National CCW

[maybejim]

Unless and until this becomes law, the following recognize no permits except their own: CA, CT, Guam, HI, MA, MD, NJ, NY, NY City (not even a NY Permit!), OR, Puerto Rico, RI, U.S. Virgin Islands. Additionally, CO, FL, ME, MI, NH and SC accept only RESIDENT permits of individuals from states whose permits they recognize.

Passage of this law would not change the fact that American Samoa, D.C., IL and the Northern Marianas Islands neither issue permits to their subjects nor recognize any other permit. Subjects living in those entities who wish to upgrade their status to Resident may either use the ballot box to effect Regime Change or move to a "carry permitted" area. Choices have consequences.

You left out Oregon.

 

[mtallit]

States don't have rights, they have powers. And this is an individual right. An inherent, God-given right guaranteed (not given) by the US Constitution. US citizens have the right to keep and bear arms anywhere in the states and territories.

The US Constitution doesn't grant any right, it only protects them.

Uh, read closer next time. You are basically saying the same thing that I am. Here are the same words but changed around...

The right to keep & bear arms is an inherent right, a God-given right. The Constitution does not give you those rights. The Constitution guarantees (or in your words, "protects") those rights.

 

[PaxMentis]

My initial reaction to this was negative from a states' rights viewpoint, but further thought led me to the "full faith and credit" clause of the constitution.

As far as the 2nd Amendment...it guarantees the right to keep and bear arms...not the right to conceal a weapon upon one's body. The argument that a right to K&BA automatically includes concealment is akin to the argument that engaging in free speech allows one to camp on a courthouse lawn.

So I agree the law is valid...but not as a result of the 2A...

 

[maybejim]

My initial reaction to this was negative from a states' rights viewpoint, but further thought led me to the "full faith and credit" clause of the constitution.

As far as the 2nd Amendment...it guarantees the right to keep and bear arms...not the right to conceal a weapon upon one's body. The argument that a right to K&BA automatically includes concealment is akin to the argument that engaging in free speech allows one to camp on a courthouse lawn.

I would disagree that the 2nd Amendment doesn't guarantee the right to conceal a weapon. Shall not be infringed is a pretty clear statement.

 

[Unfettered Might]

"Bear" as defined makes no distinction between open or concealed. Opinions or feelings have no bearing on the matter, only actual definitions, otherwise we are not abiding by the purpose of the 2A.

This IS INDEED a matter of enforcement of the 2A.

 

[rdp357]

I hope it passes, but don't think it will, at least not while Obama-mama is in office.

 

[mrjam2jab]

Unless and until this becomes law, the following recognize no permits except their own: CA, CT, Guam, HI, MA, MD, NJ, NY, NY City (not even a NY Permit!), OR, Puerto Rico, RI, U.S. Virgin Islands. Additionally, CO, FL, ME, MI, NH and SC accept only RESIDENT permits of individuals from states whose permits they recognize.

Passage of this law would not change the fact that American Samoa, D.C., IL and the Northern Marianas Islands neither issue permits to their subjects nor recognize any other permit. Subjects living in those entities who wish to upgrade their status to Resident may either use the ballot box to effect Regime Change or move to a "carry permitted" area. Choices have consequences.

You left out Oregon.

No he didn't...I missed it the first read thru also.

 

[snatale42]

The 2nd amendment doesn't give the right IMO to conceal carry.

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED, is pretty clear language. If a state says, "You can carry BUT........" How is that not infringing?

So how can the national government tell states they must allow residents from other states the right to carry? Especially when that state doesn't allow their own residents to conceal carry...

They can't. Read the bill. It forces RECIPROCITY, Not the right to carry. If a commie state (IL,DC) doesn't haveConcealed Carry for residents, then neither do we.

As far as the Permitless states, I'm sure they'll start to offer permits for those who choose to get them for reciprocity reasons. Just like they have to get letters and documentation already for applying for Non-Res permits.

 

[RRrider]

but you said a right no given by the US Constitution... no right is given by the US Constitution. Not a single one

 

[RRrider]

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED, is pretty clear language. If a state says, "You can carry BUT........" How is that not infringing?

Some would argue that the 2nd amendment has nothing to do with personal self defense and the right to conceal carry...

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

I get asked in discussion about how my Militia is doing by gun hating liberals.


Don't get me wrong here, I am better trying to understand. I support gun laws in general, in fact I wrote my Congressman about this bill.

 

[RRrider]

Again, don't get me wrong, I carry. I am happy that my state laws say that I have the right to use a hand gun to defend my life, and that I can conceal it.

 

[agrippakc]

I agree. This smells of a legal trick. Use something we would support without really looking at it and really asking what the consequences will be in terms of forcing a states hand in other ways on other issues. If a state wont accept my gun then screw'em.

 

[Nightmare45]

Passed the house no problem look at NRA ILA and see all the good Dems that tried to add amendment preventing or changing the law all lost, Senate another problem, our pos president is never in town and can't seem to remember to hold his hand over his heart when the National Anthem is played, the simple answer would have been to force all states to recognize the license just like the drivers license. Hope all goes well.

 

[mrjam2jab]

As far as the Permitless states, I'm sure they'll start to offer permits for those who choose to get them for reciprocity reasons. Just like they have to get letters and documentation already for applying for Non-Res permits.

The only permit-less state is VT. The rest with ConCarry still have the permit option. VT residents can just get a permit from another state. VT the State doesn't have to change anything.

 

[longslide10]

"Those who would trade liberty for security, deserves neither liberty nor security."
Thomas Jefferson

Very true, but the actual quote is "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." and is attributed to Benjamin Franklin, not Jefferson.

Yeah, it's the shortened version and many argue who actually said it Franklin or Jefferson. I really don't care as it makes a powerful statement

 

[Unfettered Might]

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED, is pretty clear language. If a state says, "You can carry BUT........" How is that not infringing?

Some would argue that the 2nd amendment has nothing to do with personal self defense and the right to conceal carry...

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

I get asked in discussion about how my Militia is doing by gun hating liberals.


Don't get me wrong here, I am better trying to understand. I support gun laws in general, in fact I wrote my Congressman about this bill.

Sometimes I wish the Founding Fathers had wrote it like this;

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State,, shall not be infringed.
The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Just so the frickn illiterate morons could understand it....

 

[alduane]

Yeah, it's the shortened version and many argue who actually said it Franklin or Jefferson. I really don't care as it makes a powerful statement

Yes it is a powerful statement that I thought about many times during the Bush years. Many may argue whether Jefferson or Franklin said it but there really isn't any doubt it was Franklin. If Jefferson said it he was quoting Franklin.

 

[Hamilton Felix]

I don't think Senate or the empty suit in the White House will let it pass. It does not affect CPL standards any more than 50 state recognition affects drivers license standards. I HOPE it passes, but I am not optimistic.

 

[Unfettered Might]

I don't think Senate or the empty suit in the White House will let it pass. It does not affect CPL standards any more than 50 state recognition affects drivers license standards. I HOPE it passes, but I am not optimistic.

They will if its attached to another bill that they really want, though I'm not a fan of bipartisan bills.

 

[gvaldeg1]

The vote on H.R. 822 was 272 to 154. there were 43 Dems voting for the Bill and 7 Republicans voted against it. If the winning ratio of 64 percent held in the Senate, it would be a "filibuster-proof" majority but not a "veto-proof" one. It would only take 2 or 3 more "Aye" votes in the Senate to make it "Obama-proof".