Concealed Carry without a permit?

[creatism]

All I have to say is FELONY POSSESSION OF A CONCEALED FIRE ARM!
That's all I need to know, unless your a rapper or a celeb your gonna be doing hard time for that offense.

 

[Treo]

All I have to say is FELONY POSSESSION OF A CONCEALED FIRE ARM!
That's all I need to know, unless your a rapper or a celeb your gonna be doing hard time for that offense.

Are you sure it's felony? In Colorado it's a misdemeanor. Lets see a cite

 

[Black Dragon]

Are you sure it's felony? In Colorado it's a misdemeanor. Lets see a cite

I cited the law earlier in the thread that it is a felony to conceal carry in FL without a permit.

790.01 Carrying concealed weapons.—
(1) Except as provided in subsection (4), a person who carries a concealed weapon or electric weapon or device on or about his or her person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(2) A person who carries a concealed firearm on or about his or her person commits a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(3) This section does not apply to a person licensed to carry a concealed weapon or a concealed firearm pursuant to the provisions of s. 790.06.
(4) It is not a violation of this section for a person to carry for purposes of lawful self-defense, in a concealed manner:
(a) A self-defense chemical spray.
(b) A nonlethal stun gun or dart-firing stun gun or other nonlethal electric weapon or device that is designed solely for defensive purposes.
(5) This section does not preclude any prosecution for the use of an electric weapon or device, a dart-firing stun gun, or a self-defense chemical spray during the commission of any criminal offense under s. 790.07, s. 790.10, s. 790.23, or s. 790.235, or for any other criminal offense.

 

[Treo]

I cited the law earlier in the thread that it is a felony to conceal carry in FL without a permit.

Thanks pa, there's a lot of disinformation floating around out there and a lot of folks talking out their butt so I generally ask for the law

 

[Firefighterchen]

In the OP: Originally

So as you see the comments are based upon the reference to the Friend deciding to carry without a permit. Not a good idea anywhere.

Ah...well after rereading the OP from different viewpoints, and seeing the follow up post, I understand the "friend" does not have a permit at all. It is too bad that life is not the way his friend see's it...I don't blame him for wanting to be free.

 

[mappow]

A friend of mine in florida has decided its ok to carry concealed lately without a permit...as a permit holder (Colorado) I feel like hes asking for trouble. What advise can be given to this guy?

He's just another felon IMHO. Legal carry or illegal carry. There's no gray area.

 

[Black Dragon]

Thanks pa, there's a lot of disinformation floating around out there and a lot of folks talking out their butt so I generally ask for the law

Yeah it probably would have be easier to see if I quoted the law in my post instead of linking it.

 

[Treo]

He's just another felon IMHO. Legal carry or illegal carry. There's no gray area.

There is a lot of truth to that

 

[billwot]

Must be kept closed/secured depending on which state trooper you talk to.

LEOs are not attorneys. Your statement illustrates exactly why you should not seek legal advise from a LEO.

 

[ironmike86]

WRONG open carry is ILLEGAL in Flordia do not advise your friend to do so.

I know everyone is saying open carry is okay in Florida?? Anyone check? I ASSume you mean in the city ect?? Look it up Florida =
Concealed carry only; no open carry allowed, even with permit, except where cited by state law. Example, while hunting, fishing or camping, at an approved gun range etc. Consult Florida Law for more information.
This is why it's up to the individual to find what laws are correct. Never would I ask a forum I would look up State law. Then if I needed help to understand what was written. Maybe ask for help. JMO

 

[festus]

Where in the law does it say that it can't be in the same area as the registration? I'm not disagreeing with you, I just haven't found it in the law so if you can point me to it I would appreciate it.


It really doesn't matter what the trooper thinks, it's what the law states
790.25(3)(L)A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person’s manual possession;
Securely encased means:
790.001(17) “Securely encased” means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.



If he does have a CCW permit and doesn't have it on him then it's only a $25 administrative fee. I'm guessing that the admin fee is because ccw info doesn't come up when an officer checks your driver's license info and must do a separate check for ccw.

I talked extensively with a local trooper to get clarification. The states as you mentioned secured in a compartment and encased

It is the trooper who had said they don't want it in the same area as the registration due to the fact that the compartment may be left unsecured or fall open at that point and then they have to follow some protocols that they would just as soon not have to perform...

 

[festus]

Open carry is only OK in Florida while involved in hunting, fishing, or shooting sports or other type outdoor/sportsman type activities. There may be a few other minor deviations that are permissible, but this ain't Arizona or Alaska and I would not advise it.

 

[LkWd_Don]

Where in the law does it say that it can't be in the same area as the registration? I'm not disagreeing with you, I just haven't found it in the law so if you can point me to it I would appreciate it.

It really doesn't matter what the trooper thinks, it's what the law states
790.25(3)(L)A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person’s manual possession;
Securely encased means:
790.001(17) “Securely encased” means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.

If he does have a CCW permit and doesn't have it on him then it's only a $25 administrative fee. I'm guessing that the admin fee is because ccw info doesn't come up when an officer checks your driver's license info and must do a separate check for ccw.

I talked extensively with a local trooper to get clarification. The states as you mentioned secured in a compartment and encased

It is the trooper who had said they don't want it in the same area as the registration due to the fact that the compartment may be left unsecured or fall open at that point and then they have to follow some protocols that they would just as soon not have to perform...

Let's look at it with some common sense and think about a traffic stop.
A police Officer pulls you over for what ever reason, just for giggles we will say your left turn signal lights are inoperative and he is going to write you a Fix-It ticket, but of course you do not know this is the reason for him pulling you over, he gets up to your window and of course he is going to ask for your license, registration and if required in your state, your proof of insurance. So you pull your license out of your bill-fold and then reach to your glove-box to pull out your vehicle registration.. what does he observe? Your firearm laying on top of everything inside of the glove-box and you are reaching for it.. What do you think his first reaction is going to be?
Put it in a zippered case at least, for your own protection if for nothing else.

 

[Axeanda45]

The 2nd Amendment IS my carry permit.....

 

[Black Dragon]

I talked extensively with a local trooper to get clarification. The states as you mentioned secured in a compartment and encased

It is the trooper who had said they don't want it in the same area as the registration due to the fact that the compartment may be left unsecured or fall open at that point and then they have to follow some protocols that they would just as soon not have to perform...

I know I'm just splitting hairs with you at this point but the law doesn't say secured in a compartment AND encased. The semicolons are equivalent to the word “or”.

“Securely encased” means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked OR snapped in a holster OR in a gun case, whether or not locked OR in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.

If you have your pistol in the glovebox AND secured in a holster you are still with in the law if your glovebox were to fall open because your pistol is still securely encased in the holster.

I understand what the Trooper would like you to do and it's really up to you how you would want to proceed. Personally I wouldn't want the hassle of being removed from my vehicle because I put my weapon and registration in the same location so I always keep them separate.

Let's look at it with some common sense and think about a traffic stop.
A police Officer pulls you over for what ever reason, just for giggles we will say your left turn signal lights are inoperative and he is going to write you a Fix-It ticket, but of course you do not know this is the reason for him pulling you over, he gets up to your window and of course he is going to ask for your license, registration and if required in your state, your proof of insurance. So you pull your license out of your bill-fold and then reach to your glove-box to pull out your vehicle registration.. what does he observe? Your firearm laying on top of everything inside of the glove-box and you are reaching for it.. What do you think his first reaction is going to be?
Put it in a zippered case at least, for your own protection if for nothing else.

Yes lets use common sense.
In this case, knowing that you have a pistol in your glove box, you would not just open it and reach for your registration. You would say something like "Officer I have a CWP and have my weapon stored with my registration, how would you like to proceed?" Then do what the officer tells you to do.

Whenever I'm in my vehicle I carry my pistol on my person. I keep my DL, CWP, Insurance card, and registration in an area that the officer can see while I reach for them, my car has a little tray on the dashboard that is in full view. This way I don't have to reach to my back pocket or glovebox or center console to retrieve the information the officer would ask for during a traffic stop. If the officer asks me to get out of the car or asks me if I have anything the he should know about I will tell him I have a CWP and am currently carrying. I don't have to inform the officer unless he asks but I find that if I'm going to get out of my vehicle there is a good chance that he will notice that I am carrying so I inform to avoid the chance of being proned out and cuffed because I scared the officer.

 

[LkWd_Don]

Yes lets use common sense.
In this case, knowing that you have a pistol in your glove box, you would not just open it and reach for your registration. You would say something like "Officer I have a CWP and have my weapon stored with my registration, how would you like to proceed?" Then do what the officer tells you to do.

Being proactive and applying common sense at the same time.. as soon as a person saw he/she were being stoped should get the necessary documents out and have them in hand before the Officer even approached the car, then keeping both hands visible.

My post was to present people with a scenario and trying to get people to think how even being legal can appear to someone who does not know your intents. Yes, from what I read in that State, it is legal to carry your loaded weapon in the glove box, but as someone had relayed a bit of wisdom from a Trooper he or she had spoken with was that even with it being legal, they prefer that you keep it separate from your registration. Thus my scenario

 

[Black Dragon]

Being proactive and applying common sense at the same time.. as soon as a person saw he/she were being stoped should get the necessary documents out and have them in hand before the Officer even approached the car, then keeping both hands visible.

My post was to present people with a scenario and trying to get people to think how even being legal can appear to someone who does not know your intents. Yes, from what I read in that State, it is legal to carry your loaded weapon in the glove box, but as someone had relayed a bit of wisdom from a Trooper he or she had spoken with was that even with it being legal, they prefer that you keep it separate from your registration. Thus my scenario

I understand were you are coming from but you made a reference to using common sense then stating that you reach into a glovebox where there is a weapon when stopped by police. There is no common sense in that action.

If you ask just about any officer they will tell you not to reach for anything while you are being pulled over. When you reach for something, whether it's your registration or not, the officer that is behind you has no clue as to what you're actually reaching for. In his mind anyone reaching for anything is possibly reaching for a weapon.
When being stopped you put your hands on the steering wheel and wait for the officer to approach you. When he askes for your information you then say that your information is in a glovebox; back pocket; center console; etc. He will then tell you how to proceed. IF you have a weapon in the same place as your information you would be smart to tell him this before hand.

 

[ericmt]

The 2nd Amendment IS my carry permit.....

That might be, but if you are forced to exercise you 2nd Amendment right, there is a good chance you'll end up in prison with a manslaughter conviction. While I agree we should have Constitutional Carry, I'm not sure that would be worth going to prison over.

 

[Axeanda45]

That might be, but if you are forced to exercise you 2nd Amendment right, there is a good chance you'll end up in prison with a manslaughter conviction. While I agree we should have Constitutional Carry, I'm not sure that would be worth going to prison over.

What utter bullkrap! If it was a good (justified) defensive shooting,, there wouldnt be much, if ANYTHING said about the "unlicensed" carry....

 

[LkWd_Don]

I understand were you are coming from but you made a reference to using common sense then stating that you reach into a glovebox where there is a weapon when stopped by police. There is no common sense in that action.

That was exactly my point, I was giving a scenario and asked a question. Here I will post it for you.

Let's look at it with some common sense and think about a traffic stop.
A police Officer pulls you over for what ever reason, just for giggles we will say your left turn signal lights are inoperative and he is going to write you a Fix-It ticket, but of course you do not know this is the reason for him pulling you over, he gets up to your window and of course he is going to ask for your license, registration and if required in your state, your proof of insurance. So you pull your license out of your bill-fold and then reach to your glove-box to pull out your vehicle registration.. what does he observe? Your firearm laying on top of everything inside of the glove-box and you are reaching for it.. What do you think his first reaction is going to be?
Put it in a zippered case at least, for your own protection if for nothing else.

In my last post, I suggested that since the person trying to make a point by saying you could simply tell the officer you have a permit to carry to preclude that (may or may not work depending on the Officer), that the best bet would to be both proactive and apply Common Sense by just getting the needed documents out before the officer even gets to the vehicle and then keeping hands in plain view. It makes no sense to me to open your mouth and then have to answer yet another nine yards of questions, when you can simply have it encased in a zippered case to where it will not be recognized as a weapon or being proactive and having the documents out to begin with. This is beginning to sound like a dead horse being continuously beaten. LOL