Hey, how's it goin'?
As an avid gun rights activist and soon-to-be LEO (going through the hiring process with my local PD as we speak), I would like to start a general discussion concerning attitudes and opinions concerning Law Enforcement and legal carry.
OK, but some of my responses to your questions will be coming from the perspective that you are already an LEO and some will likewise be in the form of questions that I would ask you if you were contacting me involuntarily.
This is not meant to vilify either side or start a flame war.
Nor will my answers (or questions) be intended as such, but they will be direct, and they will be firmly-rooted in my expectation that LEO's have as much obligation to protect and defend my rights as I have to follow the laws they enforce.
Please use personal experience and empirical data as primary sources.
No problem. You, of course, will operate under the same rules, right?
That being said, how do you view the police when it comes to your right to carry?
I view police as a potential threat to me exercising any and all of my rights, including my right to live. Empirical evidence for the prudence of this view would be Oscar Grant, Kelly Thomas, Jose Guerena and hundreds, if not thousands, of both better and lesser-known cases of jack-booted-thuggery under color of legal authority that happen across this country on a virtual daily basis.
If I had to limit my response to only interactions with LEO's about my right to carry, I view them as many times more threatening to the free exercise of my rights than say, my 1st Amendment rights or 5th Amendment rights.
I view LE as the most visible symbol of tyranny. I view today's government(s) as organized criminal enterprises, and LEO's as their enforcers, meaning that your predecessors have polluted the image of LE as illegitimate anymore for many out here in flyover country. The rule not to snitch on each other is enforced as hard and fast as the Mafia, Aryan Brotherhood, MS13 and all other gangster enterprises, but it's worse with cops because when they murder, injure or violate the rights of other citizens, their partners on the scene, prosecutors and judges are so often in their corner that even if they are prosecuted, which is rare in and of itself, they get nothing-sentences or acquitted due to how lackadaisical the prosecutor was, or how many bogus rulings on evidence the judge made. Empirical evidence again, Oscar Grant, Kelly Thomas, Jose Guerena and hundreds, if not thousands, of both better and lesser-known cases of jack-booted-thuggery under color of legal authority that happen across this country on a virtual daily basis.
How do you approach law enforcement while carrying (traffic stop, open carry stop, etc)?
First off, they approach me, I
never voluntarily approach them (
anymore).
Let's get the traffic stop out of the way first. I have no duty to notify, and I don't/won't. I do have an obligation to answer in the affirmative if asked according to the carry statutes here, and I will follow the law, but I will continue to work to repeal that part of the law in the meantime because it's dumb, doesn't provide any safety to the LEO at all, and is an invasion of both my privacy and my rights. Otherwise, at a traffic stop, I will give my license, registration and proof of insurance, sign the ticket if the cop gives me one, but in either case, I will not answer questions about where I've been, where I'm going, have I been drinking blah blah blah. I will follow the law, and so will the cop, lest they be the subject of a suit for whatever violations of my rights or abuses of authority ensue because of me invoking my rights to remain silent.
How would I respond at an "open carry stop" though? First, there's no such animal here in Alabama. If OC is the only reason I'm being contacted, the cop has already overstepped his bounds. Otherwise, remember, these are questions that I'm asking you as an LEO. Please answer them the way you would if we were in a street-encounter. Ready?
1) "Am I being detained?"
(Assuming the answer is "No") "OK, see ya." End of encounter.
(If answer is "Yes") 2) "What law am I suspected of breaking?" (You need articulable suspicion of a crime either already having been committed, or about to be committed before you can legally force me into an involuntary contact.)
If the answer to #2 is something along the lines of, "You're not under suspicion of committing any crime 'yet,' I'm just trying to find out what's going on here since you're walking around with a gun on your hip," I will refer them to Terry vs. Ohio and remind them that open carry is not illegal here in Alabama. I would remind them as well that under Alabama law and Terry, an openly carried weapon sans any suspicion of any real crime either having been or about to be committed does not qualify as a legal reason to force an involuntary interaction on a citizen.
3) At that point, the last thing I would say before clamming up completely is, "Am I free to go?" If the answer is "No," I will invoke my 5th Amendment right to remain silent and deal appropriately with whatever lawless actions the LEO(s) impose on me from there.
So I've asked three questions of you above. Answer 'em and we'll go from there on what my attitudes/actions would be depending on your responses to them.
I'd like to get a more widespread scope of popular opinion since I am about to be entering "the other side", for lack of a better phrase.
Actually, considering today's culture of corruption within government from the top down to street-level cops, that is a perfect phrase to use. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but you asked for opinions, and I've given mine, while trying not to be rude or personally insulting or provoking at all. If you want to answer my questions, have at it. If not, you got exactly from me what you asked for. You will definitely encounter folks with my attitudes and responses to cops when you're out on the street. I seriously hope it makes you think about what you're getting into, but if not, c'est la vie, you asked, I answered honestly. Good luck to you and to the people you will encounter over the next 20, 30, or 40 years (assuming you're fairly young).
Blues
