Another Reason To Conceal, & Not Print, Or Peak


N R A

New member
Man was attacked in a Florida Walmart, because the attacker, saw the man was carrying a handgun under his coat.
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Link Removed
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I am not an expert in Florida law, but I think that is a state where it is against the law to print or peak a concealed handgun with your CHP. This is one good example as why that is. Who knew, nut jobs in Walmart?? Of all things. The personal protection device this guy picked to protect himself, in this bizarre case, is why he was singled out and attacked.
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Carry concealed?, make sure you are doing a good job at it, for maximum protection from nut jobs.
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635573713650276992-foster.jpg

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Michael Foster, 43, was taken into custody and charged with battery.(Photo: HCSO)
 

If Daniels was carrying condition 3 and chose to defend himself with his gun there would have been no way he could have loaded a round to do so. I wonder if Foster is related to George Zimmerman? Seems like they both have the same mental illness.
 
Sounds more like a BIG reason OC should be allowed everywhere. It makes the point that OC'ers have been saying forever. People are more afraid of a stranger with hidden firearm than a person who is openly OC'ing.


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I don't think the problem is OC vs CC, but rather people like Michael Foster, who jump to conclusions and take inappropriate actions. We should be able to do either OC or CC, as we choose.
 
If Daniels was carrying condition 3 and chose to defend himself with his gun there would have been no way he could have loaded a round to do so. I wonder if Foster is related to George Zimmerman? Seems like they both have the same mental illness.

:no: Absolutely untrue!

When I originally saw this story the first thought that crossed my mind was, 'How'd that, 'do gooder' get so close!' Maybe in your, 'internet gun forum world' your remark carries some weight; but, out in the real world with a gunman who knows what he's doing, C-3 carry would have worked. Besides, the victim of this attack is 62 years old AND, obviously, not all that sharp! I would hope that an elderly, slow reacting dude like him isn't walking around, playing at being a Glockeroo with a C-1 pistol in his belt. Clearly, he's not up to it!

As for you and your internet gun forum obsession with C-1 carry? You're like a, 'one note Charlie'. You think that the gun you're carrying is the best and only solution to each and every attack situation. IT'S NOT! You, also, need to think about the safety of others every bit as much as you obsess about your own. Whether or not to carry in C-1 is a matter of risk analysis - Risk analysis. C-1 carry is primarily useful to a gunman who anticipates being ambushed at extremely close quarters; and, even if this happens, THERE ARE STILL OTHER VIABLE ALTERNATIVES TO IMMEDIATELY TRYING TO DRAW AND FIRE.

I've been on the internet gun forums, now, for more than a decade. During this time I've frequently found internet gun forum advice to be as myopic and socially unconcerned as it is unrealistic - Strictly a matter of personal opinion with little, or no, real life experience or H2H SKILL to back it up. Why expose yourself, your family, and your friends to the risks of being around a C-1 pistol that, statistically speaking, you are never going to need? Even if you do need it - and, yes, it can happen - for the 1% of the time you might need a C-1 pistol, your family, and friends are going to be exposed to unnecessary risk 99% of the rest of the time. (The math is all wrong!)

Just because you're untrained, undisciplined, and inexperienced with C-3 carry doesn't mean that everyone else is, too. In my time I've known a lot of genuine, authentic gunmen. I remember several whom a thug would have been insane to cross - Whether or not these men were carrying anywhere on their bodies, or in whatever condition. C-1 carry seems to be the perfect solution for every, (one note) wannabe, internet gun forum tough guy who's out there! Most of these, 'It's only a brick' Glockeroos haven't ever been in a real world gunfight in their entire lives; but that doesn't stop them from loudly (and too often adamantly) voicing their, 'expert opinions' on how to carry an EDC pistol all across the internet!

Frankly, I find this sort of mental and emotional obtusion to be annoying; but, then again, I'm a realist; and I recognize the incredible strength of popular opinion! On the internet it really doesn't matter what's right, wrong, safest to all parties concerned, or dangerous to one's own self and the kids. For far too many people there's only one way to learn. I've had enough experience with your thoughts and opinions, now, to recognize that you're just one more of these internet gun forum Glockeroos. I would caution you, however, not to judge all men (all CQB pistol gunfighters) by your own personal standards. Some of us are, both, different and more heavily experienced than you; but, that's not going to change your mind; is it! :wink:
 
I am not an expert in Florida law, but I think that is a state where it is against the law to print or peak a concealed handgun with your CHP.

And you would be wrong.
There is no law against printing and momentary exposure is okay.

790.001(2) “Concealed firearm” means any firearm, as defined in subsection (6), which is carried on or about a person in such a manner as to conceal the firearm from the ordinary sight of another person.
790.053 Open carrying of weapons.—
(1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device. It is not a violation of this section for a person licensed to carry a concealed firearm as provided in s. 790.06(1), and who is lawfully carrying a firearm in a concealed manner, to briefly and openly display the firearm to the ordinary sight of another person, unless the firearm is intentionally displayed in an angry or threatening manner, not in necessary self-defense.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine
 
:no: Absolutely untrue!

When I originally saw this story the first thought that crossed my mind was, 'How'd that, 'do gooder' get so close!' Maybe in your, 'internet gun forum world' your remark carries some weight; but, out in the real world with a gunman who knows what he's doing, C-3 carry would have worked. Besides, the victim of this attack is 62 years old AND, obviously, not all that sharp! I would hope that an elderly, slow reacting dude like him isn't walking around, playing at being a Glockeroo with a C-1 pistol in his belt. Clearly, he's not up to it!

So, basically, what you are saying is that if someone can't achieve the high state of readiness and training that is required to overcome the initial disadvantage that exists by carrying a gun in condition 3 when the assailant initiates the attack they shouldn't carry a gun at all.....
 
When I originally saw this story the first thought that crossed my mind was, 'How'd that, 'do gooder' get so close!'

Please clarify that statement. In the real world, people can and will get close to you, fast, especially when entering a store.

Maybe in your, 'internet gun forum world' your remark carries some weight; but, out in the real world with a gunman who knows what he's doing, C-3 carry would have worked. Besides, the victim of this attack is 62 years old AND, obviously, not all that sharp! I would hope that an elderly, slow reacting dude like him isn't walking around, playing at being a Glockeroo with a C-1 pistol in his belt. Clearly, he's not up to it!

How do you deduct that the victim of this attack was "obviously, not all that sharp?" It looks like you are blaming the victim for, well, being the victim.
 
I am not an expert in Florida law, but I think that is a state where it is against the law to print or peak a concealed handgun with your CHP. This is one good example as why that is. Who knew, nut jobs in Walmart?? Of all things. The personal protection device this guy picked to protect himself, in this bizarre case, is why he was singled out and attacked.
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Carry concealed?, make sure you are doing a good job at it, for maximum protection from nut jobs.
N R A's absolutely right.


He's not a expert in Florida law, nor is he very good at it.
Florida no longer criminalizes the inadvertent, momentary, or non threatening uncovering of a firearm. (That search took about 5 minutes to confirm, I'm no expert either so I looked).
790.053 Open carrying of weapons.—
(1) Except as otherwise provided by law and in subsection (2), it is unlawful for any person to openly carry on or about his or her person any firearm or electric weapon or device. It is not a violation of this section for a person licensed to carry a concealed firearm as provided in s. 790.06(1), and who is lawfully carrying a firearm in a concealed manner, to briefly and openly display the firearm to the ordinary sight of another person, unless the firearm is intentionally displayed in an angry or threatening manner, not in necessary self-defense.
(2) A person may openly carry, for purposes of lawful self-defense:
(a) A self-defense chemical spray.
(b) A nonlethal stun gun or dart-firing stun gun or other nonlethal electric weapon or device that is designed solely for defensive purposes.
(3) Any person violating this section commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
 
You know I came back here treading lightly.. IM not a dummy.... you really are an ASSshole. when you walk like and ASSshole and talk like an ASSshole then you must be an ASSshole.. my gut is rarely wrong... I thought you were an ASSshole the first week I was here... you have just proven to me that I was right... you are an ASASsole. You arn't worthy to pop a pimple on a real Naval officer's ass.

Ohh...looks like the same old ET is back. Your gut was wrong...you surely are a dummy.

It's amazing, some people it takes everything they have to be a decent person...or drugs help sometimes to right ET?...some people just can't help themselves.

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
 

I only watched it once, so I might have the numbers wrong, but I think it was the second guy that got on the CC'er's legs who first emerged with the gun in his hand. That guy held it in the air trying to hand off the gun to people he had no idea who they were until another guy comes into view from the bottom of the frame and takes it from the guy on the floor, and immediately hands it off to yet another stranger. The guy he handed it off to backed out of frame, and could've just walked away. There's a bunch of people who need charges filed against them, and Walmart will likely get sued as well, especially if the guy with the tie who took the gun was an employee.

I hope the CC'er's SA improves after this, but I hope the attacker sees some real time behind bars. No less than a year I hope, and Walmart ought to ban him for life from any of their stores. That'll teach that inbred fool a lesson!

Blues
 
:no: Absolutely untrue!

When I originally saw this story the first thought that crossed my mind was, 'How'd that, 'do gooder' get so close!' Maybe in your, 'internet gun forum world' your remark carries some weight; but, out in the real world with a gunman who knows what he's doing, C-3 carry would have worked. Besides, the victim of this attack is 62 years old AND, obviously, not all that sharp! I would hope that an elderly, slow reacting dude like him isn't walking around, playing at being a Glockeroo with a C-1 pistol in his belt. Clearly, he's not up to it!

As for you and your internet gun forum obsession with C-1 carry? You're like a, 'one note Charlie'. You think that the gun you're carrying is the best and only solution to each and every attack situation. IT'S NOT! You, also, need to think about the safety of others every bit as much as you obsess about your own. Whether or not to carry in C-1 is a matter of risk analysis - Risk analysis. C-1 carry is primarily useful to a gunman who anticipates being ambushed at extremely close quarters; and, even if this happens, THERE ARE STILL OTHER VIABLE ALTERNATIVES TO IMMEDIATELY TRYING TO DRAW AND FIRE.

I've been on the internet gun forums, now, for more than a decade. During this time I've frequently found internet gun forum advice to be as myopic and socially unconcerned as it is unrealistic - Strictly a matter of personal opinion with little, or no, real life experience or H2H SKILL to back it up. Why expose yourself, your family, and your friends to the risks of being around a C-1 pistol that, statistically speaking, you are never going to need? Even if you do need it - and, yes, it can happen - for the 1% of the time you might need a C-1 pistol, your family, and friends are going to be exposed to unnecessary risk 99% of the rest of the time. (The math is all wrong!)

Just because you're untrained, undisciplined, and inexperienced with C-3 carry doesn't mean that everyone else is, too. In my time I've known a lot of genuine, authentic gunmen. I remember several whom a thug would have been insane to cross - Whether or not these men were carrying anywhere on their bodies, or in whatever condition. C-1 carry seems to be the perfect solution for every, (one note) wannabe, internet gun forum tough guy who's out there! Most of these, 'It's only a brick' Glockeroos haven't ever been in a real world gunfight in their entire lives; but that doesn't stop them from loudly (and too often adamantly) voicing their, 'expert opinions' on how to carry an EDC pistol all across the internet!

Frankly, I find this sort of mental and emotional obtusion to be annoying; but, then again, I'm a realist; and I recognize the incredible strength of popular opinion! On the internet it really doesn't matter what's right, wrong, safest to all parties concerned, or dangerous to one's own self and the kids. For far too many people there's only one way to learn. I've had enough experience with your thoughts and opinions, now, to recognize that you're just one more of these internet gun forum Glockeroos. I would caution you, however, not to judge all men (all CQB pistol gunfighters) by your own personal standards. Some of us are, both, different and more heavily experienced than you; but, that's not going to change your mind; is it! :wink:
Here's a little advice from my father.
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"If you're gonna carry a gun then carry it. Don't dabble in it because someone will shove it up your a--."
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As a long-time PP instructor I would concur... without exception.
 
The bastard is lucky he didn't get lead poisoning. Jump me and find out what intense training will reveal. I'm not the best, nor the quickest but I do train for most scenarios. Pistol whip and 2 rounds comes immediately to mind. Hell, sticking your barrel into the throat in a vary INTENSE fashion will normally ebb your attackers aggression. CPR be dammed.
 
:no: Absolutely untrue!

When I originally saw this story the first thought that crossed my mind was, 'How'd that, 'do gooder' get so close!' Maybe in your, 'internet gun forum world' your remark carries some weight; but, out in the real world with a gunman who knows what he's doing, C-3 carry would have worked. Besides, the victim of this attack is 62 years old AND, obviously, not all that sharp! I would hope that an elderly, slow reacting dude like him isn't walking around, playing at being a Glockeroo with a C-1 pistol in his belt. Clearly, he's not up to it!

As for you and your internet gun forum obsession with C-1 carry? You're like a, 'one note Charlie'. You think that the gun you're carrying is the best and only solution to each and every attack situation. IT'S NOT! You, also, need to think about the safety of others every bit as much as you obsess about your own. Whether or not to carry in C-1 is a matter of risk analysis - Risk analysis. C-1 carry is primarily useful to a gunman who anticipates being ambushed at extremely close quarters; and, even if this happens, THERE ARE STILL OTHER VIABLE ALTERNATIVES TO IMMEDIATELY TRYING TO DRAW AND FIRE.

I've been on the internet gun forums, now, for more than a decade. During this time I've frequently found internet gun forum advice to be as myopic and socially unconcerned as it is unrealistic - Strictly a matter of personal opinion with little, or no, real life experience or H2H SKILL to back it up. Why expose yourself, your family, and your friends to the risks of being around a C-1 pistol that, statistically speaking, you are never going to need? Even if you do need it - and, yes, it can happen - for the 1% of the time you might need a C-1 pistol, your family, and friends are going to be exposed to unnecessary risk 99% of the rest of the time. (The math is all wrong!)

Just because you're untrained, undisciplined, and inexperienced with C-3 carry doesn't mean that everyone else is, too. In my time I've known a lot of genuine, authentic gunmen. I remember several whom a thug would have been insane to cross - Whether or not these men were carrying anywhere on their bodies, or in whatever condition. C-1 carry seems to be the perfect solution for every, (one note) wannabe, internet gun forum tough guy who's out there! Most of these, 'It's only a brick' Glockeroos haven't ever been in a real world gunfight in their entire lives; but that doesn't stop them from loudly (and too often adamantly) voicing their, 'expert opinions' on how to carry an EDC pistol all across the internet!

Frankly, I find this sort of mental and emotional obtusion to be annoying; but, then again, I'm a realist; and I recognize the incredible strength of popular opinion! On the internet it really doesn't matter what's right, wrong, safest to all parties concerned, or dangerous to one's own self and the kids. For far too many people there's only one way to learn. I've had enough experience with your thoughts and opinions, now, to recognize that you're just one more of these internet gun forum Glockeroos. I would caution you, however, not to judge all men (all CQB pistol gunfighters) by your own personal standards. Some of us are, both, different and more heavily experienced than you; but, that's not going to change your mind; is it! :wink:


Wow, just…wow
Ok, for the record I am absolutely convinced that this is a troll post; I think the poster is a sleeper troll who is trying to start a flame war. (Which I believe is the behavior that got him banned at Glock Talk)

Having made that clear let me respond as though the poster is serious. I have been in a gunfight or three, they start really, really fast and usually without a lot of warning (or you see it coming a mile away and you open up first) I have never seen anything in a fight (the root word in gunfight is fight not gun) that would lead me to believe that I would have been better off starting with an empty chamber.
C-1 carry is primarily useful to a gunman who anticipates being ambushed at extremely close quarters; and, even if this happens, THERE ARE STILL OTHER VIABLE ALTERNATIVES TO IMMEDIATELY TRYING TO DRAW AND FIRE.

Now you’ve already stated you have no experience in this matter so let me give you a quick lesson in US Army doctrine for a closed ambush, you turn into the opposing force and you ATTACK HIM as hard as you can. The alternatives (going to cover or trying to run) will likely get you pinned down and killed or just killed.

Now to melt the posters brain a little let me tell you that I only carry M&P pistols (primarily an M&P9) with a round in the chamber and essentially in condition zero because they don’t even have a safe action trigger and I have yet to come even close to a negligent discharge.
 
I can't help but notice that... ahem... with all of Arc Angel's posturing and ranting he seems to be either unwilling or unable to cite an instance where one would be better served by carrying in Condition-3 than Condition-1.

I have a few ideas when it might, though. Would it be better to carry C3 rather than C1 when
  • your loved one has a death grip on your off-hand out of sheer terror preventing it from being used?
  • you're carrying something valuable in your off-hand that you don't want to risk dropping?
  • you have a pet on a leash pulling your off-hand in either anger or terror as you try to make ready and control the animal at the same time
  • you have to use your off-hand to fend off an assailant to keep from being injured instead of using it to make ready?
  • you have an injured off-hand making it useless to pull back the slide?
  • you're using your off-hand to hold on to a ladder, branch, Stop sign, door handle or anything else to retain balance or resist being manhandled?

Which one of those conditions is best served by carrying in C3, or did I miss one?
 
Now to melt the posters brain a little let me tell you that I only carry M&P pistols (primarily an M&P9) with a round in the chamber and essentially in condition zero because they don’t even have a safe action trigger and I have yet to come even close to a negligent discharge.

Don't fret about the lack of any "safe action trigger" on the M&P. The hinged trigger on the M&P series is functionally equivalent to the hinged lever used on the Glock 'safe action' pistol. In both the action of the finger resting on the trigger pivots the back portion of the lever out of a blocking position against the frame. The Glock merely positions the lever in the middle of the trigger whereas the S&W makes use of the entire bottom portion of the trigger.
mp9-trigger.jpg
 

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