Concealed Carrying While In The Military


I disagree. They are there to help soldiers navigate not just the military legal system but the civilian one as well. They can not represent you in civilian court, but they can advise. Twenty years in the Army, I sent my soldiers there numerous times and used them myself. Worst case scenario is, they tell you they can't help you. At least ask.

Why not just ask the agency in charge of the permits/licenses? The phone call costs the same:

The people to call for the definitive answer is:
Program Director, Lisa Knight
1150 Foster Avenue
Nashville, TN 37243
(615) 251-8590

If the answer is desired in writing, then write them a letter. If the person ends up in civilian court over something relating to a firearms permit/license which is going to influence the judge more - a JAG's opinion from the military - or the state agency that issues the permits?
 

Hey navy... here is MORE PROOF that you are talking out your azz and have no clue:

look at page 8 on this ATF form and then go cry in a corner because once again, I have proven you are one of the STUPID smart people.......

Link Removed
 
Hey navy... here is MORE PROOF that you are talking out your azz and have no clue:

look at page 8 on this ATF form and then go cry in a corner because once again, I have proven you are one of the STUPID smart people.......

Link Removed

I think you've been drinking again. What you posted supports my opinion, not yours.

From the document that YOU posted:
Military members on active duty and legal aliens
have special residency considerations.
A member of the Armed
Forces on active duty is a
resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty
station is located. FFLs may accept electronic permanent
change of station (PCS) orders, accompanied by a valid
military identification card, to establish residency for an
active duty military member of the Armed Forces.
 
I think you've been drinking again. What you posted supports my opinion, not yours.

From the document that YOU posted:

Read further down the page too idiot..... and elsewhere in the book.... If the military member is a resident of another state (has a drivers lic, etc...) from his home State, He CAN STILL BUY FIREARMS THERE ALSO!!! get a clue dude, you are proving officers havent a clue, like I knew all along in my 25+ yrs with the military...
 
Read further down the page too idiot..... and elsewhere in the book.... If the military member is a resident of another state (has a drivers lic, etc...) from his home State, He CAN STILL BUY FIREARMS THERE ALSO!!! get a clue dude, you are proving officers havent a clue, like I knew all along in my 25+ yrs with the military...

This whole discussion is off topic for this thread. However, I notice that when some people cannot back their statements up with facts, instead of just admitting they are wrong they will resort to name calling and belittlement in an attempt to somehow make their arguments stronger. Personally, I choose to just present the facts, (which you have so conveniently provided yourself), which prove your assertions to be incorrect.

From the very document that you posted on page 8:
Sales to Members of the Armed Forces


A member of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. However, if a military member maintains a home in one State and has a permanent duty station in a another State to which he or she commutes each day, the military member has two States of residence and may purchase a firearm in either State—and must list both the residence address and permanent duty station in Item 2 on the Form 4473.


A military member on active duty must present either a current driver’s license or State identification card from your State, or a copy of the official orders showing the military member’s permanent duty station in your State along with a military photo identification card, an out-of-State driver’s license, or an out-of-State identification card.
On page 6 are the requirements for the use of a Driver's License as a stand alone identification document:
Military members and legal aliens may have special identification document considerations.


No additional valid identification documentation is required of an active-duty member of the Armed Forces or a legal alien if he or she possesses a valid identification document (e.g., driver’s license) that contains his or her name, residence address, date of birth, and photograph and is issued by the State in which your business premises is located. If a member of the Armed Forces or a legal alien does not possess a valid, State-issued identification document with the necessary information, you may accept a combination of valid Government-issued documents to satisfy the identification document requirement. A member of the Armed Forces on active duty may satisfy the identification document requirement by presenting his or her military identification card along with official orders showing his or her permanent duty station.
If you notice, question 2 on the form 4473 asks for Current Residence Address. Clearly, the ATF considers the Current Residence Address to be where the military member commutes to every day if they do not live at their permanent duty station. If the service member happens to have a driver's license that shows their current residence address on it, that is all they need. They are not required to show military ID or orders. However, most military members won't have a driver's license that has their current residence address on it; and, it that case, they can prove residency in the state their orders are to by showing their military ID card which proves identity, and their orders which prove state of residence.


It really is quite simple.... it just doesn't agree with what you claim to be true. There is a huge difference between showing a driver's license that has the actual real and current residence address on it - and showing a driver's license that has an outdated address that the person no longer resides at in order to deceive the FFL because the person also lied on what their CURRENT residence address is on the form 4473 (the location where the person is present with the intention of making a home there.) It would be quite humorous for me to show my Wyoming driver's license to an FFL in Wyoming and attempt to claim to be a Wyoming resident because my Home of Record is Wyoming because even the state of Wyoming can understand that I am a resident of where I live, which is Washington, because they printed my Washington address on the driver's license the last time I renewed.
 
This whole discussion is off topic for this thread. However, I notice that when some people cannot back their statements up with facts, instead of just admitting they are wrong they will resort to name calling and belittlement in an attempt to somehow make their arguments stronger. Personally, I choose to just present the facts, (which you have so conveniently provided yourself), which prove your assertions to be incorrect.

From the very document that you posted on page 8:

On page 6 are the requirements for the use of a Driver's License as a stand alone identification document:

If you notice, question 2 on the form 4473 asks for Current Residence Address. Clearly, the ATF considers the Current Residence Address to be where the military member commutes to every day if they do not live at their permanent duty station. If the service member happens to have a driver's license that shows their current residence address on it, that is all they need. They are not required to show military ID or orders. However, most military members won't have a driver's license that has their current residence address on it; and, it that case, they can prove residency in the state their orders are to by showing their military ID card which proves identity, and their orders which prove state of residence.


It really is quite simple.... it just doesn't agree with what you claim to be true. There is a huge difference between showing a driver's license that has the actual real and current residence address on it - and showing a driver's license that has an outdated address that the person no longer resides at in order to deceive the FFL because the person also lied on what their CURRENT residence address is on the form 4473 (the location where the person is present with the intention of making a home there.) It would be quite humorous for me to show my Wyoming driver's license to an FFL in Wyoming and attempt to claim to be a Wyoming resident because my Home of Record is Wyoming because even the state of Wyoming can understand that I am a resident of where I live, which is Washington, because they printed my Washington address on the driver's license the last time I renewed.

And you are still an idiot..... you UTTERLY FAIL to comprehend that if you are a citizen of a State, paying taxes to them (if they have income tax) you can still LEGALLY BUY a firearm in that state... no matter how much NAVYDIPSTICK says it isnt so, it still is the truth..... When you are in the military, other laws ALSO apply...... but not EXCLUSIVELY.. get that through your head and you might just get a clue.... In other words, what I have been saying all along is correct, and you are hiding behind one part of the regs/laws, and totally ignoring other parts which still apply.....
 
Axeanda45, your interpretation regarding firearm sales/transfers is not consistent with my understanding of the law either. Go ahead and do what you want to do. You are convinced of your position and no one will change your mind. But I would discourage you from advocating a position that *could* get a military member convicted of a felony.

Regardless, the issues surrounding firearm transfers and sales has NOTHING to do with the topic of this thread. Not sure why you decided to launch into that issue in this thread (except perhaps to "prove" that "officers havent a clue.") Concealed carry laws are not regulated by ATF--this is a state issue. Recommend dropping this issue and returning to the concealed carry discussion at hand.
 
Axeanda45, your interpretation regarding firearm sales/transfers is not consistent with my understanding of the law either. Go ahead and do what you want to do. You are convinced of your position and no one will change your mind. But I would discourage you from advocating a position that *could* get a military member convicted of a felony.

Regardless, the issues surrounding firearm transfers and sales has NOTHING to do with the topic of this thread. Not sure why you decided to launch into that issue in this thread (except perhaps to "prove" that "officers havent a clue.") Concealed carry laws are not regulated by ATF--this is a state issue. Recommend dropping this issue and returning to the concealed carry discussion at hand.
the issue came up while discussing the subject of military in a state other than where you are a resident... it applies, if you dont like it, dont effing read it.


it is the exact same thing as if you own houses in different states and stay at them at different times of the year...... you have dual (or more) residencies.... same thing goes if you have dual citizenship in another country, if you are in the US in your home state,you can buy weapons while there.....

If you are stationed in another state, there are specific rules the atf has put in place so you are considered a resident there for the purpose of being eligible to buy weapons in that state.. Being a resident of another state qualifies you to buy weapons there also.... If neither of you are smart enough to figure that out, I cant help you.
 
Well, the facts have been posted. People can read what the regulations are and make an informed decision whether or not they want to take the advice of someone who can't do much else than throw temper tantrums and call people names.
 
The only way my son can legally buy a handgun in the state he's currently stationed in is to purchase one through the Exchange system on post or the nearby AFB or Naval Base. I don't know about the local gun shops in his case. In order to purchase he must bring a copy of his PCS orders to his Post's Exchange when he purchases a weapon. However, as an active duty military member, the state he's residing in issued him a CCW for that state. These laws are confusing and your best bet is to talk to the legal people at Campbell for the most up to date advise. I'm a military retiree and resident of TN, and I was going to try and purchase a second 1911 at Campbell's Exchange, but I'm leery about driving an hour or so to get there just to be told I can't since the Exchange is technically in KY (because of the zip code being in another state).
 
The only way my son can legally buy a handgun in the state he's currently stationed in is to purchase one through the Exchange system on post or the nearby AFB or Naval Base.

What state is he in, California? By Federal law any FFL can accept military orders as proof of residence and military ID card as proof of identity.
 
What state is he in, California? By Federal law any FFL can accept military orders as proof of residence and military ID card as proof of identity.
I'd like to know the answer to that as well. I know of no state that specifically prevents military members from buying guns in opposition to the federal law that allows it, and I'm a military retiree too. I had an FFL for many of the years I was in the service, so I was familiar with many of the laws and regulations that most people wouldn't ordinarily be. I was even stationed in Kalifornia for three years and was eligible to buys guns there if I had wanted to, even though I was not from Kalifornia.
 
I'd like to know the answer to that as well. I know of no state that specifically prevents military members from buying guns in opposition to the federal law that allows it, and I'm a military retiree too. I had an FFL for many of the years I was in the service, so I was familiar with many of the laws and regulations that most people wouldn't ordinarily be. I was even stationed in Kalifornia for three years and was eligible to buys guns there if I had wanted to, even though I was not from Kalifornia.

I thought in California it was an issue with DROS that the DROS system would not accept anything other than a California driver's license...
 
My son is stationed in Virginia. But that's why I also stated that I didn't know the law concerning active duty in the state he's in.
 
My son is stationed in Virginia. But that's why I also stated that I didn't know the law concerning active duty in the state he's in.

Well, you posted:

The only way my son can legally buy a handgun in the state he's currently stationed in is to purchase one through the Exchange system on post or the nearby AFB or Naval Base.

That is not true in Virginia. He can purchase a handgun anywhere in Virginia, including from a private party.
 
I knew he could purchase at the Exchange. I was with him when he asked but like I said I wasn't aware of the law concerning active duty when purchasing firearms in a local business. Just wanted clarification. Thanks.
 

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