TruckTurner68
Chaplain
Not good
Florida warning shot bill passed. (The Wild West down here)
- Thread starter walknotinfear
- Start date
Rhino
New member
What's not good?
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Until Scott signs the new law into effect, what you describe is considered brandishing under current FL law, and carries a mandatory minimum of 10 years in prison.
Rhino
New member
If, as he stated, it's done in self defense, then it isn't a violation under Florida Statutes 790.10.
.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
It's like that carnival ride the "Spinner" in here anymore. The whole reason the new law was written was because prosecutors were ignoring the self-defense and "in commission of a crime" parts of the law, and imposing the 10/20/Life mandatory minimums on all displays as criminal threatening. It's in the thread somewhere here. Go find it. I'm sick of doing other people's reading for them.
Blues
Nightmare45
NRA LIFE MEMBER
If I am defending my life or my families life, it is not the display of the weapon that will be the issue.
Rhino
New member
I know it's here because I found and referenced it earlier. I think you're letting the emotion from another thread carry over here and you're assuming a challenge here that doesn't exist. I wasn't suggesting you look anything up. That's why I posted the statute. There is no "in commission of a crime" provision in 790.10 and they aren't ignoring the self-defense provision in it. They're twisting the affirmative defense provision of the Florida 'stand your ground' law so the self-defense provision in 790.10 never gets a chance to be applied. They're improperly shifting the burden of proof for self defense over to the victim rather than to the prosecution where it belongs. It's castle doctrine ('stand your ground') that they're ignoring, not 790.10. But in this case I was just pointing out that the display a weapon in self defense is not illegal under 790.10 (Florida doesn't actually have a "brandishing" statute). I'm not your enemy, dude. You can call off the guard dogs.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Let me rephrase with the addition of only two words, the original post of mine that you replied to and tell me if you would have still corrected me on what the law actually says.
If it was just those two words left out of my first post that you felt required arguing minutia over, then just scroll on by the next time you see me post. I know that the current law is being misapplied, and that was precisely my point, but regardless of whether or not the application of the law was at issue, or the letter of the law was, the whole reason for the new law is that people are being successfully prosecuted for brandishing in situations where actually pulling the trigger would have been justified, and they're serving draconian mandatory minimum prison sentences for it too.
If you've got more gnat's nose hairs to split, I'd really appreciate you just saving it, dude.
Blues
Rhino
New member
Those words aren't the issue I was disputing, but I agree we're arguing minutia, and I'm more than willing to drop it.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
BluesStringer
Les Brers
You are misunderstanding the word "brandishing" as applied by prosecutors and the courts in the state of FL. No waving around is necessary to get 10 years mandatory minimum, and firing a shot increases the sentence to 20 years. Injuring or killing someone by hitting them with a bullet only intended as a threat of force (or warning shot if you prefer), increases the mandatory minimum to Life. The mere showing of a weapon (putting your hand on it) has been enough in some cases for LEOs, prosecutors, courts and juries filled with morons to misapply the mandatory minimum sentences to such an extent that the legislature decided to preempt it from continuing to happen, thus the headlines with the misnomer for the new law, "Warning Shots Bill Passed."
Here is a very detailed analysis of what the new bill actually does. Under current law as applied in the state of FL, simply putting your hand on your weapon can be construed as an illegal threat of force, regardless of what the self defense code sections say to the contrary.
Blues
Rhino
New member
You thought that was pushing? I thought I was just pointing out that we weren't arguing the same thing, hence the impasse. But I still take full blame for the arguing of minutia. It was really boring in that hospital bed and I was looking for any distraction I could get. Getting overly fixated on details is something I can tend to do when I'm bored. Sorry.
Rhino
New member
I have to provide clarification again. This isn't brandishing, nor is it a differing application of the brandishing statute. You cannot be subject to the Florida 10-20-life law simply by displaying a firearm, no matter how you apply the statute. That's part of what the media and anti-gunners keep getting wrong here. Florida's 'brandishing' law, 790.10, is only a first degree misdemeanor. The 10-20-life statute, 775.087, only applies to felonies committed with a firearm where the firearm is not an essential element of the crime. So these defendants are being found guilty of some different crime, a felony, that is being used to subject them to the 10-20-life rule. It isn't brandishing itself that's getting them that sentence, nor is it the application of the 'brandishing' statute. What the prosecutors and/or judges are abusing is the use of self defense, or the threat of it, as an affirmative defense and improperly placing the burden of proof on the person who defended themselves against an aggressor. That's what this new legislation is designed to fix. These people are being found guilty of some felony, whether it be proper or improper. Then they use the presence of a gun, displayed or threatened, under 775.087 to give them a 10-20-life mandatory sentence without allowing self defense as an affirmative defense as Florida law provides for. And I said improper or improper before because the 10-20-life mandatory sentence can be improperly applied even against people who were properly convicted of felonies, not just those who are completely innocent of all charges. These people aren't being sentenced under Florida's 'brandishing' statute. This really is no different than other sentence 'enhancements' elsewhere that provide for stiffer penalties if you commit a crime while you also have a gun, but the gun itself wasn't actually part of the crime. Usually those kinds of sentences are handed down to drug dealers that they arrest and find them carrying a gun. The problem in this case is that the mandatory sentence, 'enhancement' law, 775.087, is the statute that's being misapplied to circumstances of self defense, and the prosecutors/courts aren't allowing the affirmative defense that the law allows for in those circumstances. Or at least it didn't allow for an affirmative defense in the case of Marissa Alexander.
Rhino
New member
The anti-gunners have predicted the wild west whenever just about any pro-gun or pro-self defense legislation has been introduced, and the shootouts in the streets they predicted have never happened. The real tragedy in that is the media that lets them get away with making those claims over and over again without calling them on it. They happily reprint them time and time again even when they more than anyone else know how hollow those claims truly are.
mappow
New member
The only Wild West happening is in Gun free zones, Chicago, NYC, DC, Jersey. You know the Lib States with the strictest gum Laws. Oh , can't forget about Maryland and that beautiful city of Baltimore. Between there and Chi town I would think the EPA would listed them on the Super Fund for clean up of all the lead on the ground. ��
I don't believe in firing a warning shot,The fact that im holding a gun,pointed towards the thug,should be all the warning I/he needs,And,if the thug has any sense at all,he SHOULD realize whats coming next,BUT,if you fire a warning shot,point the gun,and shoot into the ground,theres no reason for another person to be shot,by a bullet fired into the air,
Buster04
New member
When we get the OK Corral completed then the fun will start but until then things have been pretty calm here in central Florida
