Stance-Students That Won't Bend

[Grizzly Adam]

I see this one all the time when teaching stance, you coach the student to lean forward or to bend at the hips, loosen up the knees. What do they do-- they lock their knees and lean way way. Over and over!

How would you proceed?

 

[Eidolon]

Taser

 

[bofh]

Yelling "duck" at the shooter as a command may help to bend the knees and lean forward.

Also, most shooters doing the leaning back do it for two reasons: (1) the shooter is scared of the bang and/or (2) the shooter has a lack of upper body strength. If the shooter is scared of the bang, tell the student that leaning back doesn't get him/her any farther away from the firearm. If the shooter has a lack of upper body strength, tell the student to utilize the low-ready position more often to rest (especially with shotguns and rifles).

In general, I am for not teaching any specific "shooting" stance. Instead, the basics of self defense without a firearm apply. If I, as an attacker, can knock you over with a simple push with my hand, so can any firearm recoil.

 

[Bikenut]

He who is standing in a "stance" during a real life self defense situation is being a very good stationary target for the bad guy.

 

[Grizzly Adam]

He who is standing in a "stance" during a real life self defense situation is being a very good stationary target for the bad guy.

While that may be true, the last thing I want a beginner student doing is running around my range with a loaded weapon :fie:
We are focusing on basics and a well disciplined stance is certainly worth teaching.

 

[Grizzly Adam]

Yelling "duck" at the shooter as a command may help to bend the knees and lean forward.

Also, most shooters doing the leaning back do it for two reasons: (1) the shooter is scared of the bang and/or (2) the shooter has a lack of upper body strength. If the shooter is scared of the bang, tell the student that leaning back doesn't get him/her any farther away from the firearm. If the shooter has a lack of upper body strength, tell the student to utilize the low-ready position more often to rest (especially with shotguns and rifles).

In general, I am for not teaching any specific "shooting" stance. Instead, the basics of self defense without a firearm apply. If I, as an attacker, can knock you over with a simple push with my hand, so can any firearm recoil.

Thanks for your reply. I'm not trying to force anyone into a specific stance but rather modify what they are doing to be fundamentally sound-- and stable!

 

[Silent Bob]

Repetition is the key here, and as the instructor it's your duty to politely and continually correct any poor habits/form.

Using the "duck!" catch phrase or some other action word will help remind the student what they need to be doing and the fact you are still paying attention to what they are doing.

Keep at it, your persistence will pay off.

 

[Robgmn]

Teach them some Karate kata.
Some similar positioning (and locked knees usually gets you knocked over by Sensei).

 

[pete lynch]

Stance is for a beginner learning how to use a firearm to shoot at paper.

 

[Robgmn]

Stance is for a beginner learning how to use a firearm to shoot at paper.

Huh?

 

[bofh]

Teach them some Karate kata.
Some similar positioning (and locked knees usually gets you knocked over by Sensei).

Excellent point. It is not only about a stable stance that allows one to repetitively shoot without getting pushed back by the recoil, but also about the ability to move smoothly in different directions or to different positions while maintaining stability.

 

[bofh]

Two articles about stance by the same author: An evolution of understanding.

OH, DEAR: Rob Pincus Doesn’t Understand The Weaver Position
My Criticism Of Rob Pincus Was Dumb. Here’s Why.

My chosen quote:

In the end, position names don’t matter, as long as you can get the hits to stop the fight.

 

[BluesStringer]

I see this one all the time when teaching stance, you coach the student to lean forward or to bend at the hips, loosen up the knees. What do they do-- they lock their knees and lean way way. Over and over!

How would you proceed?

As far as teaching basic fundamentals as-mentioned subsequent to your OP, this question isn't really relevant in either case, but I'm just curious - Are you instructing in a beginner defensive pistol (or "tactical" if you prefer) course, or are you preparing students to pass a qualification test to get their permission slip to carry? The reason I say teaching basic fundamentals in either case is irrelevant to the question is because there's nothing to be criticized or commented about at all in starting beginners off with basic fundamentals in either case. It would seem to me though, to be less of an issue of focus if all they're going to do is fire between 7 and 50 rounds downrange to get their permit (depending which state they're taking a required performance test in, and I don't know Iowa's requirements, if any, for performance tests, thus simply giving a range that I've seen bandied about for a long time). If you're conducting actual defensive pistol courses where several hundred to maybe even 1,000 or more rounds might be fired during them, then fundamentals are imperative to be part of what's drilled into a beginner.

I am just curious what kinds of classes/courses you're actually instructing on.

Blues

 

[SGB]

Repetition is the key here, and as the instructor it's your duty to politely and continually correct any poor habits/form.

Using the "duck!" catch phrase or some other action word will help remind the student what they need to be doing and the fact you are still paying attention to what they are doing.

Keep at it, your persistence will pay off.

This - repetition is the key.

 

[Blueshell]

I see this one all the time when teaching stance, you coach the student to lean forward or to bend at the hips, loosen up the knees. What do they do-- they lock their knees and lean way way. Over and over!

How would you proceed?

Don't lean at all. That's stupid.

The student should do whatever helps them hit the target.

 

[Blueshell]

He who is standing in a "stance" during a real life self defense situation is being a very good stationary target for the bad guy.

Exactly!