CCW Trigger Job


805Coach

New member
Hi All, New to the forum. My question is would you consider doing a trigger job on your ( GLOCK 19 GEN 4 ) EDC . Please Let me know why you would or would NOT.
Thanks in advanced to all your help and comments.
 

Eidolon

Alter Kocker
Link to a very good article on the subject

Why Farago (And You) Shouldn't Modify A Self-Defense Gun's Trigger - The Truth About Guns

Lets start with this: why would a person want to install a trigger that requires less input force to fire the gun? Because it makes the gun easier to shoot. Why is this bad on a gun that could be used in a self-defense situation? Because it makes the gun easier to shoot. As in, easier to shoot unintentionally, while under stress, confronting an unidentified individual in your house, in the middle of the night, only seconds after you were startled out of paralyzing R.E.M. sleep. It’s also easier to shoot when rapidly drawing from its holster, your finger finding the trigger while the gun is still pointed at your foot. And it’s easier to shoot when trying to cram it back into that same holster, hands trembling from adrenaline, your dexterity on par with that of a banana slug, due to vaso-constriction… You get the idea.
 

Firefighterchen

OC for Tactical Advantage
I work on all my triggers. Whatever gives me an edge at saving what I love, I will take it.

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
 

BluesStringer

Les Brers
Not all trigger jobs are meant to lower the poundage needed to pull the trigger. I'm not a Glock guy, and only one of my handguns is a striker-fire mechanism (not a primary weapon, at most, a back-up), so maybe my answer won't apply to the OP's question, but yeah, I would consider a trigger job that deals with take-up and reset in SA mode on my DA/SA weapons. Since my first round is always in DA, that kind of trigger job wouldn't make it easier to shoot myself in the leg or whatever.

That said, so far, I've never gotten a trigger job on a handgun. Looked into it, know what job I'd get and who would do it if I ever decide to, but haven't umm......pulled the trigger yet. (groan) LOL

Blues
 

bofh

Banned
Define the trigger job that you consider and I can give you a more precise answer.

There are generally two kinds of trigger jobs, those that make the trigger pull lighter and those that don't. Making the trigger pull lighter only makes sense if it is too heavy. The factory Glock trigger is not too heavy for self defense purposes, so making it lighter only makes sense if you plan to use the gun for competition purposes only.

There is something called the "25 cent" trigger job, which essentially consists of polishing certain trigger parts. This trigger job does not lighten the trigger pull and effectively achieves the same effect that hot- or dry-firing the Gun 1000-times would. It does improve the overall trigger quite a bit.

For Glocks, Link Removed offers a number of aftermarket trigger kits. Some make the trigger pull lighter, some don't. I have the Link Removed installed on all my Glocks (19, 26 and 20). It does not change the trigger pull weight, but completely eliminates the "Glock bump."

In any case, any modification to your gun may make it less reliable. Always consider the gun as unproven and not ready for carry after a modification, until you have fired a few hundred rounds of target and self-defense ammo though it.

FYI: James Yeager has certainly a point. Accuracy, especially with the easy-shooting Glock 19, is a training and practice problem that a trigger job won't fix for you. I consider the trigger job as fine tuning after proper training and practice.
 

805Coach

New member
bofh,
Thanks for the link, i think this is what im looking for. Did you put just connector or spring as well. Also what do you think about the NY 1 olive green trigger spring.
 

N R A

New member
Caution: What happens if one tries to procure honey from a honeybee hive, and is not properly trained to do so? Watch one you tube video, and post on a honey forum a couple times, and then just go for it? People die every year, from messing with bee hives. Sometimes even seasoned professionals die.
.
For someone that does not have a Glock Armorers Class, along with experience on how to use that knowledge, and you just start off fiddling, you are holding on to a hornets nest. Sure, lots of people do it. Some people miserably fail at it. Problem: Few actions, getting a reaction, are ever limited to just the action you are trying to achieve. Working inside a Glock, or other pistol, to achieve a cleaner trigger, costs someone a hand, leg, or death, almost daily.

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11523138686_19e31381d9_c.jpg

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11523131286_84e492d2bc_c.jpg
 

bofh

Banned
bofh,
Thanks for the link, i think this is what im looking for. Did you put just connector or spring as well. Also what do you think about the NY 1 olive green trigger spring.

I installed the connector and the Link Removed. As for the NY1 trigger, that's a different combination:

 

bofh

Banned
I guess I should post this as a warning: Link Removed. Polishing does not mean rounding off edges with a Dremel?
 

805Coach

New member
Thank's bofh ,

I would never take a dremel to any firearm. I am going to take it to a glock armory place by me , and try ( polishing ) , if i need more will try ghost EVO .

Thank you to everyone who commented and for your perspective on this subject.
 

N R A

New member
I guess I should post this as a warning: Link Removed. Polishing does not mean rounding off edges with a Dremel?
.

The last post in that thread, says it for me. Why mess with it? You need a combination of 100% reliability, and reasonable performance. If one number goes up, the other goes down, OR ((((((OR))))) could go down. Why chance it?
.

If you get in a shooting, will the trigger job on your gun come into question? If you add a 12 pound spring, it will help your case. If you polish, and lower the resistance needed to take a life, say goodbye to your future.
.

An EDC handgun, should not be a joy to shoot, should not be a pleasure to shoot, it should be a duty to shoot, if all the factors of Deadly Force are 100% justified, and it is prudent to act in your own self defense.
 

Rhino

New member
Why Farago (And You) Shouldn't Modify A Self-Defense Gun's Trigger - The Truth About Guns
Lets start with this: why would a person want to install a trigger that requires less input force to fire the gun? Because it makes the gun easier to shoot. Why is this bad on a gun that could be used in a self-defense situation? Because it makes the gun easier to shoot. As in, easier to shoot unintentionally, while under stress, confronting an unidentified individual in your house, in the middle of the night, only seconds after you were startled out of paralyzing R.E.M. sleep. It’s also easier to shoot when rapidly drawing from its holster, your finger finding the trigger while the gun is still pointed at your foot. And it’s easier to shoot when trying to cram it back into that same holster, hands trembling from adrenaline, your dexterity on par with that of a banana slug, due to vaso-constriction… You get the idea.
I don't know the guy who posted that, but if he thinks he could have issues with his finger finding the trigger while the gun is still pointed at his foot or while he's trying to re-holster his gun, his trigger job, or the lack thereof, is the least of his worries. He's got serious issues with his technique and trigger discipline.
.
I can't see ever changing the trigger pull force on any of my Glocks, but I might for some of my other guns. In fact, I plan to for one of them, but it's double action. Other than pull force, there are two other reasons I see to modify a trigger, to reduce creep and to make it smoother. Polishing will almost always solve the latter. Reducing creep can be more involved, but I can't see that being an issue on a Glock.
 
E

ezkl2230

Guest
I'm going to be doing one on my XD-S .45. Love the gun, but 7 1/2 lb trigger pull, tends to stack up a bit. I hold nice tight groups, but all low and to the left. Getting Powder River trigger kit with redesigned auto sear, supposed to bring it down to about 4 lbs, change the geometry of the trigger pull. Should be a much easier trigger when done. looking forward to my groups getting back to where they should be.
 

Arc Angel

New member
Hi All, New to the forum. My question is would you consider doing a trigger job on your ( GLOCK 19 GEN 4 ) EDC . Please Let me know why you would or would NOT. Thanks in advanced to all your help and comments.

:smile: I would; I have; and I do.

I'm laughing to myself, right now, because those of us who have spent years working on ORIGINAL Gen. 3 Glocks know that towards the end of 2010 Glock GmbH changed the trigger bar's, 'kick-plate' configuration on all future gen. 3; and, subsequently, on all 4th gen. Glocks as well.

Glock sear-plate tabs used to engage a full two-thirds of the striker lug; but, after the change, kick-plate tabs, now, engage as much as three-quarters of the striker lug's face. (So the inherent safety margin for, either, working on striker lug/trigger bar sear-plates or just plain dropping your Glock pistol has been permanently increased.)

‘Why’ did I significantly improve the action and trigger pull on my Glocks? Because I carry one Glock, or another, with me everyday; I’ve been in more than my fair share of armed confrontations; and, I’ll be damned before I’ll allow myself to, either, miss a target and die, or become seriously wounded because I was trying to CQB pistol gunfight, effectively, with one of Gaston’s cheap, expediently manufactured, genuinely crappy, plastic pistols in my hands - THAT is, ‘Why’!

(I, also, own all of the necessary tools; I’ve got more than 40 years of general gunsmithing experience; and I’m a talented pistolsmith, with a specialty in modifying and repairing cheap plastic pistols.)


This seems like a classic case of, ‘the blind leading the blind’; however, if my audience primarily consisted of ‘the sweating, ignorant, naive and unwitting masses’ of today’s handgun owners, maybe - just maybe - I'd start handing out advice like Farago’s (and Ayoob’s) precautions, too; but, I’m not a published gunzine author; and I continue to hold to the opinion that anyone who’s competent enough to fix a bicycle, install and run a computer, or even to change the oil in his car should be more than able to use the same mechanical acumen to successfully modify a crappy Glock.

Heck, I wish my brand new computer came with the kind of published on-line information and videos that are available for my Glock pistols; and NO I am NOT referring to moronic YouTube, ‘Hey, watch me screw with my Glock’ videos. (I’m talking about the commercial Glock books and videos that the people at AGI, and Robert and Morgan Boatman produce.)

I guess I should post this as a warning: Link Removed. Polishing does not mean rounding off edges with a Dremel?

Read the several replies by former Glock Talk member, ‘Arc Angel’. (How about that! Same name as me!) When you get done reading his insightful replies, open Arc Angel’s blog. There you’ll have opportunities to learn what makes a Glock, 'tick' and gain valuable insights into how to skillfully modify your Glock pistol's trigger to simply perform better!

Caution: What happens if one tries to procure honey from a honeybee hive, and is not properly trained to do so?

Watch one you tube video, and post on a honey forum a couple times, and then just go for it? People die every year, from messing with bee hives. Sometimes even seasoned professionals die. For someone that does not have a Glock Armorers Class, along with experience on how to use that knowledge, and you just start off fiddling, you are holding on to a hornets nest.Sure, lots of people do it. Some people miserably fail at it.

Problem: Few actions, getting a reaction, are ever limited to just the action you are trying to achieve. Working inside a Glock, or other pistol, to achieve a cleaner trigger, costs someone a hand, leg, or death, almost daily.

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3749/11523138686_19e31381d9_c.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7445/11523131286_84e492d2bc_c.jpg

Although the pictures are dated and, ‘yesterday’s news’ the advice given in the above reply is sound. Nobody - as in, ‘NOBODY’ - should ever just jump into screwing around with a Glock’s trigger mechanism. ‘Why?’ Because bad things can, and do, happen. Now, remember I was a decent pistolsmith before I bought my first Glock; and, at the same time, I spent over a year on Glock Talk, and purchased several commercial books, and professional videos BEFORE I began working on the several Glock pistols I had acquired in the interim.

I must have done something right, too, because the Glock triggers I have worked on function more like a SIG or H&K trigger than they do like the original factory-stock, cheap junk triggers that they used to be.

I installed the connector and the Link Removed.

As for the NY1 trigger, that's a different combination: (INSERT GLOCK MOD VIDEO FROM ORIGINAL POST HERE!)

WARNING: The above referenced video is so bad, such a technical abortion, that nobody in his right mind should attempt to follow the producer’s cacamayme advice. The guy, very clearly, knows next-to-nothing about working on a Glock pistol; and, yet, there he is showing everybody, in his own inimitable pseudo-intellectual (Read, ‘internet gun forum’) way, how to screw with a Glock.

Here’s how to correctly remove a Glock’s frame pins: Link Removed

Here’s how to correctly disassemble a Glock pistol: Link Removed

Here’s how to correctly reassemble a Glock pistol: Link Removed

If you don’t know how to run a Dremel Tool then you should practice on old pieces of scrap metal until you’re able to do it right. Working with Q-Tips and Flitz Metal Polish is - in my experience - a complete waste of time and energy. (Remember Arc Angel’s advice: Work at low RPM - no higher than 1,500 RPM - and stay away from all edges and corners!)

Personally, I wouldn’t put an NY trigger in a Glock. Sure some people like it, and others like GT’s, ‘Butch’ swear by it; but it should be remembered that both Glock’s NY-1, and NY-2 triggers were originally designed as, ‘field expedient triggers’ in order to help police officers in New York, and Miami transition over from their revolvers. That’s it! No black magic, nor star wars improvement in Glock's original basic trigger technology. Some shooters insist that it’s easier to keep a Glock up and running with an NY spring than it is with a standard coil spring; but, this isn’t really true for anyone who genuinely knows how to run a Glock.

THE PRINCIPAL TRIGGER RESET MECHANISM IN EVERY GLOCK PISTOL IS PHYSICAL RECOIL - NOT THE FORCE DERIVED FROM THE TRIGGER SPRING. PERIOD.

(Anyone who says otherwise is wrong.)

Glock pistols were never (originally) designed to be fired with a, more or less, double-action feeling to the trigger mechanism. The one true outstanding advantage to Glock pistols is that they have the absolutely best trigger reset timing and feel of all the striker-fired plastic pistols except the new H&K VP9’s which have been deliberately designed with an improved trigger in them. This might, also, be true of Walther’s recently improved PPQ plastic pistols, too. (I haven’t shot a Walther PPQ, yet; but this is what people who have are telling me.)

So, what did I do, and what do I have in my very well proven custom-built Glock pistols that the OP might be interested in? To begin with, I also recommend Ghost, Inc.’s, ‘EVO’ connector. Hands down and moving away, Ghost’s EVO is the best Glock connector on the planet. You’re, more than likely, NOT going to be able to just drop it right into your Glock, though. You'll need to study Ghost’s excellent on-line tutorial and installation instructions, first. Why? Because there’s a lot of mechanical slop across Glock’s model lineup; and, as a result, sometimes it’s necessary to tweak a new Ghost connector until it performs properly in a particular Glock pistol.

(DO NOT LOAD UP AND FIRE FULL MAGAZINES UNTIL AFTER YOU KNOW THE INSTALLATION IS WORKING ACCORDING TO SPECIFICATION.)

After learning the hard way, the first thing I do with a brand new Glock is trash all of the factory’s, ‘outside contractor-supplied’ springs and replace them, all, with MUCH BETTER Wolff Gunsprings (out of Newtown Square, PA).

Reset WILL IMPROVE if you install Wolff’s, ‘EP’ (or, ‘extra power’) 6# trigger spring AND, ‘EP’ 6# striker spring. (Yes, I know that Wolff has these springs marked, ‘for competition use only’; but I’ve talked to Dave Kobenseky about this; and I would dare to say that I understand Glock spring physics very well and know how to properly set a Glock’s trigger mechanism up for flawless performance.)

I’ve, also, been carrying and using this particular spring setup in all of my Glocks for the past twelve years; but, to be as entirely objective as I know how, I REALLY DO KNOW HOW to setup and run a Glock pistol - OK. However, ‘Joe Schmo’ taking his Glock apart in his basement, might have a problem. What is the cardinal sin with Glock action springs?

THERE IS A SYNERGY AMONG A GLOCK’S THREE PRINCIPAL SPRINGS THAT ALWAYS NEEDS TO BE CAREFULLY MAINTAINED. ALL GLOCK SPRINGS SHOULD BE AT OR ABOVE STANDARD FACTORY WEIGHTS. WITH ONLY ONE OR TWO EXCEPTIONS YOU CANNOT SAFELY MIX LIGHTWEIGHT, AND HEAVYWEIGHT GLOCK ACTION SPRINGS.

Do not ever use a lighter weight striker spring with a heavier weight trigger and/or recoil spring. Because anyone who makes THIS serious mistake just might suddenly discover what can go very wrong with an incorrectly setup Glock. (Personally I wish they’d take the 4.5# striker springs off the market because, in the wrong hands, these lightweight springs are, nothing but, trouble.)

I don’t have a, ‘light trigger’ pull in any of my Glocks. What I have are very clean, very smooth, fast-breaking triggers. My trigger pulls, measured from the center of the trigger’s face, occupy a range between 4.9 and 5.2 lb. More than safe enough for street carry and combat; and, as I said, I’ve got twelve years of daily use to prove it! (I’ve, also, taken two standing ovations from an audience of police officers for the speed and accuracy at which I’ve been able to fire my Glocks - Entire magazines, ‘dumped’ into a tight 9 inch circle at 16 1/2 yards, just as fast as I could get the slide to cycle! When I’m regularly practiced, I'm able to do this over and over again! Same thing on rows of plates, too.)

‘Why’ am I publishing this? Because gunzine writers with their overly cautious gun safety folderol have a tendency to go way too far. There ARE good and valid reasons for a skilled gunman to customize his pistols. (One of my closest acquaintances, who retired from the FBI as a well-regarded, ‘CQB pistol gunfighter’, always did!) :wink:
 

Deanimator

New member
I've got 3.5lb. Ghost triggers in, and have done the "$0.25 trigger job" on both my Glock 19 and my Glock 22.

When I got it, the Glock 22 had the vile "New York Trigger" in it. I couldn't hit the ocean from the deck of the U.S.S. Ronald Reagan with it.

I'm not the NYPD. I don't have qualified immunity, a union lawyer or a bottomless pot of taxpayer money. I actually have to be able to HIT my target and an 18lb. trigger pretty much negates that at anything beyond contact distances.

If I shoot somebody, it's going to be purely intentional. If I keep my firearm holstered until I'm ready to shoot the threat, center of mass until it's no longer a threat, (no warning shots, no "negotiations", etc.) that's the only way it's going to happen.
 

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