God & the Bible, squaring belief with reality

[gunnerbob]

Correct Treo, the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls prove beyond any doubt that the scriptures of the Bible have not been altered from the original scriptures.

I found these interesting reads concerning the Dead Sea Scrolls.

There's insight - but not proof - in the Dead Sea Scrolls - JSOnline

Dead Sea Scrolls prove Bible unoriginal

And, this was linked in the read above...

Link Removed

Theoligy is an extremely interesting subject to say the least, I read as much as I can...

 

[PestControl02]

If God's all powerfull don't you think He can watch over his word to make sure it says what He wants it to say?



In what way do you mean that?

Romans 3: 19 & 20 tells us that the purpose of the Law is to show that the entire world is guilty

19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

The purpose of the Law is to show us that apart from Christ we have no hope of entering Heaven by our good deeds

Yeah..I believe it was Divinely inspired...that God moved men to record His word...and that men have interrupted it ever since.
There is like a 100 different interpretations and probably 100 different denominations...all claiming they are the only one thats right.
You can understand how people get confused.

Knowing God is all powerful, I believe He has a hand in them all...one message for me and another for you...He resonates in me what I need and resonates in you what you need. I mean, it boils down to- I cant say your individual choice of faith is wrong... if it works for you and you feel secure in your faith and you feel God's presence in your life..who am I to interfere with that? ..I think it is more important that you have found God & are exploring your spirituality as opposed to finding the "right" denomination.

As far as the 10 Commandments..I meant that if a person is not going to do anything else..not going to read a Bible, not going to church, not involved in any way, etc..but they do believe God exists...they should at least respect the 10 Commandments.

 

[Shoobee]

Yeah..I believe it was Divinely inspired...that God moved men to record His word...and that men have interrupted it ever since.
There is like a 100 different interpretations and probably 100 different denominations...all claiming they are the only one thats right.
You can understand how people get confused.

...

Wiki lists 313 Christian denominations. A lot more than 100.

List of Christian denominations by number of members - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Treo]

As far as the 10 Commandments..I meant that if a person is not going to do anything else..not going to read a Bible, not going to church, not involved in any way, etc..but they do believe God exists...they should at least respect the 10 Commandments.

That’s kind of my point, you can “respect” the 10 commandments all you want but no matter how hard you try you will never be able to keep them. Jesus made that crystal clear in the Sermon on the Mount.

The Bible makes it clear that, excepting Jesus Christ, no one on this planet has ever perfectly kept the law; all have sinned and fall short of His Glory.

The purpose of the Law is to reveal man’s true state (guilty) before a Holy God. The Law is there to show us that apart from Jesus Christ we have no hope of entering Heaven because our sins have disqualified us.

God doesn’t grade on a curve, it’s strictly Pass or Fail and if you’ve kept the entire Law (impossible) and stumbled at the smallest point you’re just as guilty as if you’d broken the entire Law. The intent of the Law is to drive you to Christ .

 

[Ringo]

You can understand how people get confused.

I mean, it boils down to- I cant say your individual choice of faith is wrong... if it works for you and you feel secure in your faith and you feel God's presence in your life..who am I to interfere with that? ..

As far as the 10 Commandments..I meant that if a person is not going to do anything else..not going to read a Bible, not going to church, not involved in any way, etc..but they do believe God exists...they should at least respect the 10 Commandments.

1) Feelings LIE.
2)There is only one truth, seek and you will find it.
3)The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and good feelings.
4) One can't respect something that they're not involved (lack of knowledge) with in any way.
5)Even Satan believes God exists.

 

[gunnerbob]

1) Feelings LIE.
2)There is only one truth, seek and you will find it.
3)The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and good feelings.
4) One can't respect something that they're not involved (lack of knowledge) with in any way.
5)Even Satan believes God exists.

That goes without saying right...? If Satan doesn't exist, than niether would God... I think my logic here is sound.

Ringo, you always make good points, I thank you for that.

 

[Treo]

I mean, it boils down to- I cant say your individual choice of faith is wrong... if it works for you and you feel secure in your faith and you feel God's presence in your life..who am I to interfere with that? ..I think it is more important that you have found God & are exploring your spirituality as opposed to finding the "right" denomination.

It’s hard to know exactly what you mean here but let me be very clearthe Bible states that the only way to escape Hell is through the Blood of Christ. So, if you are a sincere and devout Muslim, or Hindu or Buddhist and your faith works for you and you “feel god’s presence in your life”, I can tell you without hesitation or doubt that you will stand before God on Judgment day, be found wanting and cast into the Lake of Fire for all eternity.

 

[PestControl02]

It’s hard to know exactly what you mean here but let me be very clearthe Bible states that the only way to escape Hell is through the Blood of Christ. So, if you are a sincere and devout Muslim, or Hindu or Buddhist and your faith works for you and you “feel god’s presence in your life”, I can tell you without hesitation or doubt that you will stand before God on Judgment day, be found wanting and cast into the Lake of Fire for all eternity.

How can you say if a person chooses some other religion they'll burn for eternity? You can't know God's intentions..this is His universe and everything in it is here for His reasons. It's entirely possible God inspired their books just the same as He inspired mine.
We are all His children, I'm not sure if you're a parent or not, but each child has their own needs, weakness & strengths. What might be very effective for one is useless on another.

Without any disrespect intended, you seem to not give God His proper authority over His creations...He is all powerful and His Grace is infinite...What if God says they're all correct? put here for His specific reasons-and that you & I are incapable of knowing how or why He chose it to be this way.
Again- no disrespect to you or your faith. I'm not trying to change your mind or anything like that. I openly share my point of view as a personal learning & growing experience, your input is always welcomed & considered, thank you Treo.

 

[Treo]

How can you say if a person chooses some other religion they'll burn for eternity? You can't know God's intentions..this is His universe and everything in it is here for His reasons. It's entirely possible God inspired their books just the same as He inspired mine.

You do know that the book that you claim to believe is God inspired states very clearly that no one comes to the father except through the Son right?


John 14:6
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Is that God inspired or not?

 

[PestControl02]

You do know that the book that you claim to believe is God inspired states very clearly that no one comes to the father except through the Son right?


John 14:6
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

Is that God inspired or not?

I believe and have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal savior.

I also accept God's infinite Grace & wisdom to be unknowable.

 

[Treo]

How can you say if a person chooses some other religion they'll burn for eternity? You can't know God's intentions..this is His universe and everything in it is here for His reasons. It's entirely possible God inspired their books just the same as He inspired mine.

I believe and have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal savior.

Both of these statements can not be true

 

[Ringo]

How can you say if a person chooses some other religion they'll burn for eternity? You can't know God's intentions.. It's entirely possible God inspired their books just the same as He inspired mine.
What if God says they're all correct?

God made His intentions very clear...Galatians 1:8.."But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned".

 

[PestControl02]

Both of these statements can not be true

sure they are
one recognizes Gods unlimited awareness...we can't know His intentions. Truth

one states my personal belief. Truth

 

[PestControl02]

God made His intentions very clear...Galatians 1:8.."But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned".

Agreed. I leave it to God to judge who should be condemned.

 

[PestControl02]

Lots of words in this forum.
I'm not going to add many.
I am God.
Eagleeyes knows the score. Listen to her.

Thanks for that Gregg, eagle is awake and understands this reality better than most...ahead of her time even.


And yes, you are God, because I believe you are a perfect reflection of your creator.

shame you don't have more to add.

This thread was intended to be a solution based discussion on how & why our reality doesn't fit the beliefs that we have. And what can be done to better align ourselves to change this reality for the better.
It's completely de-railed at this point..lol

When I read my Bible I get a story of selfless love for all..a love so unconditional that Jesus would suffer & die for our forgiveness, the ultimate sacrifice so that all mankind could find the narrow path back to our Father. It's inspirational & enlightening.

Seems though I am nearly alone in this belief..as most consider war & debt & condemnation to be the ultimate lessons of the Bible and this is certainly reflected in our reality today.

I have come to understand that each will choose their own path, I will not say a chosen path is wrong or right, only that with each choice comes the responsibility of it's outcome.

 

[Ringo]

I have come to understand that each will choose their own path, I will not say a chosen path is wrong or right, only that with each choice comes the responsibility of it's outcome.

Matthew7:13.."Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to DESTRUCTION, and MANY enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to LIFE, and only a FEW find it".

 

[Treo]

This thread was intended to be a solution based discussion on how & why our reality doesn't fit the beliefs that we have.

The problem is that your beliefs don't fit the reality we have

Reality number 1 Romans 3:23
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God

Reality number 2
Acts 17:30-31
New King James Version (NKJV)
30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”

Reality number three
Rev. 20 11-15 The Great White Throne Judgment
11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God,[c] and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.[d] 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

All of these quotes were taken from a book that you stated was divinely inspired a book you claim to have read numerous times

 

[PestControl02]

Matthew7:13.."Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to DESTRUCTION, and MANY enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to LIFE, and only a FEW find it".

I know Ringo, considering we are on the path of destruction...as even the most casual look around will prove...I thought maybe it'd be a good time re-evaluate what we're doing individually that could help narrow the road.

again though, I leave judgement to The Almighty..I have no authority beyond myself, and I believe His plan will ultimately be fulfilled to His complete & total satisfaction.

 

[PestControl02]

The problem is that your beliefs don't fit the reality we have

Reality number 1 Romans 3:23
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God

Reality number 2
Acts 17:30-31
New King James Version (NKJV)
30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”

Reality number three
Rev. 20 11-15 The Great White Throne Judgment
11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God,[c] and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.[d] 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

All of these quotes were taken from a book that you stated was divinely inspired a book you claim to have read numerous times

Nothing I've said disputes a single word, in fact I fully agree with the quotes here.
I'm only saying maybe we should consider what our, individual, "works" are...what are we, individually, doing to earn respect in the book of life.

or not. You don't have to do anything differently.

and, you are right, my beliefs are surely not in line with this degenerate, sick society. My desire is to change what I see through peaceful co-operation.

 

[Treo]

we, individually, doing to earn respect in the book of life.

Thats kinda the point you can't earn your way into that book

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

1 timothy 2 8-9
Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me His prisoner, but share with me in the sufferings for the gospel according to the power of God, 9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began

The only way to get your name in the book is to put your trust in Jesus.

Jesus Himself stated that our main mission on this earth was to spread the Gospel not to build some utopia here

15 And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17

Matthew 28 18

18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore[c] and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

Remember you said this book was Divinely inspired