To carry hot or not?

[wolf_fire]

I




Not so much people you know should not own guns, but get some proper training.

Training is free if one wants it.

Knowledge, Skills, Attitude.

Thousands of you tube videos by knowledgeable instructors on gun safety.

I teach high school physics and I have trained people on the proper safety and use of firearms. There are some people that do not have the right maturity level and/or mental acuity to do either. Therefore, I would have to disagree with you and state that some people should NOT own guns. They are a danger to themselves and others... and the people I am referring to have had training, yet, as I've stated, don't have the right maturity level and/or mental acuity to embrace that training and carry it forward after the class (and sometimes during the class).

 

[ChDangerfield]

No, you're not wrong but an XD can't have a round in the chamber without being in that state. I was walking around with a second gen S&W in condition ZERO (chamber loaded, hammer cocked, ready to fire) in my holster.

Again I am aware that this was incredibly unsafe and I'm not reccomending it

But if my gun never just "went off" doing that how much less likely is it to happen with your XD or a Glock or my S&W carried properly decocked or even a 1911 in condition 1?

I carry my XD always with one in the pipe. I have always since a federal LEO trained me on my first carry gun, a XD. Never had an issue with AD, except once when I picked it up, but that was because my finger hit the trigger not because "it just went off". Always in a holster, even sitting in the safe.

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[wolf_fire]

I am sure it is agreed that everyone is free to carry as they see fit. My thought after reading many of these posts is that there has to be consistency in the way you carry.
Developing muscle memory is a matter of training your body what to do when your brain is processing other data.
If you are carrying chambered then not chambered, you are not going to react properly when the time comes that you need your weapon.
Training isn't about range day and squeezing the trigger, that's the last step in the training process.
I try to carry the same 1911 cocked and locked all the time. It has a thumb safety and I train to take the thumb safety off as I draw the weapon from my holster.
The act of lifting my shirt high with my left hand, drawing with my right, sweeping the safety off and pointing on target have to be imprinted in my muscles. The motions are second nature.
Rarely do I carry my smaller gun, it is a Ruger SR9c, it also has a thumb safety so the sweeping motion is the same. I wear it at 4:00 just like the 1911.

No matter how you decide to carry be sure your training is frequent, performed in a safe manner, and complete. Better good with a gun than lucky, but I'll take both.

I'm very glad you said this. My EDC carry is either my G23 or G22 (for those who aren't familiar with Glock, they are both .40 cal). I have a BUG or one that I wear with short summer wear that is a Sig P238 (.380). It has an external safety on it, unlike the Glocks. Since I predominantly carry one of the Glocks, I practice with them more. I was at the range the other day and had my P238 holstered and I drew to fire at the target and neglected to hit the external safety. That concerned me A LOT!! I am now considering replacing that firearm (and I love it, it's a remarkable tool) and getting a Ruger LCP. My muscle memory was so ingrained to draw and fire that the Sig, no matter how great a weapon it is, will not suit me since it is mechanically different from what I'm used to. I must get a firearm that does not have an external safety. This is me.... I'm not recommending to others to make sure you get a firearm without an external safety, what I am saying is, whatever your choice of firearm is, practice with it so that you can react with it; develop your muscle memory. My muscles are already learned to not flick a safety, therefore having one is an obstacle for me now, just like someone who decides to carry chambered one day, and not the other day. Are you going to remember, today I do not need to rack the slide or today I must rack the slide in a pressure situation? I've proven to myself even in a non-pressure situation I wouldn't.

Just as Kramer stated he practices lifting his shirt with his left hand, drawing with right as he clicks off the safety until it is a routine for him, this is what you need to do with your firearms. Most people have the will to win, when what they really need is the will to prepare. Tactically, practice practice practice.

 

[ChDangerfield]

I'm very glad you said this. My EDC carry is either my G23 or G22 (for those who aren't familiar with Glock, they are both .40 cal). I have a BUG or one that I wear with short summer wear that is a Sig P238 (.380). It has an external safety on it, unlike the Glocks. Since I predominantly carry one of the Glocks, I practice with them more. I was at the range the other day and had my P238 holstered and I drew to fire at the target and neglected to hit the external safety. That concerned me A LOT!! I am now considering replacing that firearm (and I love it, it's a remarkable tool) and getting a Ruger LCP. My muscle memory was so ingrained to draw and fire that the Sig, no matter how great a weapon it is, will not suit me since it is mechanically different from what I'm used to. I must get a firearm that does not have an external safety. This is me.... I'm not recommending to others to make sure you get a firearm without an external safety, what I am saying is, whatever your choice of firearm is, practice with it so that you can react with it; develop your muscle memory. My muscles are already learned to not flick a safety, therefore having one is an obstacle for me now, just like someone who decides to carry chambered one day, and not the other day. Are you going to remember, today I do not need to rack the slide or today I must rack the slide in a pressure situation? I've proven to myself even in a non-pressure situation I wouldn't.

Just as Kramer stated he practices lifting his shirt with his left hand, drawing with right as he clicks off the safety until it is a routine for him, this is what you need to do with your firearms. Most people have the will to win, when what they really need is the will to prepare. Tactically, practice practice practice.

I train with both my XD without an external safety and my 1911 with an external safety. I train more with the 1911 to the point I pick up the XD and go to sweep the safety off.

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[Sir Diealotz]

Always +1
Or you can use your carry pistol as a club LOL

 

[Treo]

I carry my XD always with one in the pipe. I have always since a federal LEO trained me on my first carry gun, a XD. Never had an issue with AD, except once when I picked it up, but that was because my finger hit the trigger not because "it just went off". Always in a holster, even sitting in the safe.

OK I think you are missing my point, you mentioned carrying a 1911 with a round in the chamber and the safety on in one post, what I was doing was equivalent to carrying a 1911 with around in the chamber, hammer cocked and the safety off.

Do you get that?

The point I was trying to make was that even doing something that unsafe I didn't ever have an accidental discharge so it very doubtful that I would have one carrying the gun properly

 

[ChDangerfield]

OK I think you are missing my point, you mentioned carrying a 1911 with a round in the chamber and the safety on in one post, what I was doing was equivalent to carrying a 1911 with around in the chamber, hammer cocked and the safety off.

Do you get that?

The point I was trying to make was that even doing something that unsafe I didn't ever have an accidental discharge so it very doubtful that I would have one carrying the gun properly

Ah. But you quoted me when I was talking about the XD and no safety at all.

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[Treo]

Ah. But you quoted me when I was talking about the XD and no safety at all.

Wrong the XD has two safeties the grip safety and the safe action trigger. Also with a round in the chamber the XD is in a semi- cocked state, pulling the trigger moves the striker to a fully cocked state and releases it similar to a double action pistol.

I was walking around with a single action pistol with the safety off

Also in your post you attempted to compare my doing so with your carrying an XD with a round in the chamber

This sounds like how you carry an XD. The striker back and round chambered. No thumb safety to flip on. Am I wrong on this?

That is what i was addressing

 

[ChDangerfield]

Wrong the XD has two safeties the grip safety and the safe action trigger. Also with a round in the chamber the XD is in a semi- cocked state, pulling the trigger moves the striker to a fully cocked state and releases it similar to a double action pistol.

I was walking around with a single action pistol with the safety off

Also in your post you attempted to compare my doing so with your carrying an XD with a round in the chamber



That is what i was addressing

The XD striker is always fully back. The sear drops but does not pull back. What you described is the glock action. And the safety I am referring to is the thumb safety like the 1911. XDs do not have that.

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[dogshawred]

Glock does not recommend one in the chamber for liability sake.

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Whose liability theirs or yours. Theirs is for monetary reasons, yours is to save your life. Which do you think is more important? I know what my answer is, because they aren't worried about my life, not really.

 

[Nok]

i carry a glock 27. mexican carry. and no way in hell am i going to carry hot. a bullet to my balls might as well be a bullet to my heart.

'nom sayin?

 

[ChDangerfield]

Whose liability theirs or yours. Theirs is for monetary reasons, yours is to save your life. Which do you think is more important? I know what my answer is, because they aren't worried about my life, not really.

I did mean theirs

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[Stengun]

Howdy,

I use the George Zimmerman case as an example:

Did George have the ability to chamber a round while he was getting his butt kicked by a skinny boy? Even with George's +1 year of intense MMA training he still would not have had a chance to "rack the slide".

Pretty simple.

Carry hot. If you are afraid if your gun, get a different gun, maybe a revolver.

Paul

 

[Treo]

The XD striker is always fully back. The sear drops but does not pull back.

Ok , now I think we understand each other.

But to put it in perspective would you carry a 1911 in Condition zero ?

 

[ChDangerfield]

Ok , now I think we understand each other.

But to put it in perspective would you carry a 1911 in Condition zero ?

I have. I don't like to. If I have a safety I use it.

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[Kramer1113]

It’s actually been a month or so since this thread has come up.

This is what decided me, when I first started carrying the people around me were all 1911 aficionados.
They all carried their firearms cocked in a holster with a retention strap; the strap went between the hammer and the firing pin (which isn’t a bad Idea).
Anyway my gun was an S&W Model 915 with a decocker. Not knowing any better I carried it in the holster cocked and unlocked with the retention strap between the hammer and firing pin.

DISCLAIMER: What I just described is absolutely an unsafe way to carry a firearm.

Having said that I carried it that way for about 6 month before someone squared me away and the pistol didn’t fire ever.

Very Honest Treo. Mistakes that no one knows about are often times the hardest to admit. Excellent training tip.

 

[Kramer1113]

i carry a glock 27. mexican carry. and no way in hell am i going to carry hot. a bullet to my balls might as well be a bullet to my heart.

'nom sayin?

I would change my method of carry if losing my balls was a serious concern. Ball Loss, Life Loss... Retrain your brain and begin a different carry routine.

 

[Nok]

I would change my method of carry if losing my balls was a serious concern.

oh would you?

 

[K7lvo]

The only time I would suggest not to carry hot is with some older wheel guns. Most of those were single action only and the pin would rest on the primer. If you got a double action, then you could go cold because as you pull the trigger the next round moves in. But with the lack of rounds in a wheel gun, you want all cylinders. If you are going the wheel gun route just make sure it has a safety for the hammer. I don't know the name of it but it keeps the hammer away from the primer unless the trigger is pulled.

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When you carry a revolver without a round under the hammer, it's still "hot," but you have one less round. Older revolvers have nothing to prevent the hammer, if struck, from engaging the primer, and should not have a round under the hammer. The hammer block was designed to prevent the hammer from hitting the primer unless the trigger is pulled, and revolvers have been made this way for at least the past 60-70 years.

 

[K7lvo]

I don't carry hot.
Yes, time is always of the essence. But I have not put enough practice into drawing and removing safety to be comfortable with it. It takes a LOT of practice and constant practice to be proficient enough to be safe. And being safe is as important as protection.
Accidentally shooting yourself or God forbid, someone else, gives us all a bad name.

My sister-in-law shot my brother in the leg, with three young children in the room. I know of several other instances where people shot their foot or leg.

Let me see if I understand what you're saying: You haven't enough practice to carry with a round in the chamber, but you have had enough practice to be able to chamber a round quickly and efficiently when death is staring you in the face...