Reba
Sinner saved by grace
Exactly.
Christians, Romney and the "establishment"
- Thread starter Ringo
- Start date
Nadir Point
Member
Tldr
I made my point. Willful ignorance doesn't change that. :biggrin:
I made my point. Willful ignorance doesn't change that. :biggrin:
txfilmmaker
Member
I just want note that I'm very impressed with people like Reba, Blues Stringer, and the like who give intelligent explanations of what the Constitution actually says and what our founding fathers wrote and meant. Reba also does a fantastic job of repres I just want note that I'm very impressed with people like Reba, BluesStringer, and the like who give intelligent explanations of what the Constitution actually says and what our founding fathers wrote and meant. Reba also does a fantastic job of representing true Christians and truth in a very patient manner.
Proverbs 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you;
reprove a wise man, and he will love you.
9 Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be still wiser;
teach a righteous man, and he will increase in learning.
10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom,
and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight.
11 For by me your days will be multiplied,
and years will be added to your life.
12 If you are wise, you are wise for yourself;
if you scoff, you alone will bear it.
enting true Christians and truth in a very patient manner.
Proverbs 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you;
reprove a wise man, and he will love you.
9 Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be still wiser;
teach a righteous man, and he will increase in learning.
10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom,
and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight.
11 For by me your days will be multiplied,
and years will be added to your life.
12 If you are wise, you are wise for yourself;
if you scoff, you alone will bear it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Proverbs 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you;
reprove a wise man, and he will love you.
9 Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be still wiser;
teach a righteous man, and he will increase in learning.
10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom,
and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight.
11 For by me your days will be multiplied,
and years will be added to your life.
12 If you are wise, you are wise for yourself;
if you scoff, you alone will bear it.
enting true Christians and truth in a very patient manner.
Proverbs 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you;
reprove a wise man, and he will love you.
9 Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be still wiser;
teach a righteous man, and he will increase in learning.
10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom,
and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight.
11 For by me your days will be multiplied,
and years will be added to your life.
12 If you are wise, you are wise for yourself;
if you scoff, you alone will bear it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
XD40scinNC
New member
And the more they profess to be a christian, the less I trust them, and real life experiences have validated this perspective. Just like the raging homophobic person, they are compensating for something.
Reba
Sinner saved by grace
Jesus recognized that problem of false believers whose actions didn't match their words:
Matthew 7
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
BluesStringer
Les Brers
The willful ignorance is yours alone, as you refuse to recognize that you have yet to make a valid point in this discussion.
XD40scinNC
New member
I don't consider them believers at all, but unethical dishonest people trying to hide behind a cloak of piety.
txfilmmaker
Member
Judging from the verses Reba quoted, Jesus didn't consider them believers either. Christians aren't perfect, but they shouldn't be consistently ungodly either. That doesn't mean having different views of social issues makes someone a hypocrite or unloving. As an example, there is a night and day difference between not wanting to affirm the redefinition of marriage vs. how the Westboro "church" spews hatred towards all who don't agree with them. "Westboro Baptist Church is arguably the most obnoxious and rabid hate group in America. Typified by its slogan, “God Hates Fags,” WBC is known for its harsh anti-gay beliefs and the crude signs its members carry at their frequent protests. "
These are obviously not true followers of Christ. Christ came to redeem. Westboro just condemns.
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Reba
Sinner saved by grace
That's why I call them false, and that's why Jesus rejects them.
XD40scinNC
New member
They will tell you that they are 'true' christians and support it with quotes from the same bible you have in your hand. Who should I believe, the one's that says they are doing gods work or the one's that say they are doing gods work?
XD40scinNC
New member
Your take, they may well say that you are the false christian because you don't adhere to their interpretation of the bible.
My view is that the bible is the total and complete creation of man, and has been re-written and translated numerous times, and man's bias, agendas, and ignorance induced every time.
txfilmmaker
Member
I've tried to answer you before. I would now, but I know you don't really want an answer.
I do wonder how you view standard history books that are taught in universities. I wonder if you believe them. The Bible has proven to be more historically and archaeologically accurate than any other ancient book. It has been subjected to the minutest scientific textual analysis possible to humanity and has been proven to be authentic in every way.
Boom! [emoji3]
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Reba
Sinner saved by grace
The ones who are actually doing God's work.
Nadir Point
Member
Almost Off His Rocker
He's taken the all-caps cyber-shout to new levels: Bold + Italics :yes4:
What's next? :lol:
He's taken the all-caps cyber-shout to new levels: Bold + Italics :yes4:
What's next? :lol:
Rhino
New member
A comment more of convenience than conviction. I know what you mean.
.
Many people do that quite often, which was my point earlier about interpretations being different. There is no single definition of "Christian", and anyone who attempts to demonize others for not adhering to their own personal interpretation of it is decidedly un-Christian.
.
The Bible was written by man, and was rewritten many times. That's why there are so many different versions of it. I've made a similar point to this many times, as have many religious scholars. But if you go to the trouble of reading the different versions of the bible you'll find that, although there may be some textual differences, the message being conveyed is the same. The only reason there are different versions is because they used a different method of translation, usually to make the language more accessible to the common man. The original King James would say "The noise thereof showeth concerning it...", while the New International Version would say "His thunder announces the coming storm..." The Westcott-Hort Bible was replaced by the King James Bible because it was based on more complete Greek manuscripts than the Westcott-Hort and thus contained many additional passages. The different versions since then have been just to make it more readable for certain audiences. Did they ever make you read Shakespeare in school in the original Old English? It was horrible! And the original King James Bible was just as bad, if not worse.
.
I mentioned before that my wife is Catholic. The Catholic church uses a ton of symbolism and metaphors, like "the body of Christ" and "the blood of Christ" during communion. Those phrases aren't intended to be literal. And when someone tells you the Bible is the word of God, that isn't supposed to mean that God wrote it, or that he dictated the text. But I do hear people claim that sometimes, and I imagine that you do too since you voice this frustration. The Bible was written by man. It is an interpretation of ancient, incomplete manuscripts that were discovered and deciphered, and that are still being studied by scientists and scholars in an effort to determine if they've been fully understood. The Dead Sea Scrolls are technically biblical manuscripts, and they weren't first discovered until 1946, long after King James turned to dust in his grave. So there is absolutely not in any way an assurance that the text of the Bible is exactly the words that Moses or the apostles or whoever passed down. But that isn't the point. The message that is conveyed is the point, not the words. The faith in God and in Jesus Christ, and the adherence to that faith, is what the Bible is teaching. It doesn't matter if a different version of the Bible changes the text a little. What matters is that the message is passed along. But I understand your frustration when someone claims the Bible was written by God or that it's literally God's word, because that isn't true. But it is God's message to anyone who's a Christian. Even the Old Testament is God's message to anyone who's Jewish. No one is saying you have to believe that. What you believe is your choice. But to a Christian that's a matter of faith.
Reba
Sinner saved by grace
Hebrews 1
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
The Holy Bible is the complete, inerrant Word and words of God. Men wrote down the words that were given them thru the Holy Spirit's inspiration.
It's important to use translations that don't just paraphrase the original texts but keep faithful to them, word by word. The only way that the message can be passed along faithfully is if the words are translated accurately.
God's Word is so important to Him that He even personified it in His Son, Jesus Christ.
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
The Bible isn't a PC document adjusted to fit current trends and morality; it's the unchanging guide to learning about God, coming to love Him, and learning to serve Him.
For English language readers, the King James Version is superior but a few other translations are acceptable. Other languages have their versions, some good, some bad.
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, 2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
The Holy Bible is the complete, inerrant Word and words of God. Men wrote down the words that were given them thru the Holy Spirit's inspiration.
It's important to use translations that don't just paraphrase the original texts but keep faithful to them, word by word. The only way that the message can be passed along faithfully is if the words are translated accurately.
God's Word is so important to Him that He even personified it in His Son, Jesus Christ.
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
The Bible isn't a PC document adjusted to fit current trends and morality; it's the unchanging guide to learning about God, coming to love Him, and learning to serve Him.
For English language readers, the King James Version is superior but a few other translations are acceptable. Other languages have their versions, some good, some bad.
txfilmmaker
Member
Amen. The ESV, NKJV and NASB are very good translations.
Definition of a Christian? Or how to tell if you are a real Christian?
There are many verses that can help you determine that.
John 14:15 “If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.
1 John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
1 John 2:3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.
1 John 2:15 Do not love the world nor the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world. 17 The world is passing away, and also its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever.
1 John 2:22 Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the [g]Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also. 24 As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father.
1 John 3:9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
Practices sin means habitual. Everyone sins, unbelievers do so as a matter of practice. Believers fall, unbelievers jump in. Believers can mitigate sin and are not slaves to sin.
1 John 3:13 Do not be surprised, brethren, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.
1 John 3:23 This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. 24 The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
John 8:31 So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”
There are many others.
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Oldgrunt
Well-known member
Rhino's has been been one of the better comments on the Bible but, as with comments made by anyone, there is a learning bias in his thesis. I disagree that the Bible was written solely by man but, by man at the inspiration of God. 2 Timothy 2:16. No man, by individual thought, could have written the Bible, particularly since it contains so much prophecy that covers thousands of years of time. That information had to come from God, to the different writers, throughout Biblical history. But, I won't be so trite as to make that an argument. The point is that the Bible was written and, over the centuries, has retained it's central thesis, the leading character throughout is the one, true living, God made known through Jesus Christ.
The main characteristic, throughout all the different versions of the Bible is their consistency in proving them to be historically trustworthy and reliable.
A good summary of the Bible by Sir Walter Scott:
"Within that awful volume lies
The mystery of mysteries
Happiest they of human race
To whom God has granted grace
To read, to fear, to hope, to pray
To lift the latch, and force the way;
And better had they ne'er been born,
Who read to doubt, or read to scorn."
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