Alright guys help me out with this one

[blkdragon]

Please don't get your feelings hurt. The advice was given to assist, not insult. In your scenario, you came out the winner. You survived, and that is what it is all about. I have been on the wrong end of a firearm on a number of occasions. Three on duty, and one off duty. As a defensive tactics/firearms instructor, I can tell you that your goal is to go home, unhurt everyday.

Retribution is a "crap" sandwich that everyone involved has to take a bite, and it isn't very tasty. A lot of people who think that shooting somecreep that deserves it, will have no consequences. Like the guys said, there is the court(criminal), court(civil), the fact that your life has changed forever.

There are no stupid questions on this forum. You should be concerned about the failure in your tactics that let a creep get that close to you.Maybe, you should work on not letting someone get that close. However if faced with the same situation that you were, I would have given him my wallet, cash, credit cards, and if he wasn't in a real hurry I'd write him a check!

Sometimes good tactics are as simple as taking no action other than that require to keep breathing.

 

[tuts40]

You joined this forum today. As of this post of mine you've posted a total of 3 times. T - R - O - L - L.
The idea of shooting a guy in the back while he walks away and wondering what we all think of that is insulting.

The only thing that comes close to the idiocy of such a question is the fact that there are those here who took it seriously!

 

[WOP2]

I live in philly, where we have the stand your ground law freshly passed. Hypothetical situation here, I am standing on the train platform and a man sticks some ugly burner he picked up from some crackhead in my face and demands my loot. I say "please don't shoot me sir" blah blah blah, I hand him my wallet and watch and let him walk away or run whatever. What he doesn't know is that I'm packing a remington .45 in a back belt holster and I whip that puppy out and put three in his spinal cord (barring I'm that lucky). Now the question is, how will my self defense hold up in court?

I have gone over the whole robbing situation time and time again and this seems to be the best course of action the only problem would be legal issues. I get it I'm shooting him in his back but he threatened me with a fire arm. Would it make a difference if i got him to turn around with just enough time to pop his melon? Please give me some feedback fellas.

You will go to jail awaiting trial for murder. There is no "fleeing felon" provision in Pennsylvania's Title 18. He has relieved you of your wallet, and is now moving away from you. And you shot him in the back because???

Act 10, the Castle Doctrine, does not change any of the circumstances that would justify the use of lethal force. You may stand your ground against a threat, and have no duty to retreat. Act 10 is NOT a license to kill, and you are not Agent 007. Make no mistake, so long as Ramsey is Chief of Police, and the rest of the anti gunners are in office in Philadelphia, what you are proposing is a very, very, very, bad idea.

 

[Jazzdude1200]

It won't, once he turns and leaves there is no threat, if you shoot him you will not pass go but go straight to jail, no get out of jail card!!!!!!!

 

[FN1910]

I live in philly, where we have the stand your ground law freshly passed. Hypothetical situation here, I am standing on the train platform and a man sticks some ugly burner he picked up from some crackhead in my face and demands my loot. I say "please don't shoot me sir" blah blah blah, I hand him my wallet and watch and let him walk away or run whatever. What he doesn't know is that I'm packing a remington .45 in a back belt holster and I whip that puppy out and put three in his spinal cord (barring I'm that lucky). Now the question is, how will my self defense hold up in court?

I have gone over the whole robbing situation time and time again and this seems to be the best course of action the only problem would be legal issues. I get it I'm shooting him in his back but he threatened me with a fire arm. Would it make a difference if i got him to turn around with just enough time to pop his melon? Please give me some feedback fellas.

The words and terminology used in this post scream TROLL as well as the way the topic has been presented. The description of the actual shoot has nothing to do with Stand Your Ground but everything to do with murder or at least manslaughter. If this new poster is truly interested in learning he will hang around for awhile and learn. If not he will go on to another topic.

 

[CapGun]

I asked a CC question on my first(and last)post and had my ass stomped into the ground. I will never ask for advice from this forum and I suggest you do the same.

If your question and attitude is anything like OP Robert James it's a good thing!:stop:

 

[cruisepl]

Did I miss something in the PA legislature? Last I heard, and I am a CCW in Pennsylvania, concealed carry in the City of Philadelphia was not allowed even with a permit.

 

[tuts40]

In all seriousness and with all due respect to the troll, er, OP, I have a question:

Let's say a guy breaks into my house and I light him up with a bright light and have him in my sights.... He drops any weapon and hits his knees begging for mercy. If I order him into the yard and call my neighbor over and we proceed to beat him with sticks, cut him several times with a knife and then light him on fire, take pictures of him burning like a candle to post on facebook before shooting him 12 times, is that over the line? Would I get arrested for anything?

 

[jg1967]

I asked a CC question on my first(and last)post and had my ass stomped into the ground. I will never ask for advice from this forum and I suggest you do the same.

Sadly, that can happen. Let's play nice, guys.

 

[jg1967]

In all seriousness and with all due respect to the troll, er, OP, I have a question:

Let's say a guy breaks into my house and I light him up with a bright light and have him in my sights.... He drops any weapon and hits his knees begging for mercy. If I order him into the yard and call my neighbor over and we proceed to beat him with sticks, cut him several times with a knife and then light him on fire, take pictures of him burning like a candle to post on facebook before shooting him 12 times, is that over the line? Would I get arrested for anything?

Chuckle, now that was nicely over the top!

 

[localgirl]

OK, I will give Robert the benefit of the doubt.

As others have said, it is unlikely your defense would hold up. Once the threat is moving away from you, you are no longer justified in shooting. You would have moved from victim to offender.

You would have several options from the start of this situation:

1. Be aware of your surroundings. If someone looks or acts suspicious, remove yourself from the vicinity and/or prepare yourself for an encounter. Ready yourself to draw your weapon without displaying it.

2. Draw your weapon. If someone has a gun in your face, you can choose to draw and shoot. Realize that he may shoot first. Also realize that he may have never intended to harm you, or that he may have a toy, or myriad other possibilities. You will be justified in your actions, but you will have to live with the consequences.

3. Let him take your wallet. A robbery alone is not justification for deadly action. A robbery plus a weapon is. If you feel you are not actually in danger, let the wallet go, get on your cell, call the police, and cancel your credit cards.

4. If you truly feel, and you MUST be able to prove this in court, that the perpetrator may take further action after stealing your wallet, you can take the chance and fire. However, if he is retreating at the time, as stated before, it won't hold up in court.

5. Upon seeing the perpetrator retreat, unholster your weapon and keep it pointed down but ready to fire. With your other hand, dial 911 and start explaining the situation, including the fact that you have a weapon. During this phone call one of two things will happen--the thief will leave, and you can reholster and explain the incident to the dispatcher, or the thief will turn to shoot you and hopefully you will have the presence of mind to fire while being seriously distracted from adrenaline and talking on the phone.

6. Run after the jerk and tackle him, punch him in the face and get your wallet back. You might get shot, but you probably won't see any jail time.

None of these options are great. All of them involve risks. Some of them will get you arrested or detained regardless of your innocence or fear for your life.

It doesn't seem right that we can't stop a person who has stolen something vital to us, such as our identity and entire financial life. But in most cases that's how it is. Life can only be taken when life is immediately threatened, not as an afterthought.

 

[jg1967]

OK, I will give Robert the benefit of the doubt.

As others have said, it is unlikely your defense would hold up. Once the threat is moving away from you, you are no longer justified in shooting. You would have moved from victim to offender.

You would have several options from the start of this situation:

1. Be aware of your surroundings. If someone looks or acts suspicious, remove yourself from the vicinity and/or prepare yourself for an encounter. Ready yourself to draw your weapon without displaying it.

2. Draw your weapon. If someone has a gun in your face, you can choose to draw and shoot. Realize that he may shoot first. Also realize that he may have never intended to harm you, or that he may have a toy, or myriad other possibilities. You will be justified in your actions, but you will have to live with the consequences.

3. Let him take your wallet. A robbery alone is not justification for deadly action. A robbery plus a weapon is. If you feel you are not actually in danger, let the wallet go, get on your cell, call the police, and cancel your credit cards.

4. If you truly feel, and you MUST be able to prove this in court, that the perpetrator may take further action after stealing your wallet, you can take the chance and fire. However, if he is retreating at the time, as stated before, it won't hold up in court.

5. Upon seeing the perpetrator retreat, unholster your weapon and keep it pointed down but ready to fire. With your other hand, dial 911 and start explaining the situation, including the fact that you have a weapon. During this phone call one of two things will happen--the thief will leave, and you can reholster and explain the incident to the dispatcher, or the thief will turn to shoot you and hopefully you will have the presence of mind to fire while being seriously distracted from adrenaline and talking on the phone.

6. Run after the jerk and tackle him, punch him in the face and get your wallet back. You might get shot, but you probably won't see any jail time.

None of these options are great. All of them involve risks. Some of them will get you arrested or detained regardless of your innocence or fear for your life.

It doesn't seem right that we can't stop a person who has stolen something vital to us, such as our identity and entire financial life. But in most cases that's how it is. Life can only be taken when life is immediately threatened, not as an afterthought.

Ver nice concise write up!

 

[tucsonjw]

Interesting hypothetical.
When the BG turned and departed, he was no longer a threat.
Your decision to use deadly force would land you in prison.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Did I miss something in the PA legislature? Last I heard, and I am a CCW in Pennsylvania, concealed carry in the City of Philadelphia was not allowed even with a permit.

Yes, you missed everything. Starting with the PA Uniform Firearms Act.

Can you cite the law? Or the source?

Within the City of Philadelphia, with your PA LTCF or License To Carry Firearms (there is no CCW in PA), you may carry open or concealed.


Edited to add:

[h=1]18 Pa.C.S. § 6108: Carrying firearms on public streets or public property in Philadelphia [/h]

[TD="colspan: 2"]No person shall carry a firearm, rifle or shotgun at any time upon the public streets or upon any public property in a city of the first class unless:
[/TD]

[TD="class: spacer"] [/TD]
[TD="colspan: 1"] (1) such person is licensed to carry a firearm; or
[/TD]

[TD="class: spacer"] [/TD]
[TD="colspan: 1"] (2) such person is exempt from licensing under section 6106 of this title (relating to firearms not to be carried without a license).
[/TD]

.

 

[titaniumman]

I thought a "BURNER" was a throw away cell phone...I need to watch more CSI or something!

 

[FN1910]

I think that the guidelines for Stand-Your-Ground are about the same in all states so just remember the four rules for it. If you follow them it will pretty much answer any question about whether it applies or not.

1 - You must be in a place where you have a right to be. (It doesn't matter if it is your house or store or on the sidewalk, just that you have the right to be there)

2 - You must not be breaking any laws during the assault. (Doesn't apply during a drug deal, if you are publicly drunk, etc.)

3 - You must have no part of initiating the assault. (Can't pick at someone then claim SYG.)

4 - The amount of force used must be proportional. (This is the tricky one but you must be in imminent fear of life or great bodily harm. An unarmed 8 year-old vs. an armed adult. Multiple attackers vs. single. For you to decide. If they are running away it is going to be very hard to show your life was in danger)

Open to comments or rebuttals.

 

[Cojo]

You are obviously a troll looking to elicit a rise out of legitimate posters on this board.
Anyone who has the responsibility of concealed carry knows that your scenario is bogus, that responsible cc'ers don't shoot fleeing people in the back, your robbery notwithstanding.
Either you are clueless or a Bradytroll. I vote troll.

 

[Caribou]

Please do not consider this a beat down as it is not intended that way. This is such a basic question it is likely to illicit a strong response as you may have noticed. If your intent was to stir the pot then those who responded with anger or name calling fell into your trap, it worked and they should feel foolish. Assuming an honest question, you have your answer, don't do it.

As I said this is a basic question and I strongly recommend that you immediately take a CC class. After that take another class that expands on what you already know. Read as many of these threads as possible, there is a lot of good information here. You have to sort through a bit of name calling but not as bad as other sites I have been to. Buy books and videos or get some from the library. You may want to consider putting the gun away until you can get your first class. Jail is such a harsh teacher. These classes, books, and videos will teach you how to survive the fight and how to survive the court system. You should also read you State laws. Sign up for your first class today. While you are waiting for the first day of class read the laws on this subject, after class read them again.

 

[jg1967]

You are obviously a troll looking to elicit a rise out of legitimate posters on this board.
Anyone who has the responsibility of concealed carry knows that your scenario is bogus, that responsible cc'ers don't shoot fleeing people in the back, your robbery notwithstanding.
Either you are clueless or a Bradytroll. I vote troll.

I think he is probably legit. But the Bradytroll is a possibility, asking a provocative question that makes us look like gung ho wannabe Deathwish Charles Bronson characters that would shoot people in the back, no questions asked. So for the record, we don't ever do that.

 

[rrman12280]

How do you think your defense would hold up?