Mental Illness / Mental Disability

[hillking2010]

http://www.care2.com/causes/family-of-autistic-man-kileed-by-police.html


http://www.alternet.org/killed-cops-over-movie-ticket-how-police-hurt-disabled

Here're two examples. You know, we come to forums to talk with brothers and sisters who like guns and defense, something that you can't always find in society. But when I get here I get berated. The reason that I only have a few posts is because I just started using the forums. For all of you who called me a troll and an anti-gunner because I didn't provide research, maybe you should have done some research of your own and read my other posts. You'd see that they are all about what gun and holster I carry with.

If you feel like someone hasn't followed the correct procedure for something how about pointing it out to them instead of automatically calling them a troll. If you saw someone unwittingly violating the common practices of your local range would you help them or lash out at them? You're acting like the rest of the Internet people who use the anonymity of the internet as an excuse to act like dicks.

 

[Kramer1113]

Dude, read the post, they were looking at books. Where did the person buying a gun come from?

The Term "Potentially Kill" Leads me to believe the OP suspected a weapon of some kind may be possessed, Gun, Knife, Spear, Ice pick, hatchet, axe, hammer, lawn dart, piano wire...
No matter, I would still like the OP to answer the questions?
I'm not going to be the only one who has to remain 100% on topic here.
We have someone here who has given testimony to their ability to recognize mental illness, I want to hear from them their opinion on the subject. These are two questions from me to the OP and no one else. If someone wishes to give their 2¢ worth that's fine but the questions were not for them.

 

[apvbguy]

The OP Suspected the individual of something, Thus, a Suspect, Duh Florida boy.

Not a LEO anymore, Just someone who accepts responsibility. I don't expect that from anyone but I give it freely. I once took and oath that I believe has no expiration date except upon my death.
I do not expect the same from you.

Troll? You Can come over here and Kiss my As$.

if you like playing cop or super hero good for you, have fun , as for kissing your a$$, sorry but you'll need to look for someone else to get you off

 

[hillking2010]

My real answer would be to continue to move around the store and watch the suspect. I say suspect because she was suspected of something.

My question to the OP is: Should this woman be permitted to purchase and own a firearm?
Would you be comfortable with 100% of the people you work with to own firearms?

Imho, no to both questions. She displayed behaviors consistent with a significant mental handicap. I don't believe she has the cognitive ability to responsibly own and handle a firearm. You could liken it the the reasons that we have an age requirement for purchasing firearms.

I also don't think that all of the people I encounter in a professional should be able to. People who have poor reality perception (paranoid schizophrenics, for example) have the ability to safely posses a firearm. My state (SC) recently passed a law adding mental health as part of the criteria for purchasing a gun. If someone has ever been declared incompetent by a court then they are not allowed to purchase firearms. I think that this is a fair law because it applies to a very limited part of the population and a person's illness or disability must be severe to warrant this label.

Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

 

[GlassWolf]

Would you be comfortable with 100% of the people you work with to own firearms?

I work for a weapons manufacturer. :haha:

 

[wolf_fire]

Family of Autistic Man Killed By Police Win Suit Against Los Angeles | Care2 Causes


Killed by Cops Over a Movie Ticket: How Police Hurt the Disabled | Alternet

Here're two examples. You know, we come to forums to talk with brothers and sisters who like guns and defense, something that you can't always find in society. But when I get here I get berated. The reason that I only have a few posts is because I just started using the forums. For all of you who called me a troll and an anti-gunner because I didn't provide research, maybe you should have done some research of your own and read my other posts. You'd see that they are all about what gun and holster I carry with.

If you feel like someone hasn't followed the correct procedure for something how about pointing it out to them instead of automatically calling them a troll. If you saw someone unwittingly violating the common practices of your local range would you help them or lash out at them? You're acting like the rest of the Internet people who use the anonymity of the internet as an excuse to act like dicks.

Seriously, I asked you twice to provide information backing up your claim that LEO's frequently kill mentally ill people. Your response was for me to look it up myself, and then you respond this way?

I've been nothing but considerate of you. Don't go blasting everyone on this thread because ONE person called you a troll. This is the same broadstroking you did to LEO's in your OP. Stop making generalizations about people and you won't get hounded so hard. You do realize there are a lot of LEO's in this forum, right? They may take umbrage with you saying they frequently kill mentally ill people, especially with no evidence that this is a common occurrence (frequent and common occurrence are synonymous).

Concerning your examples, they are tragic. However, it still doesn't back up your claim that LEO's in general frequently kill people who are mentally ill. You just provided two cases where it happened.

 

[hillking2010]

Seriously, I asked you twice to provide information backing up your claim that LEO's frequently kill mentally ill people. Your response was for me to look it up myself, and then you respond this way?

I've been nothing but considerate of you. Don't go blasting everyone on this thread because ONE person called you a troll. This is the same broadstroking you did to LEO's in your OP. Stop making generalizations about people and you won't get hounded so hard. You do realize there are a lot of LEO's in this forum, right? They may take umbrage with you saying they frequently kill mentally ill people, especially with no evidence that this is a common occurrence (frequent and common occurrence are synonymous).

Concerning your examples, they are tragic. However, it still doesn't back up your claim that LEO's in general frequently kill people who are mentally ill. You just provided two cases where it happened.

If you'll notice I said "somewhat frequent" , how many tragedies would it need to be before you'd quantify it as "somewhat frequent." Unlike you I do pay attention to what I read, so I know that there are LEOs here. My best friend is an MP, so I am not disrespecting LEOs. That is why I SPECIFICALLY mention an issue of training, not with individuals.

Do you want me to list every incident of these events? I have a life outside of this forum. Please excuse me, though, for trying to bring up an interesting topic on this site. I apologize for not meeting your standards.

Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

 

[Kramer1113]

if you like playing cop or super hero good for you, have fun , as for kissing your a$$, sorry but you'll need to look for someone else to get you off

WoW, You were born in Florida weren't you?

 

[Kramer1113]

Imho, no to both questions. She displayed behaviors consistent with a significant mental handicap. I don't believe she has the cognitive ability to responsibly own and handle a firearm. You could liken it the the reasons that we have an age requirement for purchasing firearms.

I also don't think that all of the people I encounter in a professional should be able to. People who have poor reality perception (paranoid schizophrenics, for example) have the ability to safely posses a firearm. My state (SC) recently passed a law adding mental health as part of the criteria for purchasing a gun. If someone has ever been declared incompetent by a court then they are not allowed to purchase firearms. I think that this is a fair law because it applies to a very limited part of the population and a person's illness or disability must be severe to warrant this label.

Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

I appreciate your honesty and professional opinion.

 

[hillking2010]

Thanks Kramer, I'm glad to help in any way. I've learned a lot from knowledgeable, respectful people on this forum and it helped me a ton when I started carrying.

Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using Tapatalk

 

[wolf_fire]

If you'll notice I said "somewhat frequent" , how many tragedies would it need to be before you'd quantify it as "somewhat frequent." Unlike you I do pay attention to what I read, so I know that there are LEOs here. My best friend is an MP, so I am not disrespecting LEOs. That is why I SPECIFICALLY mention an issue of training, not with individuals.

Do you want me to list every incident of these events? I have a life outside of this forum. Please excuse me, though, for trying to bring up an interesting topic on this site. I apologize for not meeting your standards.

Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

lmao... you still don't get it... you have taken nearly everything that people have responded to you personally and it's not personal, at least it hasn't been from me.

When you make wide broad stroking claims as you have, you should be prepared to back it up. You have failed to do so. These aren't my standards, these are common standards in debate, argumentation, and basic conversation. You bring up an issue and take one side... all we have done is ask you to verify the frequency since you have mentioned how frequent it is (provide statistics, don't show us that it has happened with two incidences). Instead you have taken personal umbrage at our questions.

I have yet to make anything personal with our conversation, yet you use terminology such as "I apologize for not meeting your standards." and "I have a life outside of this forum." and "Unlike you I pay attention." Seriously?

When people make outrageous claims, I ask them to verify their claims because they just might have some legitimacy... you haven't verified but you have attacked, ridiculed and mocked. This makes me tend to believe that what you claim is merely an opinion instead. Great argumentation strategy; and you wonder why one us thought you may be a troll. At this point you are not worth conversing with any longer. I've tried, but you don't wish to engage in good decent discussion.

 

[hillking2010]

lmao... you still don't get it... you have taken nearly everything that people have responded to you personally and it's not personal, at least it hasn't been from me.

When you make wide broad stroking claims as you have, you should be prepared to back it up. You have failed to do so. These aren't my standards, these are common standards in debate, argumentation, and basic conversation. You bring up an issue and take one side... all we have done is ask you to verify the frequency since you have mentioned how frequent it is (provide statistics, don't show us that it has happened with two incidences). Instead you have taken personal umbrage at our questions.

I have yet to make anything personal with our conversation, yet you use terminology such as "I apologize for not meeting your standards." and "I have a life outside of this forum." and "Unlike you I pay attention." Seriously?

When people make outrageous claims, I ask them to verify their claims because they just might have some legitimacy... you haven't verified but you have attacked, ridiculed and mocked. This makes me tend to believe that what you claim is merely an opinion instead. Great argumentation strategy; and you wonder why one us thought you may be a troll. At this point you are not worth conversing with any longer. I've tried, but you don't wish to engage in good decent discussion.

Link Removed


Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

 

[Stengun]

Howdy apvbguy,

I guess that you've never spent much time in places like NYC, LA or one of many other larger US cities where encounters with unstable/mentally ill people are almost a daily occurrence

You forgot to mention USACarry.

Paul