**Flash Mob**


Grognard Gunny

New member
I wouldn't do a thing the law wouldn't be on my side!!!!! Its not worth the fight hell have at it these places have INSURANCE morons!!!!!!

... and who, pray tell, pays for the cost of business insurance in the long run, my rather limited intelligenced dim wit? Think it through, now. Careful, don't bust a blood vessel.... :sarcastic:

... and another "85" heard from.

GG
 

Firefighterchen

OC for Tactical Advantage
Grognard Gunny:222277 said:
What would you do as another customer if this happened in the store you were in?

who would stand up for what is right and confront them? Who believes its not their problem, and have no duty?

Try to stay out of the way. If, however, the "mob" tried to turn on me or mine....... show time!

GG

How long do we as a society stand by and watch wrong flourish, until we do become completely policed?
 

Chief1297

New member
I can only hope that I would be on the jury when the store owner goes on trial for application of deadly force. I dont know about everyone else but if I am in the store as a owner, when they break out my windows, I would feel that my life is threatened. If the police cant or wont protect me, then I would be forced to protect myself.
 

Grognard Gunny

New member
How long do we as a society stand by and watch wrong flourish, until we do become completely policed?

Just as long as the criteria for "deadly force" is coupled to personal bodily harm. I HAVE to obey the ROE, the BGs never do.

Once upon a time I was paid to "defend" one and all at Government descretion. Damn near got me killed a couple of times. Now that I have a rather limited number of scenarios in which I would feel obligated to go into "Battle Mode" over...... I call that "freedom of choice" with a bit of self preservaton thrown in for good measure.

Like I said, they don't come after me..... it is outside of my realm of concern. Come after me..... different ball game. I WILL be a "good witness" for the follow up, if any, however.

GG
 

swsd40

New member
Flash Mob?? LOL, how cool would it be have auto locking doors, a flashbang, tear gas, then a auto paintgun with hardened paintballs. I mean, some of these prisons use rubber bullets in their shotguns, why not hardened paintballs. anyone stands up, BAM! all while 911 is notified. (some group would probably call that cruel and unusual punishment though).
 

walt629

New member
Flash Mob?? LOL, how cool would it be have auto locking doors, a flashbang, tear gas, then a auto paintgun with hardened paintballs. I mean, some of these prisons use rubber bullets in their shotguns, why not hardened paintballs. anyone stands up, BAM! all while 911 is notified. (some group would probably call that cruel and unusual punishment though).

Unusual yes. Cruel? Nah! The flashbang I think would be the most fun! But having 20 or 30 mobbers running into each other and everything else in the store could cause a lot of dammage that I as the store owner would have to clean up. But the reaction would be worth it!
 

old codger

New member
The problem with "flash mobs" is that they are called "flash" because they are spontaneous by way of the various social sites that are accessible by the new mobile phones. They are called "mobs" because they are a bunch of young people who have nothing else to do but "have fun". They get the mob attitude and don't pay attention to the criminality of their actions. But for the most part they are juveniles or young (?)adults who have never been taught any better and who are not mature yet. They were allowed as young kids (12 to 16) and in some cases younger who hung around the malls with others of like kind with nothing to do and no supervision by parents. Often times their actions amount only to shop lifting or purse snatching and mostly minor misdemeanors. Would you pull your weapon under those circumstances? Not likely. But these mobs lead to other more volital(sp) mobs who are young punks with criminal backgrounds whose purpose is to steal, maim and otherwise cause harm to as many citizens as they can just for the fun of it or in other cases mobs of young blacks attacking whites, asians and latinos as a racial attack. (Most black adults do not support this activity and are vocal againist it). Would you pull your weapoon under those circumstances? So would I! It's a fine line so be sure of yourself and your actions. JMHO [Don't bang me with accusations of racial noises. I am not racial but I've witnessed a lot of these mobs over thirty-five years as a LEO.]
 
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whitetiger

New member
IF you step up in front of them and walk forward and say get out and block their way in when they come forward you can shoot. They were a theat to you. You tryed to stop them by blocking them they came to go over you, your in fear of losing your life. You shoot.
It takes guts to stand in front of them and do that. But that what it takes.
Guts and a shotgun.
 

jg1967

New member
IF you step up in front of them and walk forward and say get out and block their way in when they come forward you can shoot. They were a theat to you. You tryed to stop them by blocking them they came to go over you, your in fear of losing your life. You shoot.
It takes guts to stand in front of them and do that. But that what it takes.
Guts and a shotgun.

I don't know what State you're in but I doubt you'd get away calling that self defense. Not unless they first draw weapons on you. Part of the flash mob "trick" is that they simply show up in a large crowd, walk into a store and carry away stuff. No guns, no violence and they know damned well there's no much you can do against it. Legally.

If it's a mob actually attacking people that's another story of course.
 

Kasper

New member
Uhhh!!!:fie: After reading all 10 pages. I have ended up with the conclusion that most of you that posted have no problem killing someone for stealing $20 worth of items. While that fact bothers me that you place such a low dollar amount on a human life. While their actions are wrong and illegal it does not give you the right to shoot them. Where I live you need to be in fear for your life to use deadly force and having 20 to 30 kids stealing items from the store I am working at does not cause me to fear for my life. The other thing most have forgotten or chose to ignore was there where others in the store when the flash-mob came in, so locking the doors and spraying pepper spray on everyone would not be the wisest thing to do.

And I agree that if this type of behavior is not stopped it will cause the price of items to go up even more to pay for the increase in the insurance premiums. But using force to stop a peaceful mob will cause problems.(Peaceful is being used due to the mob just stealing items and not causing harm to people) None of the people in the flash mob had weapons in their hands mainly due to their hands being full of plundered booty. Now imagine them with weapons in their hands coming to take the items they took. The store clerk can now use deadly force but as soon as he starts shooting them one of two things will happen.

1. The mob sees it members are being dropped and realize that they might be next and leave.

2. The store clerk is now a target that has to be eliminated so the mob can continue to plunder.

While I hope the first one is what happens I don't think it will always be the one that happens.

Ok I can already here some of you calling me names. But to prove my point look at this flash mob where the sore clerk tried to stop the mob by closing the doors.

Link Removed

And yes this flash mob is black and the store clerk was white.
:sarcastic: Damn Blacks why can't you just do flash mobs where you dance like the whites do. I know I said y'all needed to quite dancing all the time but this is the one time I wished y'all were dancing instead of committing a crime and making the rest of us look bad.:sarcastic:


After watching the video you should be able to see why some of us say let them take it for we place a greater importance on our life then the items being stolen. The problem you face when choosing to pull your firearm is how many people will you need to shoot before the mob turns away. What number did you come up with? The firearm I carry has 16 bullet plus the 2 spare mags I carry so that give me 46 bullet. Now lets add 8 seconds to change the magazine if the first 16 bullets did not stop the mob. Do you fell that 8 seconds is enough time to reload your firearm before you are surround by the mob? Ok the if's are high on what one could do but for me it would be safer for me to keep my firearm concealed.
 

TekGreg

New member
Kasper, I didn't want to quote your whole post for the issue of space, but I'm mainly addressing the issues you brought up.

First, the clerk tried to deal with the mob in a non-violent way by simply securing the doors. Who was it that escalated to violence? I don't think any of us are advocating shooting a teenager over a candy bar, but the fact is that a mob acts differently than an individual and that is why in many states you can defend yourself against a mob as if they are armed even if they have no weapons. A mob is equivalent to an armed individual in the amount of damage they can inflict and they have a different mentality which is more likely to inflict it.

This also doesn't have to be a group of black teenagers in a convenience store. This could also be a group of white guys at a football game or a group of Mexicans at Cinco de Mayo - the race and the venue doesn't matter, only the fact that they are a mob and not thinking like an individual with the values and morals of an individual.

Remember this clerks words, "I thought they were going to kill me." And that was only because he tried to close the doors. Do not take these mobs lightly because they are younger or they "only" commit misdemeanors - they will kill you just as soon a look at you if you have something they want, like a car...or a daughter.
 

TekGreg

New member
Kasper, I also thought your reload time might be a bit off. A person trained for tactical reload should be able to completely go from empty gun to stoked in .6 to 1.2 seconds, depending how they carry their magazines, slightly more for revolvers.
 

jg1967

New member
Uhhh!!!:fie: After reading all 10 pages. I have ended up with the conclusion that most of you that posted have no problem killing someone for stealing $20 worth of items. While that fact bothers me that you place such a low dollar amount on a human life. While their actions are wrong and illegal it does not give you the right to shoot them. Where I live you need to be in fear for your life to use deadly force and having 20 to 30 kids stealing items from the store I am working at does not cause me to fear for my life. The other thing most have forgotten or chose to ignore was there where others in the store when the flash-mob came in, so locking the doors and spraying pepper spray on everyone would not be the wisest thing to do.

And I agree that if this type of behavior is not stopped it will cause the price of items to go up even more to pay for the increase in the insurance premiums. But using force to stop a peaceful mob will cause problems.(Peaceful is being used due to the mob just stealing items and not causing harm to people) None of the people in the flash mob had weapons in their hands mainly due to their hands being full of plundered booty. Now imagine them with weapons in their hands coming to take the items they took. The store clerk can now use deadly force but as soon as he starts shooting them one of two things will happen.

1. The mob sees it members are being dropped and realize that they might be next and leave.

2. The store clerk is now a target that has to be eliminated so the mob can continue to plunder.

While I hope the first one is what happens I don't think it will always be the one that happens.

Ok I can already here some of you calling me names. But to prove my point look at this flash mob where the sore clerk tried to stop the mob by closing the doors.

Link Removed

And yes this flash mob is black and the store clerk was white.
:sarcastic: Damn Blacks why can't you just do flash mobs where you dance like the whites do. I know I said y'all needed to quite dancing all the time but this is the one time I wished y'all were dancing instead of committing a crime and making the rest of us look bad.:sarcastic:


After watching the video you should be able to see why some of us say let them take it for we place a greater importance on our life then the items being stolen. The problem you face when choosing to pull your firearm is how many people will you need to shoot before the mob turns away. What number did you come up with? The firearm I carry has 16 bullet plus the 2 spare mags I carry so that give me 46 bullet. Now lets add 8 seconds to change the magazine if the first 16 bullets did not stop the mob. Do you fell that 8 seconds is enough time to reload your firearm before you are surround by the mob? Ok the if's are high on what one could do but for me it would be safer for me to keep my firearm concealed.

I have a problem with shooting flash mobbers. I don't see where you can claim that to be self defense unless they directly attack you. The mobbers are clever in a way, they know as long as they don't get violent people don't exactly have a lot of options.
 

mooseman

New member
This unreal! No respect for the working man. Hopefully the police will be able to identify most of them from the video.
 

Rising2ndSun

New member
Disgraceful! I worked the 11-7AM shift of a similar store in an Eastern Shore college town in the early 80's and a group would come in and one would buy a pack of gum with $20 then while I was counting the change I could hear and see students cramming things into their pockets.
 

G50AE

Well-known member
Be careful not to practice your tacticalness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So when you carry a concealed handgun, do not announce it with trumpets and CCW Badges, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored as sheepdogs and mall ninjas. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you carry a concealed handgun, do not let your attire indicate what you are doing, so that your carrying a handgun may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you by helping you develop increased situational awareness and a tactical mindset.

And when you post on the internet, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to refer to magazines as clips because they think it sounds gangsta. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you post on the internet, first do a Google search for a good glosary of firearms terms. Learn these terms and use them correctly. Then other gunowners, who see what you have done, will reward you with useful information on firearms.

And when you post on the internet, do not keep on growling like kelcarry and wooddoctor, for they think that they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them, instead post useful information for other gunowners, and you too will receive useful information on firearms.

And when you deal with **Flash (Ah-ah) Gordon mobs** do not do as the hypocrites do who love to just whip out their CCW Badges and start blasting away like Han Solo. Instead activate the lightning field, and if you don't have a lightning field set up, have the Spacing Guild fold space over to Dune and barrow the City of Arakeen's house shield that the Atredies installed.
 

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