatible. Only He can make us compatible. If we refuse His offer, we choose the alternative by default.

God created hell and all its torments for Satan and his followers, but why such a horrible place? Why couldn’t He just completely eliminate their existence, instead of their suffering the torments of hell for eternity? I do not know the answer to either of those questions, but it does convince me of the holiness of God and the seriousness of sin. There are many things we simply do not and cannot understand on this side of the grave. The reality of hell is one.

The important thing to remember is that it was important enough to God for Him to make the ultimate sacrifice in offering the only way of escape for those who will choose it. He gave Himself as a sacrifice in our place to satisfy His own justice. If there is no hell or if it is not as bad as the Bible clearly says, then why would God go to that extreme, to offer the only way of escape, to those who will accept it?

Some folks will be very angry over this article, and that is exactly where Satan wants you to be. A few have contacted me in the past with hostility leaping from the page because they won’t accept the truth. Don’t allow Satan to make a fool out of you, by your not realizing the truth until it is too late. For some reason, Satan wants to take as many with him as possible. Why? It is partly because the Devil competes (in his mind) against Almighty God. His concern for mankind is the opposite of 2 Peter 3:9, “… not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.” My prayer is that many will see the truth of this horrible place and come to Jesus now before it is too late.

 

[Shoobee]

When I said that your Biblical knowledge was quite limited, I was being kind. Your statement of illiteracy and ignorance is a projection of your own lack of knowledge and inability to discern Biblical scripture. I'm not a Protestant minister and I don't seek any collection, ...

You sure sound like a protestant minister and you seem to think like one.

Let me give you some clues --

- the Old Testament / Hebrew Bible was begun by Moses circa 1400 BC, it does not go all the way back to the creation nor to the times before 1400 BC.

- anything in the O/T preceeding 1400 BC were "visions" shown to Moses on Mt Sinai, in case your reading comprehension skills are so weak that they did not get that part.

- the New Testament / Greek Bible "books" were parchment scrolls written around 60 AD, principally by St Paul, although once Paul starting writing things down, the other apostles and evangelists seeming out of a need to do the same started writing their stories as well, starting with St Mark, who is St Peter's son in law, Peter's wife's son by a former marriage, or else out of wedlock.

- ergo the timespan of the Bible is from 1400 BC to about 90 AD, the last author having been St John, who thus is portrayed as a very young apostle in most Medieval art, the apostle whom Jesus "loved."

I know you probably think "God" himself/(itself) reached down from heaven and wrote the Bible with his own hand, in English. But it did not work that way.

 

[PestControl02]

wow guys, this is supposed to be a solution oriented thread...like how can we come together and start fixing things.

That maybe we can look past certain differences, find commonality and make improvements in our own lives that will reflect positively on the current reality.

 

[Treo]

I gave it a lot of thought before responding to this thread because I knew it was going to draw mockers.

I don’t know if anyone is familiar with the book “In His Steps” but it’s the book that started the whole “What Would Jesus Do?” craze. The story line is that a church in Kansas (?) decides to ask themselves before taking any action “What Would Jesus Do?” The result is predictable and they create a little slice of Heaven on Earth.

My problem with that is that I don’t think it was ever God’s intent that we actually build God’s kingdom on Earth. IMO the Bible makes it clear that God’s intent from the beginning was for this Heaven and Earth to pass away and be replaced by a new Heaven and a new Earth.

Let me draw a parallel, the Bible says that if believers lay hands on the sick the sick will recover and I believe that’s true but the Bible also states that it is appointed unto each man once to die and after that face judgment. So, there comes a time in every life when every believer in the world could lay hands on you and you aren’t going to recover.

Similarly, the Bible says that we should pray for our leaders because God placed all of them (including Obama) in their position over us. We should also pray for our nation and for revival but the Bible also says that there’s going to come a day when God raises his hand and says “Enough” and judgment is going to begin. I believe that is what we are seeing now.

The Bible states that as we draw near to the end people will become not only more sinful but more openly sinful. They’ll embrace their sin and revel in it and they’ll become more evil and more brutal towards each other and that they’ll have no love in their heart. I believe we are also seeing this now.

There are people out there feeding the hungry, healing the sick and carrying the Gospel to all the peoples of the Earth but even though they (we) are called to stand against the tide they (we) were never intended to turn the tide. Judgment is coming and it is going to begin in the house of the Lord.

Having said all that, I also believe that all Christians (and reading the Bible doesn’t make you a Christian any more than reading a McDonald’s menu makes you a Big Mac) are called to be a part of local body, to worship together and to sit under the teaching of a Pastor. I could read (or to say it differently) I have read the Bible cover to cover multiple times and there are things in there that I will never understand unless a Godly man expounds it to me. The Bible says that God called some to be teachers and that tells me that we need to be taught.

 

[Treo]

Fanatic.

Illiterate misinformed brainwashed fundamentalist protestant fanatic.

I'm not illiterate or misinformed but I am brain washed (in the Word) and will gladly claim the title of fanatic

 

[PestControl02]

I gave it a lot of thought before responding to this thread because I knew it was going to draw mockers.

I don’t know if anyone is familiar with the book “In His Steps” but it’s the book that started the whole “What Would Jesus Do?” craze. The story line is that a church in Kansas (?) decides to ask themselves before taking any action “What Would Jesus Do?” The result is predictable and they create a little slice of Heaven on Earth.

My problem with that is that I don’t think it was ever God’s intent that we actually build God’s kingdom on Earth. IMO the Bible makes it clear that God’s intent from the beginning was for this Heaven and Earth to pass away and be replaced by a new Heaven and a new Earth.

Let me draw a parallel, the Bible says that if believers lay hands on the sick the sick will recover and I believe that’s true but the Bible also states that it is appointed unto each man once to die and after that face judgment. So, there comes a time in every life when every believer in the world could lay hands on you and you aren’t going to recover.

Similarly, the Bible says that we should pray for our leaders because God placed all of them (including Obama) in their position over us. We should also pray for our nation and for revival but the Bible also says that there’s going to come a day when God raises his hand and says “Enough” and judgment is going to begin. I believe that is what we are seeing now.

The Bible states that as we draw near to the end people will become not only more sinful but more openly sinful. They’ll embrace their sin and revel in it and they’ll become more evil and more brutal towards each other and that they’ll have no love in their heart. I believe we are also seeing this now.

There are people out there feeding the hungry, healing the sick and carrying the Gospel to all the peoples of the Earth but even though they (we) are called to stand against the tide they (we) were never intended to turn the tide. Judgment is coming and it is going to begin in the house of the Lord.

Having said all that, I also believe that all Christians (and reading the Bible doesn’t make you a Christian any more than reading a McDonald’s menu makes you a Big Mac) are called to be a part of local body, to worship together and to sit under the teaching of a Pastor. I could read (or to say it differently) I have read the Bible cover to cover multiple times and there are things in there that I will never understand unless a Godly man expounds it to me. The Bible says that God called some to be teachers and that tells me that we need to be taught.

excellent, thank you for your comment.

 

[Oldgrunt]

I'm not illiterate or misinformed but I am brain washed (in the Word) and will gladly claim the title of fanatic

Treo: I once heard that a fanatic is someone who loves the Lord more than the one he is talking to. I like the term fanatic and am happy to be so classified.

 

[The_Outlaw]

My momma always said "Never discuss Religion or Politics"....And she said this for good reasons.

With that said,
I used to be an Athiest until one terrifying night in 1994.
I should have died in that incident, but the very same Jesus Christ that I shunned for many years was there to save my life on that night.

That incident made me want to seek Him and His truth.
So I ended up reading the entire New Testament and eventually I accepted Him as my Lord & Saviour.

He did not come into this world to condemn us, He came to 'save' us.

Each and every one of us must 'freely choose' to seek the truth with an open heart and an open mind and then the truth will eventually reveal itself to each of us if we are in the right frame of mind and spirit.

 

[Shoobee]

I gave it a lot of thought before responding to this thread because I knew it was going to draw mockers.

I don’t know if anyone is familiar with the book “In His Steps” but it’s the book that started the whole “What Would Jesus Do?” craze. The story line is that a church in Kansas (?) decides to ask themselves before taking any action “What Would Jesus Do?” The result is predictable and they create a little slice of Heaven on Earth.

My problem with that is that I don’t think it was ever God’s intent that we actually build God’s kingdom on Earth. IMO the Bible makes it clear that God’s intent from the beginning was for this Heaven and Earth to pass away and be replaced by a new Heaven and a new Earth.

Let me draw a parallel, the Bible says that if believers lay hands on the sick the sick will recover and I believe that’s true but the Bible also states that it is appointed unto each man once to die and after that face judgment. So, there comes a time in every life when every believer in the world could lay hands on you and you aren’t going to recover.

Similarly, the Bible says that we should pray for our leaders because God placed all of them (including Obama) in their position over us. We should also pray for our nation and for revival but the Bible also says that there’s going to come a day when God raises his hand and says “Enough” and judgment is going to begin. I believe that is what we are seeing now.

The Bible states that as we draw near to the end people will become not only more sinful but more openly sinful. They’ll embrace their sin and revel in it and they’ll become more evil and more brutal towards each other and that they’ll have no love in their heart. I believe we are also seeing this now.

There are people out there feeding the hungry, healing the sick and carrying the Gospel to all the peoples of the Earth but even though they (we) are called to stand against the tide they (we) were never intended to turn the tide. Judgment is coming and it is going to begin in the house of the Lord.

Having said all that, I also believe that all Christians (and reading the Bible doesn’t make you a Christian any more than reading a McDonald’s menu makes you a Big Mac) are called to be a part of local body, to worship together and to sit under the teaching of a Pastor. I could read (or to say it differently) I have read the Bible cover to cover multiple times and there are things in there that I will never understand unless a Godly man expounds it to me. The Bible says that God called some to be teachers and that tells me that we need to be taught.

Moses as you no doubt read is the great prophet and explainer of the Hebrew Bible / "Old Testament".

Just as St. Paul (his literary name) is the same thing for the Greek Bible / "New Testament."

The both each suggest that they were each minding their own business one day, Moses tending sheep, and Paul/Saul travelling between towns, when they saw a light and heard a voice. The voice enticed them to act on behalf of the voice.

In Hebrew the voice is called The Powers or The Judges or The Rulers. In Greek the voice is called Jesus Christ (in English) which in Greek is IESOUS HRISTOS which means the annointed savior. We get stuck in the English language using the term "god" with is a Germanic word for the Greek word THEOS which means an immortal deity.

It is suggested by each of these ancient narratives, one dating to 1400 BC and the other to 60 AD, that this voice is indeed an immortal deity, and that there is a way to likewise become an immortal living soul oneself. Moses and St. Paul were each invited to serve as a medium for that deity, and thus it would seem that "God" did/does intend that the "Kingdom of God" be established here "on the Earth" to accomplish that major task.

Anciently the Israelites (descendants of the Babylonians) were selected to be that "chosen people," which then was expanded to include all peoples of the Earth who would "confess Jesus" and go through baptism and live their lives a certain way. Today's Jews are the remnant of those ancient Israelites, and there are numerous peoples around the world who have inherited or found "Christianity."

The rules are pretty good, just numerous, and sometime counter-intuitive.

For Christians, it seems odd to be asked to forgive your enemies and even pray for their welfare. But Christianity exacts a high price in exchange for the gift of immortality.

For Jews, it seems odd to obey certain food rules, stay within your clan, and avoid the contaminations of the outside world. But with the outside world being so corrupt, it is not bad advice.

The Christians derive some of their rules and traditions from the Jews, but for the most part these two major religions are as different as East is east and West is west.

 

[Shoobee]

My momma always said "Never discuss Religion or Politics"....And she said this for good reasons.

With that said,
I used to be an Athiest until one terrifying night in 1994.
I should have died in that incident, but the very same Jesus Christ that I shunned for many years was there to save my life on that night.

That incident made me want to seek Him and His truth.
So I ended up reading the entire New Testament and eventually I accepted Him as my Lord & Saviour.

He did not come into this world to condemn us, He came to 'save' us.

Each and every one of us must 'freely choose' to seek the truth with an open heart and an open mind and then the truth will eventually reveal itself to each of us if we are in the right frame of mind and spirit.

I completely agree with you, and also had a similar experience, one day, while I was minding my own business, and death almost found me, or else it did find me, and I was spared that death, and was asked to do and say certain things for the benefit of those "other sheep" some of whom are deceived and deceivers who mine gullible Christians for their gold only.

 

[Shoobee]

Treo: I once heard that a fanatic is someone who loves the Lord more than the one he is talking to. I like the term fanatic and am happy to be so classified.

I think a fanatic is an idiot who alienates more people than he/she attracts to any fold.

Balance is the measure of all things. Balance in all things.

Oldgrunt I have enjoyed your discussions of the Catholic virtues. You know them better than I do. And you can describe them better than I can.

 

[Shoobee]

I'm not illiterate or misinformed but I am brain washed (in the Word) and will gladly claim the title of fanatic

We are all brainwashed one way or another, but that is different from fanatic.

Treo the main thing you have to remember is to protect your weapon and dont draw it out just to brandish it.

You have up until you draw it out to talk your way out of a mugging or attack.

But if the criminal mind gets close enough to you without your being able to dissuade them, then you need do draw and shoot without hesitation reflexively. A gun is not a plaything to flash around.

 

[eagleeyes]

how do you know it was jesus christ himself that saved you rather than just the extenuating circumstances that allowed you to live?
and why do you carry a gun if you think jesus is watching over your life?

 

[Treo]

and why do you carry a gun if you think jesus is watching over your life?

Armed self defense is compatible with Christianity. Do you think Jesus didn't know Peter was armed in the garden?

 

[Treo]

Null...

Shoob, I have even less interest in your take on Christianity than I do on your take on firearms and self defense.

Just thought I'd let you know.