Cop accidentally shoots self in elevator.
- Thread starter Bob_M
- Start date
BC1
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Yup. People just don't comprehend that statement. Someone once told me "you could have a gun accident, anyone could." Nope. You don't deviate from those safety rules. Not ever. Not even one time. You don't get a "do over."
F
FNWylde
Guest
SkuhReeew the owner's manual. The manufacturer prints that for liability purposes but the gun is simply a tool and the need for self defense predates the existence of gunpowder by at least a couple hundred thousand years, so suggesting the manufacturer and faceless manual writer are an authority over our judgement is foolish. Your argument that a grown adult can not make his or her own choices regarding how to carry a weapon is ridiculous.
I am certain if you posted all the car wrecks from youtube you'd find negligence involved as well, so pull out 100 more ND clips and you could find an equal number of other accidents...most would involve some sort of negligence with the potential for injury and death...big deal...why pick on the gun? Because you get all emotional? Take care of your business how you see fit and others will do the same.
N R A
New member
Good point about eye and ear protection in the owners manuals. I believe it does say chambering rounds is OK for trained Military and LE. Manuals change over the years. I do not think the manual says if you do shoot someone, set the gun down or holster gun before police come and do not wave gun in air wildly to get the police attention. Some things go unsaid in owners manuals. To say the no chambering of rounds is there just to cover Glocks ass liability wise is true. It is also there to cover my ass which is also true. If you guys want to have your asses not covered then go for it.
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The problem comes to light, when we teach new gun people a gun is a useless brick unless it is loaded including one in the CHAMBER. That exact wording in all over the internet by DA people that have never taught a gun class. The I HAVE BEEN DOING IT since I walk to school uphill both ways attitude. The attitude there is only one way to carry, loaded condition 0 or 1.
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The correct attitude is do what is safe and do what you train for. Do you have a child 2 thru infinitely that could get access to your gun in a split second? If you do, you are not being prudent chambering a round.
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Ill take that risk. Well it is not just you taking the risk, it is everyone around you, in a 360 degree 1.5 mile circle. Pardon me if i am uncomfortable with anyones decision to act in a potentially unsafe manor.
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Get a good gun, not a jennings (and certainly not 5 jennings, stupid x 5) or other piece of junk. If no police department uses it, a gun is not acceptable. Period.
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Follow all safety rules and guns owners manual.
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Train. Train with a certified trainer. Doing it the wrong way out your kitchen window while you are scratching your bslls is not training.
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Get a training gun that is the exact match to your gun. Training with a real gun is unneaded wear on your carry gun, and adds risk of ND.
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Practice descalating confrontations.
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Return to the childhood practice of streetlights on, go home. Nothing good happens on dark streets.
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The problem comes to light, when we teach new gun people a gun is a useless brick unless it is loaded including one in the CHAMBER. That exact wording in all over the internet by DA people that have never taught a gun class. The I HAVE BEEN DOING IT since I walk to school uphill both ways attitude. The attitude there is only one way to carry, loaded condition 0 or 1.
.
The correct attitude is do what is safe and do what you train for. Do you have a child 2 thru infinitely that could get access to your gun in a split second? If you do, you are not being prudent chambering a round.
.
Ill take that risk. Well it is not just you taking the risk, it is everyone around you, in a 360 degree 1.5 mile circle. Pardon me if i am uncomfortable with anyones decision to act in a potentially unsafe manor.
.
Get a good gun, not a jennings (and certainly not 5 jennings, stupid x 5) or other piece of junk. If no police department uses it, a gun is not acceptable. Period.
.
Follow all safety rules and guns owners manual.
.
Train. Train with a certified trainer. Doing it the wrong way out your kitchen window while you are scratching your bslls is not training.
.
Get a training gun that is the exact match to your gun. Training with a real gun is unneaded wear on your carry gun, and adds risk of ND.
.
Practice descalating confrontations.
.
Return to the childhood practice of streetlights on, go home. Nothing good happens on dark streets.
It's just too dang entertaining to see what wild scenario N R A is going to come up with next for us to laugh at.
And no police department considers condition 3 to be an acceptable method of carry. Period.
CharlesMorrison
Banned
Link Removed
BC1
,
I always figured an un-chambered firearm is merely a club. Reminds of the guy who used a chain saw to cut trees... without starting it. Dad always said "if you're gonna carry a gun then carry it. Chambered, holstered and ready."
Link Removed
The fellow who posted this picture on GT a few years ago, now, included an apology with the photo: He said that he needed to post this photo because (once upon a time) BEFORE the accident, he was one of those people who NEVER LISTENED, and always thought he knew better. As anyone can see, ....... HE DIDN'T!
It was, nevertheless, considerate of him to finally apologize and caution others like him that it's always less painful to get smart sooner rather than later. In his words, ‘I'm embarrassed; but, for me this post is cathartic!’
I looked for, but could not find the pictures I had of a man with a bloody mangled hand. Shame! That guy used to sleep with a loaded G-20 on his nightstand. Problem is that one night he woke up, and grabbed his G-20 BEFORE he was fully awake. He said he didn't know what had gone wrong; but the loud noise and the searing pain in his support hand jolted him awake to the reality of what had just happened!
N R A, you can't talk to people like these. There's only one way guys like this ever learn; and it always involves blood and tears. Paying attention to what older (wiser) men have to say is beyond their limited intellectual reach. My advice? Stop answering them and move onto something else. Be glad, as well, that you and I have lived long enough to know better, too)
PS: I like your former comments on proper training. :smile:
The fellow who posted this picture on GT a few years ago, now, included an apology with the photo: He said that he needed to post this photo because (once upon a time) BEFORE the accident, he was one of those people who NEVER LISTENED, and always thought he knew better. As anyone can see, ....... HE DIDN'T!
It was, nevertheless, considerate of him to finally apologize and caution others like him that it's always less painful to get smart sooner rather than later. In his words, ‘I'm embarrassed; but, for me this post is cathartic!’
I looked for, but could not find the pictures I had of a man with a bloody mangled hand. Shame! That guy used to sleep with a loaded G-20 on his nightstand. Problem is that one night he woke up, and grabbed his G-20 BEFORE he was fully awake. He said he didn't know what had gone wrong; but the loud noise and the searing pain in his support hand jolted him awake to the reality of what had just happened!
N R A, you can't talk to people like these. There's only one way guys like this ever learn; and it always involves blood and tears. Paying attention to what older (wiser) men have to say is beyond their limited intellectual reach. My advice? Stop answering them and move onto something else. Be glad, as well, that you and I have lived long enough to know better, too)
PS: I like your former comments on proper training. :smile:
N R A
New member
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Thanks for posting this. The only people a chambered round is necessary for is; if someone in a position of authority is ordering you to do so, as in military or LE.
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Joe Blows off the street, taking one gun class, or no gun class, no training, and most likely, no urgent need to carry chambered. People that have never dropped a glass of milk, never spilled anything, never went looking for their car keys, never been distracted by anyone, never interacts with children, and a few thousand other things I could mention, are too absent minded to carry chambered. These people have about as much need to chamber a round, as we need lit cigarettes in fireworks stands. .
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The good thing about this photo and the thousands like it, most often, these clowns, with the big balls, that cannot learn by reading, only shoot themselves.
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I have that hand photo somewhere. The guy was fussing with his Glock, and bang.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Having no idea what this fellow was told, how he was told, by whom he was told, or what failures he himself was responsible for, this is as meaningless as anything else you've posted on the subject.
Besides, since he didn't listen to you, I guess he simply did what you yourself said you "preferred" he do - shoot himself - assuming that he actually did shoot himself and that that picture isn't Photochopped, neither premise am I willing to accept only on your word.
You've really got no business posting here unless you retract or revise your remarks from a couple or three days ago.
Anyone who wishes physical harm caused by a gun on other members for no other reason than simply not agreeing with their tactical decisions has historically been unwelcome here by the general regular membership. Posting that pic and then whining about the guy's belated "consideration" of you after sustaining a disfiguring injury is the height of unjustifiable hubris. No one owes you an apology, you clearly owe that man and all of us who carry chambered an apology for wishing us injury or death just so you can win a "point" on the internet. Even if I used phonetic spelling to get past the auto-censors of this site, there aren't words to describe the level of disgust and contempt I have for you and your "preference" to see other people harmed by guns. You are one sick puppy.
Blues
F
FNWylde
Guest
'if someone in a position of authority is ordering you'
F that...
F that...
N R A
New member
Here is a video, showing we, at times, all have problems with finger control.
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For this kid, it was a trip to the dentist, but we all have days, we are less than 100%. The people that cannot admit that, are only fooling themselves.
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make sure, you have levels of redundancy, layers and layers of protection, of safety. If Condition 3 is not one of them, and that is a very good one, make up for that with others layers.
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For this kid, it was a trip to the dentist, but we all have days, we are less than 100%. The people that cannot admit that, are only fooling themselves.
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make sure, you have levels of redundancy, layers and layers of protection, of safety. If Condition 3 is not one of them, and that is a very good one, make up for that with others layers.
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Last edited by a moderator:
N R A
New member
People have jobs, where training is mandatory, and you carry chambered. I have no problem with that. I have trained with SWAT LE, they are up to the task when on the job. These same guys, also have holes in Dispatch rooms, when they let their guard down, and become people again, making errors.
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It is not so much C3 is a only safe way, it is that it is one good layer one can add to a safety system of carry. Now if you Mexican carry a 1911 in Condition 0, and you have a F that attitude, your day in the ER is coming up soon.
BC1
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NRA, are you a certified PP instructor? Have you ever worked the Tueller Drill in a live-fire scenario? The average perp crosses 25 feet and inflicts a fatal blow or stab in 1.5 seconds. Next consider you didn't see him coming until he closed part of that 25 feet. You cannot... no one I know can... draw, rack and fire. Nearly impossible. Thus the point of carrying the gun for protection is irrelevant. I go as far as to teach "speed rock" draws in PP class to reduce the time necessary to get the gun into defensive play. An un-chambered gun is an extremely bad idea. It's merely a club. Carry it chambered. Practice, practice, practice. A proper draw stroke is both an art and a technical skill that, if not practiced, is a perishable skill. And a fast draw doesn't come from fast hands, it comes from reduction of unnecessary motion. People need to learn the proper draw stroke and work-it hundreds if not thousands of times. The fastest draws I see are often older guys with a lot of experience. Not fast hands at all.
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For my students who refuse to carry chambered I recommend a revolver.
bofh
Banned
Same goes for the Peachtree City police chief that shot his own wife. What does that have to do with carrying a loaded weapon? I store my gun loaded at night, but it requires me to get out of bed to reach it.
You are clearly intellectually superior. :lol:
CharlesMorrison
Banned
Link Removed
N R A
New member
21 feet in 1.5 seconds. Yes, I know. Done it, taught it to students.
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Now how long does it take two toddlers to move that same distance, with the phone ringing, pot boiling over on the stove, mailman at the door with a package, and a migraine headache?
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Back to the elevator officer, with 25 years on the job. Do you suppose he ever trained with his handgun?
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There are times I go cocked, locked, cocked unlocked, cocked, unlocked, un-holstered. One fly's a plane in cloud cover, differently than one does on a 20 mile visual sight day.
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This officer did not need C3, he needed to leave his holster around his gun. We can all agree on that. However, had this chump, had multiple layers of safety, and C3, had been one of them, when he got his brain fart, he would have walked off that elevator intact.
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Now how long does it take two toddlers to move that same distance, with the phone ringing, pot boiling over on the stove, mailman at the door with a package, and a migraine headache?
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Back to the elevator officer, with 25 years on the job. Do you suppose he ever trained with his handgun?
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There are times I go cocked, locked, cocked unlocked, cocked, unlocked, un-holstered. One fly's a plane in cloud cover, differently than one does on a 20 mile visual sight day.
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This officer did not need C3, he needed to leave his holster around his gun. We can all agree on that. However, had this chump, had multiple layers of safety, and C3, had been one of them, when he got his brain fart, he would have walked off that elevator intact.
CharlesMorrison
Banned
AKA, N R A...... that is what he thinks of himself. He believes that only he (it?) Is competent enough to use a firearm safely.
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