Conceal carry unloaded

[Joshtaylor44t]

Hey everyone I'm new to the site. I wanted to seek information from people who know more about this law. I know it is legal to carry an unloaded firearm concealed without a permit. Does this mean there cant be a loaded magazine in the gun? Or can I have a loaded magazine in the gun but not a round chambered? Any comment are appreciated, thanks.

 

[apvbguy]

you KNOW this???

 

[jrs]

The first thing you need to do is tell what state you are talking about. The laws vary substantially from state to state, so you'll get answers that have absolutely nothing to do with your question. For example, in the Socialist Republic of NY, it is not only illegal to carry unloaded, but it is illegal to even touch a handgun without a permit. In other words, if you have a friend with a permit and he lets you handle his/her handgun, under NY law, you are in "illegal possession of a handgun". So... where are you?

 

[stantheman1976]

Hey everyone I'm new to the site. I wanted to seek information from people who know more about this law. I know it is legal to carry an unloaded firearm concealed without a permit. Does this mean there cant be a loaded magazine in the gun? Or can I have a loaded magazine in the gun but not a round chambered? Any comment are appreciated, thanks.

Loaded or unloaded, empty magazine or full, they all mean nothing. If it's a gun and your state requires a permit to own and/or carry one concealed or open you have to follow those laws. A gun doesn't cease being a gun just because you don't put bullets in it. You need to research the laws of the state you live in and any state you may plan to visit if you have your firearm with you. Just because I can carry open in my state without a permit does not in any way, shape, or form mean I can do it the next state over if their state laws say it's not legal.

 

[NavyLCDR]

While we can't help you until we know what state you are talking about, I do have a prediction.... this thread is going to turn into a debate regarding carrying a loaded v. unloaded gun by page 2.

 

[Ghost Rider]

what would be the point of carrying an unloaded gun ?.

 

[bofh]

What would be the purpose of carrying unloaded? Note that, legally speaking, a firearm is never considered unloaded if you have no round in the chamber, but the magazine is loaded and inserted, or, in case of a revolver, any other chamber has a round in it.

Many states have the wording "intend to go armed" in their statues, which is considered equivalent to carrying a loaded firearm. If you have a completely empty gun and a separate loaded magazine on you and both are readily accessible, then it will most likely be considered as "intend to go armed". However, as everyone mentioned, this is state-specific law.

There are state and federal laws about transporting an unloaded firearm that require the gun to be empty and in a locked container, often separated from ammunition. There are also a few states that ignore federal laws, such as the Firearm Owners' Protection Act of 1986 (FOPA) that explicitly regulates inter-state firearm transportation.

Welcome to this Forum and welcome to the world of US gun laws.

 

[BluesStringer]

Post #5
While we can't help you until we know what state you are talking about, I do have a prediction.... this thread is going to turn into a debate regarding carrying a loaded v. unloaded gun by page 2.

Post #6
what would be the point of carrying an unloaded gun ?.

Slam dunk, Navy! LOL

 

[vernsimpson]

The antis want nobody to carry, own or even to see a gun in a museum. I was taught that ALL guns are loaded.

 

[Diehard1]

Why would you even think of carrying either of those ways? Fully loaded, one in the chamber, mag topped off.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Why would you even think of carrying either of those ways? Fully loaded, one in the chamber, mag topped off.

and here we go!

Link Removed

 

[Diehard1]

Hahahahahaha yup. I'm sorry to open that can of worms up. Evidently I should think a bit more before I post. I'll keep to myself now

 

[Joshtaylor44t]

I live in Ohio. And I would rather have a gun on me then not have one. I am 20 years old so I cannot get a ccw permit. But as I understand in most states it is legal to carry one unloaded. So I was asking who knows more about the law. That's why I would carry unloaded I don't have a choice. The world we live in today you shouldn't need a "permit" to defend yourself. But I understand you do need training. So if the law is anyone can conceal carry an unloaded gun what is considered unloaded? If I have a loaded magazine in the gun will I be ok if a round isn't chambered.

 

[Firefighterchen]

I live in Ohio. And I would rather have a gun on me then not have one. I am 20 years old so I cannot get a ccw permit. But as I understand in most states it is legal to carry one unloaded. So I was asking who knows more about the law. That's why I would carry unloaded I don't have a choice. The world we live in today you shouldn't need a "permit" to defend yourself. But I understand you do need training. So if the law is anyone can conceal carry an unloaded gun what is considered unloaded? If I have a loaded magazine in the gun will I be ok if a round isn't chambered.

You should first find the law you are talking about, because I've never heard of a law allowing unloaded concealed carry without permission... unless you live in a constitutional carry state...which wouldn't have a stipulation on loaded or unloaded.

So young one...supply us with the law you think exists....then we can go on from there.

If you can't find the law...then you have a bigger problem to solve than carrying unloaded.

Sent from my HTCONE using USA Carry mobile app

 

[NavyLCDR]

I live in Ohio. And I would rather have a gun on me then not have one. I am 20 years old so I cannot get a ccw permit. But as I understand in most states it is legal to carry one unloaded. So I was asking who knows more about the law. That's why I would carry unloaded I don't have a choice. The world we live in today you shouldn't need a "permit" to defend yourself. But I understand you do need training. So if the law is anyone can conceal carry an unloaded gun what is considered unloaded? If I have a loaded magazine in the gun will I be ok if a round isn't chambered.

You really, really, really need to study Ohio law before you get yourself and someone else in trouble. For example, how did you get this pistol that you want/are carrying around? Whoever gave/sold the handgun to you violated Ohio State Law ORC 2923.21, so if you get stopped by a police officer and they find your gun, whoever gave it to you is on the hook for a FELONY:

Lawriter - ORC - 2923.21 Improperly furnishing firearms to minor.

In addition, Ohio law makes no distinction between loaded and unloaded in regards to carrying a handgun (except in a vehicle, and you better know the definition of unloaded in a vehicle!), although it does look like the handgun being unloaded might reduce the charge from to a misdemeanor rather than a felony:

2923.11 Weapons control definitions.

As used in sections 2923.11 to 2923.24 of the Revised Code:

(A) "Deadly weapon" means any instrument, device, or thing capable of inflicting death, and designed or specially adapted for use as a weapon, or possessed, carried, or used as a weapon.

(B)

(1) "Firearm" means any deadly weapon capable of expelling or propelling one or more projectiles by the action of an explosive or combustible propellant. "Firearm" includes an unloaded firearm, and any firearm that is inoperable but that can readily be rendered operable.

This is the brief version of concealed carry in Ohio:
Lawriter - ORC - 2923.12 Carrying concealed weapons.

2923.12 Carrying concealed weapons.

(A) No person shall knowingly carry or have, concealed on the person's person or concealed ready at hand, any of the following:

(1) A deadly weapon other than a handgun;

(2) A handgun other than a dangerous ordnance;

(3) A dangerous ordnance.

No distinction made in that section between unloaded and loaded, except that unloaded WITH NO AMMUNITION READILY AT HAND is only a misdemeanor and not a felony:

(F)

(1) Whoever violates this section is guilty of carrying concealed weapons. Except as otherwise provided in this division or division (F)(2) of this section, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a misdemeanor of the first degree. Except as otherwise provided in this division or division (F)(2) of this section, if the offender previously has been convicted of a violation of this section or of any offense of violence, if the weapon involved is a firearm that is either loaded or for which the offender has ammunition ready at hand, or if the weapon involved is dangerous ordnance, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a felony of the fourth degree. Except as otherwise provided in division (F)(2) of this section, if the offense is committed aboard an aircraft, or with purpose to carry a concealed weapon aboard an aircraft, regardless of the weapon involved, carrying concealed weapons in violation of division (A) of this section is a felony of the third degree.

This is your Ohio law regarding transporting a firearm in a vehicle:

Lawriter - ORC - 2923.16 Improperly handling firearms in a motor vehicle.

And the reason I said you better know the definition of unloaded in a vehicle is because of this:

(a) "Unloaded" means

, with respect to a firearm other than a firearm described in division (K)(6) of this section, that no ammunition is in the firearm in question, no magazine or speed loader containing ammunition is inserted into the firearm in question , and one of the following applies:

(i) There is no ammunition in a magazine or speed loader that is in the vehicle in question and that may be used with the firearm in question.

(ii) Any magazine or speed loader that contains ammunition and that may be used with the firearm in question is stored in a compartment within the vehicle in question that cannot be accessed without leaving the vehicle or is stored in a container that provides complete and separate enclosure.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

I suggest pepper spray gel and NRA pistol classes until you can apply for a CCW.

Don't go stupid places, with stupid people, and do stupid things.
Link Removed

 

[SR9]

Carrying empty but concealed is like having a empty fire extinguisher in your house when it catches on fire. What good is it?

 

[bofh]

I live in Ohio. And I would rather have a gun on me then not have one. I am 20 years old so I cannot get a ccw permit. But as I understand in most states it is legal to carry one unloaded. So I was asking who knows more about the law. That's why I would carry unloaded I don't have a choice. The world we live in today you shouldn't need a "permit" to defend yourself. But I understand you do need training. So if the law is anyone can conceal carry an unloaded gun what is considered unloaded? If I have a loaded magazine in the gun will I be ok if a round isn't chambered.

See http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/ohio.pdf for starters and follow the links to the corresponding codes.

Anyhow, see Lawriter - ORC - 2923.16 Improperly handling firearms in a motor vehicle. for what is considered a loaded handgun in the sate of Ohio (I added the bold):

2923.16 Improperly handling firearms in a motor vehicle.

...

(K) As used in this section:

...

(5)

(a) "Unloaded" means

, with respect to a firearm other than a firearm described in division (K)(6) of this section, that no ammunition is in the firearm in question, no magazine or speed loader containing ammunition is inserted into the firearm in question , and one of the following applies:

(i) There is no ammunition in a magazine or speed loader that is in the vehicle in question and that may be used with the firearm in question.

(ii) Any magazine or speed loader that contains ammunition and that may be used with the firearm in question is stored in a compartment within the vehicle in question that cannot be accessed without leaving the vehicle or is stored in a container that provides complete and separate enclosure.

(b) For the purposes of division (K)(5)(a)(ii) of this section, a "container that provides complete and separate enclosure" includes, but is not limited to, any of the following:

(i) A package, box, or case with multiple compartments, as long as the loaded magazine or speed loader and the firearm in question either are in separate compartments within the package, box, or case, or, if they are in the same compartment, the magazine or speed loader is contained within a separate enclosure in that compartment that does not contain the firearm and that closes using a snap, button, buckle, zipper, hook and loop closing mechanism, or other fastener that must be opened to access the contents or the firearm is contained within a separate enclosure of that nature in that compartment that does not contain the magazine or speed loader;

(ii) A pocket or other enclosure on the person of the person in question that closes using a snap, button, buckle, zipper, hook and loop closing mechanism, or other fastener that must be opened to access the contents.

(c) For the purposes of divisions (K)(5)(a) and (b) of this section, ammunition held in stripper-clips or in en-bloc clips is not considered ammunition that is loaded into a magazine or speed loader.

These laws vary widely between states. For example, this is from my home state, Tennessee (I added the bold):

39-17-1307. Unlawful carrying or possession of a weapon.

(a) (1) A person commits an offense who carries with the intent to go armed a firearm, a knife with a blade length exceeding four inches (4''), or a club.

(2) (A) The first violation of subdivision (a)(1) is a Class C misdemeanor, and, in addition to possible imprisonment as provided by law, may be punished by a fine not to exceed five hundred dollars ($500).

(B) A second or subsequent violation of subdivision (a)(1) is a Class B misdemeanor.

(C) A violation of subdivision (a)(1) is a Class A misdemeanor if the person's carrying of a handgun occurred at a place open to the public where one (1) or more persons were present.

(b) (1) A person commits an offense who unlawfully possesses a firearm, as defined in § 39-11-106, and:

(A) Has been convicted of a felony involving the use or attempted use of force, violence, or a deadly weapon; or

(B) Has been convicted of a felony drug offense.

(2) An offense under subdivision (b)(1)(A) is a Class C felony.

(3) An offense under subdivision (b)(1)(B) is a Class D felony.

(c) (1) A person commits an offense who possesses a handgun and has been convicted of a felony.

(2) An offense under subdivision (c)(1) is a Class E felony.

(d) (1) A person commits an offense who possesses a deadly weapon other than a firearm with the intent to employ it during the commission of, attempt to commit, or escape from a dangerous offense as defined in § 39-17-1324.

(2) A person commits an offense who possesses any deadly weapon with the intent to employ it during the commission of, attempt to commit, or escape from any offense not defined as a dangerous offense by § 39-17-1324.

(3) A violation of this subsection (d) is a Class E felony.

(e) (1) It is an exception to the application of subsection (a) that a person authorized to carry a handgun pursuant to § 39-17-1351 is transporting a rifle or shotgun in or on a privately-owned motor vehicle and the rifle or shotgun does not have ammunition in the chamber. However, the person does not violate this section by inserting ammunition into the chamber if the ammunition is inserted for purposes of justifiable self-defense pursuant to § 39-11-611 or § 39-11-612.

(2) It is an exception to the application of subsection (a) that a person who is not authorized to possess a handgun pursuant to § 39-17-1351 is transporting a rifle or shotgun in or on a privately-owned motor vehicle and the rifle or shotgun does not have ammunition in the chamber or cylinder, and no clip or magazine containing ammunition is inserted in the rifle or shotgun or is in close proximity to both the weapon and any person.

(f) (1) A person commits an offense who possesses a firearm, as defined in § 39-11-106(a), and:

(A) Has been convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence as defined in 18 U.S.C. § 921, and is still subject to the disabilities of such a conviction;

(B) Is, at the time of the possession, subject to an order of protection that fully complies with 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(8); or

(C) Is prohibited from possessing a firearm under any other provision of state or federal law.

(2) If the person is licensed as a federal firearms dealer or a responsible party under a federal firearms license, the determination of whether such an individual possesses firearms that constitute the business inventory under the federal license shall be determined based upon the applicable federal statutes or the rules, regulations and official letters, rulings and publications of the bureau of alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives.

(3) For purposes of this section, a person does not possess a firearm, including, but not limited to, firearms registered under the National Firearms Act, compiled in 26 U.S.C. § 5801 et seq., if the firearm is in a safe or similar container that is securely locked and to which the respondent does not have the combination, keys or other means of normal access.

(4) A violation of subdivision (f)(1) is a Class A misdemeanor and each violation constitutes a separate offense.

(5) If a violation of subdivision (f)(1) also constitutes a violation of § 36-3-625(h) or § 39-13-113(h), the respondent may be charged and convicted under any or all such sections.

 

[bofh]

You really, really, really need to study Ohio law before you get yourself and someone else in trouble. For example, how did you get this pistol that you want/are carrying around? Whoever gave/sold the handgun to you violated Ohio State Law ORC 2923.21, so if you get stopped by a police officer and they find your gun, whoever gave it to you is on the hook for a FELONY:

Lawriter - ORC - 2923.21 Improperly furnishing firearms to minor.

Well, there is that minor detail.

 

[Diehard1]

You would be in trouble. Just wait until you're 21. Don't mess things up at the home stretch here. I believe that you would be asking for trouble by doing that. Be honest with yourself and think if it sounds like a good idea. Also, what would your advice be to someone asking you that very question? Do you think that LE would actually say "well, there's no mag in it, so carry on" or "since there's not a round in the chamber, you're all set" One last bit here, is, do you see anyone else doing this? If not, do you think that it's because nobody else ever thought to do it, or that it's illegal and if you get caught, you just might be prohibited for life after all the legal trouble and charges. I don't want to sound mean or condescending here at all, that is not my intention, but for your own well being, please try not to walk near or on such a fine line, or thin ice. You are so close to being 21 here, just be patient, and you will be where you want to be very shortly. I was very eager at that age too my friend. I understand, I really do. You can still train in the meantime though. Take classes. Get educated. Take in all the info and gain as much good knowledge as you can during this period. It will help the time pass quicker, and you will have less questions, and problems later when you do get your permit. Also, when you apply for it, you will have a very good resume, and your local pd will recognize all the time and effort that you've already invested in this, and feel much more comfortable about issuing you a conceal carry permit. Do you think that they'd feel confident issuing it to you after catching you carrying illegally or pushing the envelope even? You must make sure that you can make them fully confidant that you are mature, responsible enough, and have the ability to make good logical decisions before you go and apply. Stay well away from anything that even resembles, or has even a potential for any type of trouble. Avoidance. Detour acne, and anticipate. Please don't take this as a lecture or any type of insult what so ever. I'm only trying to answer your question and give you some solid advice here. I don't want to see anybody with a legit question or concern get in trouble, especially this kind, when the only thing you actually have to do at this point is wait. If you print, and some anti gun wuss drops a dime on you, you are done. Think about what has happened to some people that do have the proper permit, and are well within the confines of the law, that get their permit pulled over some BS and have never been in any type of trouble before. It's not worth it. Keep busy. Work hard. Train. Save 15k so when you do get your permit you can go out and buy a ton of HKs, colts, and maybe even a nice big pallet of ammo.