When To Pull and or Shoot
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HKS
New member
Which is also what you confessed to -- one drink.
So anecdotally in your case the chart works.
HKS
New member
When I think of drinkers I think of men. Not women.
Although nothing is sexier to me than a woman with vodka on her breath.
But then she should not be driving or shooting.
It is completely fine to pull a gun on someone if you feel that the perp really isn't a threat to your life at that precise moment but could be a threat at anytime if a show of force isn't there. This is why police pull a gun on a suspect even if they are non violent or not resisting arrest. It is better to spare a life than take one if you don't need to. Keep one thing in mind... if you pull your gun on someone who's doing something illegal, will they call the cops and tell them what he was doing and why someone pulled a gun on them? Obviously make sure to let him know that any sudden movement or reaching into clothing will result in you shooting.
As for pulling the trigger and making a successful CCW kill, it will be instinct to pull the trigger. For example, you got a dude yelling at you from 3-5 feet away and you tell him he better back off (your gun holstered) and he starts coming at you, your natural instincts will pull and pop a few in him.
If there are bystanders make sure you yell things like your life feels threatened, you better back off and such because you know there will be people filming on cell phone and it will look better than just cursing back and shooting.
As for pulling the trigger and making a successful CCW kill, it will be instinct to pull the trigger. For example, you got a dude yelling at you from 3-5 feet away and you tell him he better back off (your gun holstered) and he starts coming at you, your natural instincts will pull and pop a few in him.
If there are bystanders make sure you yell things like your life feels threatened, you better back off and such because you know there will be people filming on cell phone and it will look better than just cursing back and shooting.
HKS
New member
3 to 5 feet is already way too close for comfort for me. But I do agree with what you're saying, PhilR.
I would be backing up if the dude was trying to get within 3 to 5 feet. I like to keep 7 to 10 feet distance at a minimum, so I would be backing up at that point to maintain my interval, just like Bruce Lee said to do.
I would be backing up if the dude was trying to get within 3 to 5 feet. I like to keep 7 to 10 feet distance at a minimum, so I would be backing up at that point to maintain my interval, just like Bruce Lee said to do.
bofh
Banned
Good luck with that in court. If I am on the jury, I will convict you.
Pointing a gun at someone is use of lethal force. There needs to be a legal justification for that or you will land in jail. If you point a gun at me without me being an imminent lethal threat, I will back off, pull my gun and shoot you. I will not be convicted as you used lethal force without justification. I just lawfully defended myself against some idiot.
LEOs don't pull their guns on every traffic stop! You argument is flawed. LEOs have use of force rules that apply and that they will use in court to back up their actions. They also have a prosecutor and a police union working for them to make sure that illegal conduct is OK for them.
Your distance statement is also not fully complete. If someone is "coming at you", then the question is still if that someone is a lethal threat to you. If you are a 300 pound lineman and a 125 pound female comes at you yelling, then shooting her will land you in jail. Learn about "disparity of force".
It is always funny to read these cookie cutter arguments. There are very specific laws that guide the use of lethal force. Learn them or you will spend some time in jail.
Sorry I want to jump in here....for the "brandishing" thing: I will not unholster if I'm not going to fire because as quick as I do, I get charged if the situation didn't warrant a shot for illegally "brandishing."
In Ohio, Castle Doctrine applies to our cars. So if someone is trying to forcibly enter my vehicle with me in it, I can legally assume their intent is to do severe bodily harm or kill me, hence my firing is warranted.
Now if my wife is in the car with me, that round is going to get fired a wee bit faster than it would otherwise.
In the case of multiple people attacking a vehicle, circumstances dictate the response, but stopping the threat, getting to safety, then calling LE, in that order.
Fighting from a car puts one at a disadvantage immediately, so whatever it takes to gain the advantage, including firing through my car door, but again, if I deem the threat to be of imminent bodily harm or death per my state laws. While traveling that could be an issue because I can't memorize the laws for several states at once, although I do review them before crossing state lines....trip planning. It's also one reason there are states/cities I will not visit, i.e., Chicago, NYC, California. If those commies are going to insist on remaining a**holes, I wish they'd just friggin' secede!
I have to wonder if there's something going on with the ocean water too cause it seems like a TON of coastal places are full of crazy anti-gunners living in a fantasy world where the police can protect you from whatever may come up.
Be vigilant.
Be safe.
Stay armed. (where IS your pistol? Could you get to it right now if you needed it?)
Blessings,
~Smiddy
BluesStringer
Les Brers
Ohio is certainly not wanting for its share of a**holes either. Ever heard of Daniel Harless? Searching on his name will prove that a**holes can be found in any state, county or local jurisdiction.
Otherwise, I agree with your tactics as-described in the rest of your post, although I would personally worry less about the law in the heat of battle than I would about my own perceptions of the events unfolding around me, because generally-speaking, it is the reasonableness of your state of mind that may end up going to trial, not the second-by-second recitation of the nuances of every minuscule fact that a prosecutor may try to saddle you with at trial that go against the notion that your life or well-being was actually in danger.
Blues
Ok so i generalized-lumped everyone in with the financially and politically well off. My bad. But in my prior travel to the places mentioned, the ratio of a**holes to non-a**holes has been very high, and much more so than what I've seen in Ohio. Not that Ohio is the number one state, but the MidWest does seem to have fewer crazies per capita, including LEO's.
The Harless incident (crime) is bad. I'd bet he didn't behave AS badly as CPD or NYPD would in a similar situation, given CC existed in either place.
Ya ever been to Vanton, Ohio? I do not recommend it. Actually if I had my choice, I'd live south of the Mason-Dixon, and likely not in a coastal area....lived in Bossier City some years, have people in Arkansas as well as other places down that way. Loved it!
USAF(Ret)
