PoliceOne's Gun Control Survey: 11 key lessons from officers' perspectives
Not in regards to background checks specifically.
Fastest Brady response yet.....
- Thread starter NavyLCDR
- Start date
PoliceOne's Gun Control Survey: 11 key lessons from officers' perspectives
Not in regards to background checks specifically.
Still no info on whether this was a gun free zone. I found an old link that states the school allowed concealed carry as provided by law, an apparently Oregon allows licensed concealed carry on college campuses.
So is this another example of a mass shooting in a non-gun free zone, proving once again that the nuts don't care whether or not anyone might have a gun?
The whole "gun free zone" chant is inane to begin with. it starts with an idiotic assumption that the nut who is willing to break the law to carry a gun thinks no one else would do the same.
It makes anyone who screams "gun free zone" look like an uneducated mentally challenged product of inbreeding.
Everyone who is not disqualified from owning a firearm, should be able to carry a firearm for self defense. Trying to add to the justification for doing so with irrational arguments like the b"gun free zone" claim just distracts from the issue and gives the anti's a softball argument to hit out of the park.
So is this another example of a mass shooting in a non-gun free zone, proving once again that the nuts don't care whether or not anyone might have a gun?
The whole "gun free zone" chant is inane to begin with. it starts with an idiotic assumption that the nut who is willing to break the law to carry a gun thinks no one else would do the same.
It makes anyone who screams "gun free zone" look like an uneducated mentally challenged product of inbreeding.
Everyone who is not disqualified from owning a firearm, should be able to carry a firearm for self defense. Trying to add to the justification for doing so with irrational arguments like the b"gun free zone" claim just distracts from the issue and gives the anti's a softball argument to hit out of the park.
Oldgrunt
Well-known member
A criminal "safe zone."
Thanks for the link!
vernsimpson
New member
Thanks Navy for posting this link. While I wish the left, libs and anti's would read this I know what they would say after reading this.
They would use the old line, "If just one child could be saved it would be worth it."
They would never consider the fact that even more children would be killed!! They say they want to save the "innocent" from guns by taking away our right to bear arms but will defend the woman's right to abort!! SICK!!!!
Reloader54
New member
Yes, it was reported the this college was a gun free zone.
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bofh
Banned
Correct, it was reported that this college was a gun free zone. However, this college was not and is not a gun free zone. Like so many other things that were reported, this was plain misinformation by the media (including by FOX News).
There was at least one concealed carrier on campus on that day: TTAG | Update: ARMED Veteran Prevented from Stopping Oregon Shooter by School Staff [VIDEO].
There was and is no armed security at this college by choice: NBC News | Umpqua Community College Considered Armed Guard, Dismissed Idea.
Reloader54
New member
No it was reported that this college had in its policy that this campus was a gun free zone. So it was reported as being a gun free zone campus.
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Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
bofh
Banned
I don't care what was reported, I care about what the law says. It looks like it is complicated. Interesting read: Link Removed. I got this from The Dana Show | After UCC Tragedy, White House Calls For Stronger Gun Laws. In conclusion I stand corrected, UCC is a gun-free zone under an intentionally complicated arrangement of Oregon gun laws making concealed carry permit holders accidental felons.
B
Bikenut
Guest
Obama and his ilk do not want to get rid of guns... they only want to get rid of guns for the common folk because they understand that he who has a gun has the power to resist being controlled. And all wannabe tyrants from politicians large and small down to the local anti gunner understand what Mao Tse Tung said....
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/works/red-book/ch05.htm
"Every Communist must grasp the truth; "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun."
"Problems of War and Strategy" (November 6, 1938), Selected Works, Vol. II, p. 224.
In other words...politicians (or anyone) who has control over who has guns has power over those who do not have guns. That power can be used for good (defense of others and defense of freedom) or it can be used for ill (oppressing/controlling those who do not have guns).
And if one looks closely at those (from politicians to the local busy body anti gunner) who want to disarm everyone the desire to control what others are allowed, and more importantly ....not allowed, to do is very apparent.
The gun control debate isn't about controlling guns but is about who is going to end up in control.
Yep, it was a guy with a gun...he shot himself...after being wonder by an leo. So the bad guy with a gun in this case was stopped by a bad guy with a gun. Leo helped. Brady boys would love to limit firearms ton LEO's.
We gotta be smarter, not louder, to win the political war with regard to firearms.
"gun free zone" and "good guy with a gun..." are softball arguments. quick pitching the easy home runs to the anti's.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
I would rather die fighting our "political" wars than to acquiesce to being among the same "we" that you are a member of.
You should not presume to speak for the "we" who, unlike you, believe that the 2A means what it says. That is decidedly not being smarter, just more arrogant, delusional, smug and pompous.
And for all the redundant claims of our expressed opposition to GFZs being softball arguments pitching easy home runs to the antis, you have yet to hit one of those home runs. More arrogant, delusional, smug and pompous criticisms thinking that just because you type it in here, it requires no substantiation. "WE" believe that it is enough that GFZ legislation violates both the letter and spirit of the 2A, which makes our opposition the hardest of 100+ mph fastballs.
Blues
vernsimpson
New member
Just read that the wacko's Father has drank the kool-ade and working on getting the media and the leftists to love him by coming out for more "gun control"!!!
Perhaps he should have been a better parent in raising his son!
Link Removed
Perhaps he should have been a better parent in raising his son!
Link Removed
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People who think like you get to have their lives run by the "we". You get to complain about it on the internet and hide in your bunker.
The 2A does not mean what YOU want it to means, it means what "we" determine it to mean, whether or not you like it.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
No, I get to live out in the most rural parts of this state where the "we" that you represent will never ever successfully impose the kind of gun control measures that the "we" that I am a member of will oppose with our last dying breaths. If you want to call that a bunker mentality or some other arrogant, delusional, smug and pompous evaluation of other-than-Northeastern-liberal culture, then there's a real simple way for you to substantiate that the "we" you claim get to run our lives the way YOU want to run us; just come on down and start imposing your will upon us actually proving that you do "get to" run us. Chances are, you would be running with the remnants of your monkey-tail between your legs for the safety of your liberal bunker state before the plane you flew in on took off for its return flight.
It is clearly you who throws around pejoratives against other-than-Northeastern-liberal culture while hiding behind a keyboard in a state where a natural and fundamental right requires the permission of government to exercise in any way, shape, manner or form, when the indisputable truth is that that right was acknowledged in the BoR for the express purpose of preventing that exact tyrannical circumstance from ever coming to fruition anywhere in this country.
The point is, there are several "we" groups involved in all facets of gun issues, and as in the case of most 2A-centric websites, the "we" you identify with is a decided and extreme minority on this one.
Like I said, you should not presume to speak for the "we" on this site who, unlike you, believe that the 2A means what it says.
And like I also said, you have yet to "hit an easy home run" by successfully debunking or invalidating any opposition to, or criticisms of, GFZ legislation that appears regularly on every 2A-centric site on the www. There's a real simple explanation for that too - because there is no way to debunk or invalidate the assertion that GFZs are anathema to the Second Amendment as written and intended, your idiotic claim that the "we" you identify most closely with "get to" run our lives in direct contravention to the Constitution the way YOU want to run us notwithstanding.
Blues
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Mike Vanderboegh of Sipsey Street Irregulars blog started a three-part series on Friday, Oct. 2nd, covering various aspects of the Oregon murders, some of it (rightly) devoted to the VDZs (Victim Disarmament Zones) that nodogs likes to bray about the illegitimacy of ad nauseum, but the series is quite comprehensive from a pro-Constitution, pro-2nd-Amendment and pro-self-defense perspective, all of which should invoke extreme disinterest from nodogs, but will likely be of interest to the majority of readers on this site. Part One, "Oregon Massacre, Part One: Blood Dancing Without a Band. Am I the only one who laughed when Obama cut his latest appeal for firearms sales?" can be found here.
Part Two, "Oregon Massacre, Part Two: Clueless in Roseburg. Yeah, we disarmed in the face of evil and advertised for a mass killer to come victimize us, but just because we got a bunch of innocents killed doesn't mean we'll change a thing," can be found here.
I am going to re-post Part Three here, because it covers what is to me the most important ideas in dealing with evil like that of the UCC killer and many others who somehow, inexplicably, exert liberty-killing pressure on all of us by plying their evil in the way(s) they do. Mike has a very gentle way of addressing both Believer and non-believer, libertarian and liberal alike without being "preachy" or judgmental, and he does it in a way that I am not capable of replicating myself, so here ya go. It is my sincere wish that everyone at least attempt to take something positive and educational from this piece:
Sunday, October 4, 2015
Blues
Part Two, "Oregon Massacre, Part Two: Clueless in Roseburg. Yeah, we disarmed in the face of evil and advertised for a mass killer to come victimize us, but just because we got a bunch of innocents killed doesn't mean we'll change a thing," can be found here.
I am going to re-post Part Three here, because it covers what is to me the most important ideas in dealing with evil like that of the UCC killer and many others who somehow, inexplicably, exert liberty-killing pressure on all of us by plying their evil in the way(s) they do. Mike has a very gentle way of addressing both Believer and non-believer, libertarian and liberal alike without being "preachy" or judgmental, and he does it in a way that I am not capable of replicating myself, so here ya go. It is my sincere wish that everyone at least attempt to take something positive and educational from this piece:
Sunday, October 4, 2015
We are beginning to get a sense of the shooter in the Oregon Massacre and it seems to me to be as clear a case of demonic possession as you are likely to find. The little pissant who couldn't get a date lived with his momma and craved attention, saying "The more people you kill, the more you're in the limelight." He reportedly was "filled with hate" and executed Christians after identifying them with shots to the head.
We also now know that all his weapons Link Removed and that he wrote that he would be "welcomed in Hell and embraced by the devil." Additionally, we know that despite claims of heroic intervention by the cops to save the situation, in fact he died by suicide when they arrived. and that, predictably, the massacre took place in the laughably cruel confines of what the collectivists are pleased to call a "gun free zone." We also have the statement from the college leadership that they have no intention of changing and that the welcome mat is still out for any mass murderer who wishes to take advantage of such a "death zone."
The talking head shows are filled with discussions about "mental illness" and the need to disarm the citizenry a la Australia and Britain in some sort of Soviet psychiatry meets the Department of Pre-Crime scheme to make us all "safe." Of course such safety is illusory and merely a con job to rob the rest of us of our God-given and inalienable liberty. For just as with every collectivist tyranny, mere opposition to the regime is accepted as an obvious case of lunacy. Why do you think they call us "gun nuts" and "religious fanatics?"
Yet as Jack Kerwick wrote at the time of the last slaughter of Christians in Charleston, "Either a person is evil or he is 'mentally ill.' He can’t be both. Either his actions are evil, or they are symptoms of an illness. They can’t be both."
We also now know that all his weapons Link Removed and that he wrote that he would be "welcomed in Hell and embraced by the devil." Additionally, we know that despite claims of heroic intervention by the cops to save the situation, in fact he died by suicide when they arrived. and that, predictably, the massacre took place in the laughably cruel confines of what the collectivists are pleased to call a "gun free zone." We also have the statement from the college leadership that they have no intention of changing and that the welcome mat is still out for any mass murderer who wishes to take advantage of such a "death zone."
The talking head shows are filled with discussions about "mental illness" and the need to disarm the citizenry a la Australia and Britain in some sort of Soviet psychiatry meets the Department of Pre-Crime scheme to make us all "safe." Of course such safety is illusory and merely a con job to rob the rest of us of our God-given and inalienable liberty. For just as with every collectivist tyranny, mere opposition to the regime is accepted as an obvious case of lunacy. Why do you think they call us "gun nuts" and "religious fanatics?"
Yet as Jack Kerwick wrote at the time of the last slaughter of Christians in Charleston, "Either a person is evil or he is 'mentally ill.' He can’t be both. Either his actions are evil, or they are symptoms of an illness. They can’t be both."
(A)llusions to “gun violence” and “mental health” are especially pernicious inasmuch as they obscure the evil nature of the deed being explained. To see just how egregious an offense this is, consider some analogies. Imagine if, while discussing the Holocaust, we spoke about “gas chamber violence,” or while discussing Islamic State mass beheadings, we talked instead of “machete violence.” Or suppose that discussions of the lynching of blacks were peppered with references to “rope violence.” None of this would sit well with decent human beings, for it is clear, or at least it is thought that it should be clear, that such descriptions miss entirely that which is fundamental to the phenomena being described—the perpetrators responsible for these wicked deeds.
(A)dmitting that there is unrelenting evil in the world leads back to the Devil which leads back to God, and overarching moral authority other than their (the collectivists') own cannot be conceded or tolerated. It was not accidentally that Obama criticized people who "cling to their Bibles and their guns." Collectivists view both as deadly dangers to their appetites.
And here I arrive at the central point that many folks who approach this problem from a mere secular point of view not only fail to grasp but reject out of hand. You cannot successfully confront evil without considering where it comes from and recognizing this basic truth: evils in all their forms are merely permutations of the eternal struggle between good and evil, between God and Satan, and you cannot win against it on your own. You must rely upon faith in God to win the battle against evil, which is both within and without you. Indeed, as Christians the rest of us understand that the final battle of this war will be won by God alone, no matter how successful we are in the skirmishes leading up to it. God doesn't command us to win in these fights, but he does command us to fight. He commands us to stand. Both in our daily activities in the world and in our own internal struggle against the "powers and principalities" that seek to corrupt us to the Devil's purposes.
As Ephesians 6:10–12 says:
As Ephesians 6:10–12 says:
“Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.”
These are crucial truths, for we can only stand strong in the Lord’s power not our own alone, that it is God’s armor that protects us, and that our battle is ultimately against spiritual forces of evil in the world.
This is indeed spiritual warfare on all its fronts. For those of you who are put off by the task of seeking answers directly from the Bible, I would commend to all of you a slim volume recently published that explains this in detail: Link Removed
Together, Tolkien and Lewis took their shattering experiences of the evils of the "Great War" and charted out a middle ground between the unremitting nihilistic despair of many of others and the collectivist errors of Bolshevism, Nazism, eugenics and a plethora of other collectivisms that some turned to. What is central to both the Narnia and Middle Earth tales is the understanding that only with the overarching power of God to help us take up the battle can we win the many fights against evil both within and without. Only within this framework can true peace and liberty be achieved. In both tales we see that it is the inner struggle against the corrupting influence of evil that makes even tactical success against in our day-to-day external lives possible.
This is not a call for a theocratic state. I am, as I have said many times before publicly and privately, a Christian libertarian. With all my faults I trust my own faith to inform and protect me, not to dictate to others (particularly with the force of government) how they must believe. But what I'm saying is that like Tolkien and Lewis, I have come to understand true happiness and liberty only comes from accepting that you can't do it on your own, that you must allow God to shoulder the burden.
So what are we to do when confronted by evil face-to-face as the Christian martyrs of Charleston and Roseburg were? The first and most immediate task is to kill the evildoer with any tool at your disposal in order to protect the innocent. Secondly, it is vital not to let your reaction to such evil corrupt you to do evil yourself.
Posted by Dutchman6 at 6:52 AM
This is indeed spiritual warfare on all its fronts. For those of you who are put off by the task of seeking answers directly from the Bible, I would commend to all of you a slim volume recently published that explains this in detail: Link Removed
Together, Tolkien and Lewis took their shattering experiences of the evils of the "Great War" and charted out a middle ground between the unremitting nihilistic despair of many of others and the collectivist errors of Bolshevism, Nazism, eugenics and a plethora of other collectivisms that some turned to. What is central to both the Narnia and Middle Earth tales is the understanding that only with the overarching power of God to help us take up the battle can we win the many fights against evil both within and without. Only within this framework can true peace and liberty be achieved. In both tales we see that it is the inner struggle against the corrupting influence of evil that makes even tactical success against in our day-to-day external lives possible.
This is not a call for a theocratic state. I am, as I have said many times before publicly and privately, a Christian libertarian. With all my faults I trust my own faith to inform and protect me, not to dictate to others (particularly with the force of government) how they must believe. But what I'm saying is that like Tolkien and Lewis, I have come to understand true happiness and liberty only comes from accepting that you can't do it on your own, that you must allow God to shoulder the burden.
So what are we to do when confronted by evil face-to-face as the Christian martyrs of Charleston and Roseburg were? The first and most immediate task is to kill the evildoer with any tool at your disposal in order to protect the innocent. Secondly, it is vital not to let your reaction to such evil corrupt you to do evil yourself.
Posted by Dutchman6 at 6:52 AM
Blues
And this steaming pile of dung.....
Oregon shooter's dad: 'That's what guns are, the killers' - CNN.com
Oregon shooter's dad: 'That's what guns are, the killers'
Well, Ian Mercer, the #1 reason that I want a gun is protect my family and myself from &$^%#*&!@^# like your son.
Oregon shooter's dad: 'That's what guns are, the killers' - CNN.com
Oregon shooter's dad: 'That's what guns are, the killers'
Well, Ian Mercer, the #1 reason that I want a gun is protect my family and myself from &$^%#*&!@^# like your son.
And this female dog....
Link Removed
Legislating in the White House....geez when have we seen that before?
What next? We going to start blaming the car when people get killed by drunk drivers? Going to start suing the car makers for drunk drivers?
Or heck, why not just go all the way and blame the victims for being in the "gun's" or "car's" way when it went on it's killing rampage?
Link Removed
Legislating in the White House....geez when have we seen that before?
What next? We going to start blaming the car when people get killed by drunk drivers? Going to start suing the car makers for drunk drivers?
Or heck, why not just go all the way and blame the victims for being in the "gun's" or "car's" way when it went on it's killing rampage?
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