Night Crabbing and Hoodlums

[eagleeyes]

i'm just glad you weren't shot.....stay safe out there in the hood but anywhere bad things can go down ..even the suburbs

 

[BC1]

I call complete B.S. totally.... You took the CCW Class and have your CCW, YOU CALL THE COPS hands down!!!!! End of story. What if said "Bad Guys" stayed around and ended up hurting someone after you left??????? What do you tell the Cops then?????? "Oh it's no big deal" they were just seemingly drunk and discharging what you knew to be a .380 from 600 Feet away.

You must have incredible hearing and knowledge as well, except for calling the Police (That would be too LOGICAL). Someone like you doesn't deserve a CCW if you don't think about your fellow Man/Woman.

Very Lame!!!!!!

Well, not so fast.

I was raised in the hood, in fact in the murder capital of NY and I've seen a lot of $h!t. I'm not calling the cops for a number of reasons that those without "street" experience might not consider.

• First, if I didn't see a gun, the cops aren't coming. Could be fireworks?
• Second, if I do call and don't want to give my name or file a report, cops aren't coming.
• Third, if I do call and am willing to give my name, the hoodrat has the right to know about his accuser. It's part of his constitutional right. And now perhaps I need to watch out for the nocturnal wildlife. Most of the time, Flaco would rather take his chances dealing with the witness than take five-to-seven in Downstate Correctional.
• Fourth, hoodie can buy another gun for a hundred bucks. He's gonna toss it off the bridge. And he still might know your name.

Was it a .380? Hard to tell. But anyone who's been around the hood knows the sound of a gunshot is quite different than fireworks. perhaps it wasn't even intended toward the couple walking away. Anyone who knows the street understands the power of retaliation. I'm not starting anything with an element I know all too well. I don't care what an instructor teaches. As a certified and highly experienced PP instructor I too will advise calling police... when there's a real, known, identified threat. Never on an unknown. Best just to leave. If an instructor doesn't teach you that the first rules of self-defense are awareness, avoidance, deterrence, de-escalation and retreat you should get your money back. The best fight you make is the one you don't have. The instructor's job is to teach you to survive. It is to instill a skill set in you. Not to teach you how a threat will present or advise a certain course of action true in every instance. And I'm no sheepdog. I'm not risking harm to my self or family unless there is an absolute, real, "in-progress" threat.

Good call, addicted. Don't spend your life looking over your shoulder.

 

[~OtisM~]

Just got shot at by a 380 after I was crabbing with my fiance. Fortunate for the Juggalo that shot at us, he waited until we were leaving and I was 200 yards away leaving me no legal way to return fire in our defense(densely populated condos behind the group of 5). So as we were walking back to the car to go home I hear a small pop from a 380 come from the bridge. My fiance and I just looked at each other and agreed that it sounded like a 380, laughed, shrugged and kept walking and got in the car and left as normal. A 380 only lays down 180ft/lbs out of the muzzle, at 200 yards he may have been more intimidating with an arrow. And for the record there was no communication between my fiance and I with the group of drunken wannabe thugs the hour we were there. We were 50 or so feet away crabbing the other end of the bridge. I also overheard that he is out on bond and is awaiting an arraignment coming up next week for felony charges and lives with his grandmother. Drunken loudmouths for you. Why do people try to intimidate innocent people? Little did he know I possess a concealed carry permit and a 40 S&W everywhere I go sans gov buildings, things would have been bad for him had he assaulted me with the firearm while I was in range. The situation would have only been worse had I returned fire, bullets surely would have went through condominium homes in the background. Provided with those circumstances I felt it was best to continue walking and just leave :sarcastic:

You sound like a trouble maker. I bet trouble finds u a lot.

 

[BC1]

You sound like a trouble maker. I bet trouble finds u a lot.

I don't know but it seems quite the opposite. He didn't cause any trouble at all. He didn't verbally escalate a confrontation. He didn't pull a "Zimmerman." He retreated.

 

[Addicted]

Very well stated BC1, very respectable

 

[Firefighterchen]

Well, not so fast.

I was raised in the hood, in fact in the murder capital of NY and I've seen a lot of $h!t. I'm not calling the cops for a number of reasons that those without "street" experience might not consider.

• First, if I didn't see a gun, the cops aren't coming. Could be fireworks?
• Second, if I do call and don't want to give my name or file a report, cops aren't coming.
• Third, if I do call and am willing to give my name, the hoodrat has the right to know about his accuser. It's part of his constitutional right. And now perhaps I need to watch out for the nocturnal wildlife. Most of the time, Flaco would rather take his chances dealing with the witness than take five-to-seven in Downstate Correctional.
• Fourth, hoodie can buy another gun for a hundred bucks. He's gonna toss it off the bridge. And he still might know your name.

Was it a .380? Hard to tell. But anyone who's been around the hood knows the sound of a gunshot is quite different than fireworks. perhaps it wasn't even intended toward the couple walking away. Anyone who knows the street understands the power of retaliation. I'm not starting anything with an element I know all too well. I don't care what an instructor teaches. As a certified and highly experienced PP instructor I too will advise calling police... when there's a real, known, identified threat. Never on an unknown. Best just to leave. If an instructor doesn't teach you that the first rules of self-defense are awareness, avoidance, deterrence, de-escalation and retreat you should get your money back. The best fight you make is the one you don't have. The instructor's job is to teach you to survive. It is to instill a skill set in you. Not to teach you how a threat will present or advise a certain course of action true in every instance. And I'm no sheepdog. I'm not risking harm to my self or family unless there is an absolute, real, "in-progress" threat.

Good call, addicted. Don't spend your life looking over your shoulder.

So...just to get this straight..

Facts according to the OP:
1: It was a .380
2: It was fired towards them
3: The shooter was out on bond and awaiting an arraignment.

Is that not a threat to you? What does it take for it to be a "real, known, identifiable" threat? Does the .380 need to penetrate and does blood need to be visible? Just throwing things out here...

If the OP had said, I heard a loud bang (unknown source), some drunk idiots were talking nearby about being out on bond until the arraignment...we decided to high tail it out of there. That would be different. But according to the OP...shots were definitely fired and they were definitely towards him and his mate. Is it acceptable to be shot at in the hood but not in another part of town?

 

[Trubiet]

I love it!!!!!!!!!

It doesn't take incredible hearing to roughly identify handgun calibers. This is the ghetto, 380s and 9mm hipoints are a plague. You must live in a safe place where people have morals. Here its grade D low class citizens that drain the welfare dry. I believe they have a stigma for such, some refer to such low caliber individuals around this area as a thing called trash, aka criminals. The residents who live at the place that it happened can call the police. Are you aware of how many gunshots are reported in this area daily? Look at any of the Hampton Roads news websites and see how many people get murdered here daily. My experience was a drop in the bucket at what goes on. Trubiet, you truly sound like a nieve sheep. What bubble do you live in? POP :yu:


Here are just a few: HOMICIDES IN HAMPTON ROADS FOR 2011 - dailypress.com

You make the Stupid Mistake, and I am Nieve????? Good one!!! The Bubble I live in is YEARS of training with a S.W.A.T. Team. Good enough for you Mr (NIEVE SHEEP)!!!!!!!!!

What a COMPLETE idiot!!!!!!!!!! I think I saw some "Likes" on my original statement. Didn't see any on yours. Your problem????? You took what I said personally, when actually every word I spoke made truth....and a Police Office would say the same.

P.S. Sorry I live in a much nicer/safer place than you

 

[Trubiet]

Your bad psychology isn't logical bud

I find it almost humorous that you gave me crap, yet just about everyone on here "roughly" feels the same way!!!!!!

I reply to your quote bashing me.......Then you change your tune, you are as trained as I am, and you were just giving a (Journalistic side)?????????

BASICALLY, you put your Foot in your Mouth and you aren't happy with people's honest responses......So you go on the attack......Like I said before, LAME!!!!!!

 

[Trubiet]

Wow what a tool

EXACTLY........But "We" all live in a Bubble and don't know anything which is why he shared his story. CCW #1 Avoid conflict at 600 FEET......and call the Police!!!!!!

I replied on something else, I think the Douche deleted it???

 

[Trubiet]

I think it's called being "Fecitious" people!!!!!!!

 

[kerb]

I don't know but it seems quite the opposite. He didn't cause any trouble at all. He didn't verbally escalate a confrontation. He didn't pull a "Zimmerman." He retreated.

You made some good points in your earlier post. But something about this story doesn't add up to me.

They were walking away (I assume facing away from the bridge) at a distance of ~200 yards, and it was either dark or approaching dark.

Given those circumstances, how do you know where the gun was pointed?

 

[BC1]

So...just to get this straight..

Facts according to the OP:
1: It was a .380
2: It was fired towards them
3: The shooter was out on bond and awaiting an arraignment.

Is that not a threat to you? What does it take for it to be a "real, known, identifiable" threat? Does the .380 need to penetrate and does blood need to be visible? Just throwing things out here...

If the OP had said, I heard a loud bang (unknown source), some drunk idiots were talking nearby about being out on bond until the arraignment...we decided to high tail it out of there. That would be different. But according to the OP...shots were definitely fired and they were definitely towards him and his mate. Is it acceptable to be shot at in the hood but not in another part of town?

He was 200 yards away, walking away. He didn't see a gun. He didn't see anything fired. He doesn't know the direction the shot was fired. He doesn't claim to hear it hit anywhere. He can't tell you for sure that it was a .380 (no one can) or in fact even that it was absolutely a gun shot.

In the hood / out of the hood; same thing. The wildlife still shops at the same mall, frequents the same Walmart and crabs off the same bridges. What's most important is that once you profile them as possible hoodrats, and when they have numbers - beat-feet out of there.

There's not enough for me to invite the wrath of MS13 (Mara Salvatrucha-13), The Mexican Mafia, Latin Kings, Crips, Bloods, Benkard Barrio Kings, People Nation, The Trinitarios, 4040, Los Vagos, and on and on). These guys will wack you for entertainment value, for initiation, for nothing more than a thought passing through their head. They have absolutely no sympathy or empathy. Killing you is a badge of honor. There are no rules so they will drive-by your kids or family. happens all the time. You're nothing more than another set of sneakers thrown over the utility wires. All of this for doing nothing to them... now try doing something! Cops? They laugh at cops. They regularly get pinched and usually beat the rap. Getting pinched is just business as usual in their world. They throw the gun in the water. They scatter like roaches when a light is turned-on. Why would you invite this if you didn't have to? Anyone who's spent time in the hood or knows the streets absolutely knows the best action is to just get out of there.

So you hear a loud bang and hoodrats laughing. You think they shot at you. You approach them and you're dead. You call LE on them and they find you? Somebody takes a dirt nap. Because if they don't deal with you and that info gets out? OOFA, very bad for their reputation.

 

[Firefighterchen]

So...just to get this straight..

Facts according to the OP:
1: It was a .380
2: It was fired towards them
3: The shooter was out on bond and awaiting an arraignment.

Is that not a threat to you? What does it take for it to be a "real, known, identifiable" threat? Does the .380 need to penetrate and does blood need to be visible? Just throwing things out here...

If the OP had said, I heard a loud bang (unknown source), some drunk idiots were talking nearby about being out on bond until the arraignment...we decided to high tail it out of there. That would be different. But according to the OP...shots were definitely fired and they were definitely towards him and his mate. Is it acceptable to be shot at in the hood but not in another part of town?

He was 200 yards away, walking away. He didn't see a gun. He didn't see anything fired. He doesn't know the direction the shot was fired. He doesn't claim to hear it hit anywhere. He can't tell you for sure that it was a .380 (no one can) or in fact even that it was absolutely a gun shot.

In the hood / out of the hood; same thing. The wildlife still shops at the same mall, frequents the same Walmart and crabs off the same bridges. What's most important is that once you profile them as possible hoodrats, and when they have numbers - beat-feet out of there.

There's not enough for me to invite the wrath of MS13 (Mara Salvatrucha-13), The Mexican Mafia, Latin Kings, Crips, Bloods, Benkard Barrio Kings, People Nation, The Trinitarios, 4040, Los Vagos, and on and on). These guys will wack you for entertainment value, for initiation, for nothing more than a thought passing through their head. They have absolutely no sympathy or empathy. Killing you is a badge of honor. There are no rules so they will drive-by your kids or family. happens all the time. You're nothing more than another set of sneakers thrown over the utility wires. All of this for doing nothing to them... now try doing something! Cops? They laugh at cops. They regularly get pinched and usually beat the rap. Getting pinched is just business as usual in their world. They throw the gun in the water. They scatter like roaches when a light is turned-on. Why would you invite this if you didn't have to? Anyone who's spent time in the hood or knows the streets absolutely knows the best action is to just get out of there.

So you hear a loud bang and hoodrats laughing. You think they shot at you. You approach them and you're dead. You call LE on them and they find you? Somebody takes a dirt nap. Because if they don't deal with you and that info gets out? OOFA, very bad for their reputation.

you should re read the op. It seems like you are describing a completely different scenario than what the op states happened.

Just got shot at by a 380 after I was crabbing with my fiance. .. So as we were walking back to the car to go home I hear a small pop from a 380 come from the bridge. ....And for the record there was no communication between my fiance and I with the group of drunken wannabe thugs the hour we were there. ...I also overheard that he is out on bond and is awaiting an arraignment coming up next week for felony charges and lives with his grandmother.

as you can see, he knows it was a .380 and he knows it was shot at him, and they arent gang members he knows they are wannabe thugs.

also no one said to approach, not sure where you came to that conclusion from. please cite where the police have to tell a criminal who called the police... unless you are just posting your opinion on how worthless police are in general, in which case I won't argue that.

 

[Trubiet]

Op=idiot

See, that's why I claimed complete B.S. in the first place..........And the Tea-Bagger said I was a Naive Sheep!!! What a complete Moron. All I did was call Bull & state the FACT that he should have called the Police no matter what.

So he gets pissy with me????? People like that don't deserve a CCW since they don't do what they logically should have done!!!!!

 

[BC1]

you should re read the op. It seems like you are describing a completely different scenario than what the op states happened.

as you can see, he knows it was a .380 and he knows it was shot at him, and they arent gang members he knows they are wannabe thugs.

also no one said to approach, not sure where you came to that conclusion from. please cite where the police have to tell a criminal who called the police... unless you are just posting your opinion on how worthless police are in general, in which case I won't argue that.

Just got shot at by a 380 after I was crabbing with my fiance. Fortunate for the Juggalo that shot at us, he waited until we were leaving and I was 200 yards away leaving me no legal way to return fire in our defense(densely populated condos behind the group of 5). So as we were walking back to the car to go home I hear a small pop from a 380 come from the bridge. My fiance and I just looked at each other and agreed that it sounded like a 380, laughed, shrugged and kept walking and got in the car and left as normal

He said it was a .380. He also said he was 200 yards away. No one can tell a .380 from two football fields away by sight or sound. Very difficult to say what direction the shot was fired in from that distance.

And for the record there was no communication between my fiance and I with the group of drunken wannabe thugs the hour we were there. ........... I also overheard that he is out on bond and is awaiting an arraignment coming up next week for felony charges.

Yes, they are probably thugs. He doesn't claim to know them. Out on bail for a felony? Probably real thugs not wannabe's. You leave it alone if at all possible.

Now regarding your request that I "please cite where the police have to tell a criminal who called the police?" It's not up for debate. It's his consitituional right.

Amendment VI​

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.​

Additionally, in the criminal procedure laws of every state exists the right to confront your accuser. He has the right to a copy of the accusatory instrument (complaint), the names of all witnesses against him and a copy of the 911 tape. Maybe in some locals the cops come to anonymous calls. And although perps abound everywhere, LE in bad areas are overworked with emergenciy calls. 911 wait times can be long. Many won't respond if the caller won't provide his name. If the LEO does come on the anonymous call, the gun goes in the river and the rats laugh at him. Spent a lot of time in very bad areas. This call is a loser. Fortunately he got out of there with his @$$. I'm by no means saying it's OK for someone to shoot at us. But when it comes down to it this guy only heard a bang; by his own description. Where I was raised you hear a bang every ten minutes or so. No LEO responds. Maybe I'm conditioned by that.

911 what's your emergency? I was crabbing on a bridge and some thugs were nearby. When I left I heard a bang from 200 yards away. I think it was a .380 but didn't see a gun. Maybe they shot at me. What is your name sir? I don't want to give it. OK we'll have an officer check by the location.

 

[Firefighterchen]

He said it was a .380. He also said he was 200 yards away. No one can tell a .380 from two football fields away by sight or sound. Very difficult to say what direction the shot was fired in from that distance.

I'm not going to read more into what the OP wanted to say, he said what he said. You can assume he meant something else, but what he said is what I will base my responses on. He was shot at by a handgun which he knows the specific caliber to. Call the police, end of story.

Yes, they are probably thugs. He doesn't claim to know them. Out on bail for a felony? Probably real thugs not wannabe's. You leave it alone if at all possible.

The OP seems to think they were just wanna be thugs, not real thugs. That's him saying it, not me. Yes you leave it alone and get out of there, no one is questioning that, they are questioning his lack of a 911 call.

Now regarding your request that I "please cite where the police have to tell a criminal who called the police?" It's not up for debate. It's his consitituional right.

Amendment VI​

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.​

Additionally, in the criminal procedure laws of every state exists the right to confront your accuser. He has the right to a copy of the accusatory instrument (complaint), the names of all witnesses against him and a copy of the 911 tape. Maybe in some locals the cops come to anonymous calls. And although perps abound everywhere, LE in bad areas are overworked with emergenciy calls. 911 wait times can be long. Many won't respond if the caller won't provide his name. If the LEO does come on the anonymous call, the gun goes in the river and the rats laugh at him. Spent a lot of time in very bad areas. This call is a loser. Fortunately he got out of there with his @$$. I'm by no means saying it's OK for someone to shoot at us. But when it comes down to it this guy only heard a bang; by his own description. Where I was raised you hear a bang every ten minutes or so. No LEO responds. Maybe I'm conditioned by that.

In this case, I thought Amendment VI was after charges were filed and they were in court proceedings. So, the call to 911 would be confidential until the state accused the person of committing a crime in which case the person calling in would be only a witness and all facts would be open to anyone. Unless the OP was a victim and personally accused and pushed charges on the "wanna be thugs" (ie: OP charges for assault, which he doesn't have to) he would only be a witness to the crime, and the state would be the accusers. So say they ditch the gun, say the police can't make an arrest, there is no charge, there is no accusation, your confidentiality is safe, but there now is a record of wrong doing. No one is saying to confront them, no one is saying to stick around, pretty much everyone but you and the OP feel a 911 call was absolutely warranted given the "facts" of the situation. I will no longer respond to the "you need to leave the situation" aspect, as that has nothing to do with calling the police.

911 what's your emergency? I was crabbing on a bridge and some thugs were nearby. When I left I heard a bang from 200 yards away. I think it was a .380 but didn't see a gun. Maybe they shot at me. What is your name sir? I don't want to give it. OK we'll have an officer check by the location.

"911 what's your emergency?
I was crabbing on a bridge when some wanna be thugs were nearby, they shot at my fiance and I was a .380 handgun. One of them said he was a felon.
What is your name sir?
I don't want to give it.
Ok we'll have an officer check by the location.

I think the OP 911 call would sound more like that, considering all the things he knew. And if it stops there, and police just have a record of wrong doing, and even if it takes an hour to get out there, it would be the right thing to do. Because if they police do go out there, and do find a felon with a handgun, and do make an arrest, that is one less felon on the streets. You do not care to try and do that, that's fine, OP thinks that fine, no one else thought it is fine. That's life I guess.

I do find it funny how people can say that police are so short staffed/busy/whatever, that they won't investigate a crime without the callers name. How many times do you think police have given the open carrier the name and address of the complainer, how many times have police come out to question someone NOT breaking the law...and then to say they will ignore it when someone HAS broken the law?...hmmm...

I stand by what I said and what 99% of the responders feel. We are glad he isn't hurt (even if he is a troll), we think it was right that he got out of there, we think he was WRONG to not call 911.

 

[BC1]

I do find it funny how people can say that police are so short staffed/busy/whatever, that they won't investigate a crime without the callers name. How many times do you think police have given the open carrier the name and address of the complainer, how many times have police come out to question someone NOT breaking the law...and then to say they will ignore it when someone HAS broken the law?...hmmm...

I stand by what I said and what 99% of the responders feel. We are glad he isn't hurt (even if he is a troll), we think it was right that he got out of there, we think he was WRONG to not call 911.

He could call. It doesn't hurt. LE will eventually do a drive-by on the rats. I just don't think it smart to engage them or file a formal complaint. But the rats have the right to confront the witnesses, not just a complainant. If they toss the gat and clam-up the police pretty much have to let it go. The rats don't have to provide ID or respond at all, especially now that O has curtailed harassing the illegals. Everyone complains when a guy legally OC'ing is stopped and asked for ID. Same holds true for these guys. An anonymous call isn't probable cause in this case any more than when some anti calls about a guy OC'ing.

In my hometown LE wouldn't respond. This goes on all night with the locals. People don't even bother to call.

 

[Firefighterchen]

He could call. It doesn't hurt. LE will eventually do a drive-by on the rats. I just don't think it smart to engage them or file a formal complaint. But the rats have the right to confront the witnesses, not just a complainant. If they toss the gat and clam-up the police pretty much have to let it go. The rats don't have to provide ID or respond at all, especially now that O has curtailed harassing the illegals. Everyone complains when a guy legally OC'ing is stopped and asked for ID. Same holds true for these guys. An anonymous call isn't probable cause in this case any more than when some anti calls about a guy OC'ing.

In my hometown LE wouldn't respond. This goes on all night with the locals. People don't even bother to call.

Even with a formal complaint I don't think the "wanna be thugs" have the right to know who called them in. Not until they are charged with a crime would they have the right to confront all the witnesses. If they toss the gat in the river, great that is one less gat that is in the wrong hands, even if they go out and buy another one, that is money they lost and time they don't have a firearm.

I do not see how you can relate legally open carrying and not having probable cause, to committing an illegal activity and not having a probable cause. Wouldn't that be like saying an anonymous call that a bank robbery is occurring is not probable cause? Or an anonymous call on a drunk driver is not probable cause? Legally open carrying is legal and does not warrant such a response, and yet it does. Illegally discharging a firearm is illegal and does warrant a response, and yet it doesn't.

I brought up the comparison not to compare anonymous calls, but the fact people can say we shouldn't open carry unless we expect to get harassed by police even if its legal. Then they turn around and say police are too busy to go check out a witnessed illegal activity, in this case an alleged attempted killing (cause I don't know of any other reason to illegally shoot a firearm at someone).

 

[BC1]

Just telling what my experiences have been. High crime area. Very busy police. Perps don't answer questions. No one goes to jail.