Oklahoma Open Carry. What are your thoughts?

[Firefighterchen]

Agreed,

I'm talking about the dip wads that go out with a sport rifle slung and march back and forth waiting for an officer to respond to a complaint so they can make a YouTube video of how the police did them wrong.

I'm all for rallies for general awareness.


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Ok I'm curious, are speaking about someone specifically? This road has been traveled here...if you want to go down it there are plenty of us who know it pretty well.

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[BluesStringer]

It never ceases to amaze (and disappoint) me how some people can seem so open minded and reasonable, right up to the point that someone commits a perfectly legal act that they themselves probably don't understand the reasons for, or just disagree with on some "principle," and then the name-calling comes out and the reasonableness says bye-bye. Once lost, a reputation for portraying reasonableness is hard to get back.

 

[Niland]

Ok I'm curious, are speaking about someone specifically? This road has been traveled here...if you want to go down it there are plenty of us who know it pretty well.

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No sir, I'm not trying to offend or single out. We've all seen various vids. Some illustrate valid issues and make a well considered statement. Some just confuse and seem to have no point or purpose. Perhaps I just need to understand how this last category helps the voting public understand what we wish to accomplish. After all, at the end of the day, it's the uneducated voting masses that decide how gun control laws are shaped. I'd think we'd all be looking to accomplish a similar goal.

Many of you gents have been around this topic a lot more than I have and I am genuinely interested in your opinions and am not trying to flame anyone or be disagreeable in any way. I just come here to learn and understand and occasionally share an unwelcome opinion. Hopefully no harm done.


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[NavyLCDR]

No sir, I'm not trying to offend or single out. We've all seen various vids. Some illustrate valid issues and make a well considered statement. Some just confuse and seem to have no point or purpose. Perhaps I just need to understand how this last category helps the voting public understand what we wish to accomplish. After all, at the end of the day, it's the uneducated voting masses that decide how gun control laws are shaped. I'd think we'd all be looking to accomplish a similar goal.

Many of you gents have been around this topic a lot more than I have and I am genuinely interested in your opinions and am not trying to flame anyone or be disagreeable in any way. I just come here to learn and understand and occasionally share an unwelcome opinion. Hopefully no harm done.

They are exercising their rights because they can and they don't need any other reason or your approval. Here's the problem as I see it. We don't see the anti-gun side pointing fingers at each other. The anti-gun side is rock solid joined together collectively pointing their finger at us, and us only. Very seldom (I actually haven't seen one instance) will you see one anti pointing a finger at another anti and calling them names regardless of how crazy their behavior or ideas become - as long as they remain anti. We have enough people to fight against on the anti side, we can't afford to fight the people on the pro side too. If you think a certain group of people is hurting our cause than so be it. But when you allow them to turn your effort away from fighting the anti-s, now you have just added to the number people who aren't helping us fight the anti-s.

If you think they are hurting us, then don't support them. But don't call them names, either, just leave them alone.

 

[BluesStringer]

Agreed,

I'm talking about the dip wads that go out with a sport rifle slung and march back and forth waiting for an officer to respond to a complaint so they can make a YouTube video of how the police did them wrong.

If the police can be so-easily manipulated into harassing citizens engaging in perfectly legal activity, then who is really the "dip wad," and why on Earth is the rifle carrier being criticized for exposing those "dip wads" on YouTube? That OC'er, whether rifle or sidearm, is putting his freedom on the line for you. He/she is literally putting his well-being/life on the line standing up for your and everybody else's rights, whether or not you can envision yourself ever exercising the right he's standing for. And the thanks he/she gets is being called a "dip wad."

It's not that difficult to figure out why we take exception to it.

I'm all for rallies for general awareness.

One can trip over a pebble, but not over a mountain. You have tripped over the pebble of a single Patriot standing for his own rights, while not tripping over the mountain of large groups of Patriots standing for the same rights.

In a country ostensibly built upon the premise of individual liberty, why is the collective's demonstration more valid, or acceptable to you, than the individual's?

Blues

 

[Niland]

If the police can be so-easily manipulated into harassing citizens engaging in perfectly legal activity, then who is really the "dip wad," and why on Earth is the rifle carrier being criticized for exposing those "dip wads" on YouTube? That OC'er, whether rifle or sidearm, is putting his freedom on the line for you. He/she is literally putting his well-being/life on the line standing up for your and everybody else's rights, whether or not you can envision yourself ever exercising the right he's standing for. And the thanks he/she gets is being called a "dip wad."

It's not that difficult to figure out why we take exception to it.



One can trip over a pebble, but not over a mountain. You have tripped over the pebble of a single Patriot standing for his own rights, while not tripping over the mountain of large groups of Patriots standing for the same rights.

In a country ostensibly built upon the premise of individual liberty, why is the collective's demonstration more valid, or acceptable to you, than the individual's?

Blues

Fairly said on both counts. I have no defense, only a lack of experience and a full measure of ignorance.

Thanks for the response. I'll consider myself well advised.


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[Niland]

They are exercising their rights because they can and they don't need any other reason or your approval. Here's the problem as I see it. We don't see the anti-gun side pointing fingers at each other. The anti-gun side is rock solid joined together collectively pointing their finger at us, and us only. Very seldom (I actually haven't seen one instance) will you see one anti pointing a finger at another anti and calling them names regardless of how crazy their behavior or ideas become - as long as they remain anti. We have enough people to fight against on the anti side, we can't afford to fight the people on the pro side too. If you think a certain group of people is hurting our cause than so be it. But when you allow them to turn your effort away from fighting the anti-s, now you have just added to the number people who aren't helping us fight the anti-s.

If you think they are helping us, then don't support. But don't call them names, either, just leave them alone.

A well placed retort. Thanks for reminding me that all points of view are equally valid and none deserve disdain, especially from the uninformed (me).


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[windowkb]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and ideas. I opened this discussion in the concealed carry forum to try and understand a different perspective. Throughout my professional operations I have always utilized surprise in action and work in a clandestine environment. What I meant when I said I have a bias towards open carry is that you are an easy target. I have always been a hard target in many life situations and teach methods for this. I respect those who choose to excercise this right, but still believe you are an easy target in a threat environment if you choose to identify that you have a gun.

 

[Skiluvr03]

I Live in Oklahoma and do Open or Concealed, depending on my mood. Open Carry is an option in the Law. If you have a Bias against it, or your Heart isn't in it, then you shouldn't be an Instructor in my Opinion.

 

[Firefighterchen]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and ideas. I opened this discussion in the concealed carry forum to try and understand a different perspective. Throughout my professional operations I have always utilized surprise in action and work in a clandestine environment. What I meant when I said I have a bias towards open carry is that you are an easy target. I have always been a hard target in many life situations and teach methods for this. I respect those who choose to excercise this right, but still believe you are an easy target in a threat environment if you choose to identify that you have a gun.

You opened this in a concealed carry sub forum to understand a different perspective? Sounds more like you opened it here so you can get approval of the same perspective you share.

If open carry makes you an easy target, why do concealed carriers have to defend themselves all the time...and not open carriers?

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[NavyLCDR]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and ideas. I opened this discussion in the concealed carry forum to try and understand a different perspective. Throughout my professional operations I have always utilized surprise in action and work in a clandestine environment. What I meant when I said I have a bias towards open carry is that you are an easy target. I have always been a hard target in many life situations and teach methods for this. I respect those who choose to excercise this right, but still believe you are an easy target in a threat environment if you choose to identify that you have a gun.

You opened this in a concealed carry sub forum for a different perspective? Sounds more like you opened it here so you can get approval of the same perspective you share.

If open carry makes you an easy target, why do concealed carriers have to defend themselves all the time...and not open carriers?

Sounds to me like windowkb is one of those guys who is just hoping to get attacked so he can have the opportunity to whip out his "element of surprise".....

Hello Everyone,
I am a SDA instructor in Oklahoma

Interest in Oklahoma pistol courses? Corsec Tactical

Scratch Corsec Tactical off my list of anyone that I would ever do business with.

 

[BluesStringer]

Sounds to me like windowkb is one of those guys who is just hoping to get attacked so he can have the opportunity to whip out his "element of surprise".....

I'm not willing to make that leap based on such limited information, but....

Scratch Corsec Tactical off my list of anyone that I would ever do business with.

I made that decision after reading the OP just once. I think that certainly any weapons-intensive military experience qualifies one to teach marksmanship, weapons maintenance, even military tactics to military personnel, but I don't think military training translates very well into concealed (or obviously, open) carry out and about in the streets of America.....at least not at this point in this nation's decline. Not saying it's the kind of training that civilians wouldn't benefit from just in general-interest kinds of activities, but the potential for the average American civilian to ever have to take on a platoon or greater-sized force, or clear structures door-to-door, or know what to watch for re: IEDs and so on and so forth, is virtually nil. Even with all the crime in isolated places like Chicago or wherever, civilian tactics still don't mimic military tactics in Fallujah or Anbar Province or 1980s or 90s Beirut. American criminals aren't like radical islamists willing, even looking forward to, dying in order to ply their reign of terror. American criminals are lazy cowards for the most part, picking on the weak and defenseless because that's what lazy cowards do. They don't want to die or face jail, so odds are they will be deterred by the absolute knowledge that their intended victim is neither weak nor defenseless. Nothing is 100%, but to a person that has ever expressed an opinion on it, those of us who OC believe that the odds remain heavily in our favor.

Nothing personal towards anything the OP said. You asked, some of us answered. That's all.

Blues

 

[Cascilla boy]

Hello everyone, I'm from Ms and I'm interested in getting my concealed carry permit for protection for me and my family. I thought it would be great to come here and get to know more about it because it seems a lot of responsibility comes with CC permit.

 

[tcox4freedom]

Welcome-
Congrats on stepping up to protect your family.
There is a great deal of responsibility that comes with the decision to carry a firearm.
You can learn a lot here and gain of alot of wisdom if you're open to it.

-

 

[whiskycut]

Legally l can drive a car with my feet, not a good idea, but I can.I have been a cc guy for 30yrs, and when see a oc.guy they make me nervous, (you really never know what someone else is thinking) so as a rule I only op in places where it would be perfectly alright to walk around with my Johnson hanging out, but that's just me.

 

[BluesStringer]

Legally l can drive a car with my feet, not a good idea, but I can.I have been a cc guy for 30yrs, and when see a oc.guy they make me nervous, (you really never know what someone else is thinking) so as a rule I only op in places where it would be perfectly alright to walk around with my Johnson hanging out, but that's just me.

So then make posts that prove your brains are hangin' out instead, and keep on CC'ing.

 

[Cascilla boy]

Thanks, I've been reading this stuff all day. There are lots of interesting facts on this forum.


Chopper

 

[NavyLCDR]

Legally l can drive a car with my feet, not a good idea, but I can.I have been a cc guy for 30yrs, and when see a oc.guy they make me nervous, (you really never know what someone else is thinking) so as a rule I only op in places where it would be perfectly alright to walk around with my Johnson hanging out, but that's just me.

Ahh, the out of sight out of mind mental illness...you do understand that very few criminals open carry because when something is illegal to possess the person typically does not have it out there for all to see. Maybe instead of your mentality of "you really never know what someone else is thinking" you should really try "you really never know what someone else is HIDING". I thought it was pretty funny when the Oklahoma law enforcement association was against passing open carry because they claimed it would put more officers in danger. Really? So you are in more danger from the guns that you can see than the guns that are being hidden? That makes no common sense whatsoever. You see Joe Schmoe in the store with a handgun in a holster on his belt and you don't know what he is thinking? Well, guess what.... you see Joe Schmoe in a store without a gun visible in a holster on his belt and now you not only know what he is thinking but you also don't know if he has gun hidden or not. But that's just me.

 

[micks]

I'm an Okie and I prefer concealed carry to open carry for 2 simple reasons. First, a little mystery is a good thing. The element of surprise is maintained with CC. Second, if I were a bad guy, my first targets for neutralization would be those that I knew posed a threat to my criminal activity. Those that I know may interfere with my dirty deeds are those OC'ing.

 

[Firefighterchen]

I'm an Okie and I prefer concealed carry to open carry for 2 simple reasons. First, a little mystery is a good thing. The element of surprise is maintained with CC. Second, if I were a bad guy, my first targets for neutralization would be those that I knew posed a threat to my criminal activity. Those that I know may interfere with my dirty deeds are those OC'ing.

You wouldn't make a very good bad guy for very long.

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