Self Defense in home burglary

[thomas0792]

This is a piece on a man who held his invaders at gunpoint for police to arrive. Just a bunch of kids in this one, but say this happened to one of us, by let's assume an average size male of plenty age, and we decided we didn't really want to kill anyone but wanted to hold them for the cops to arrive. And there are two invaders. If they tried to escape, could you gun them down? Probably not right? So either physically take them on and restrain them for a citizens arrest or let them go right? What do you think?

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[bofh]

This is a piece on a man who held his invaders at gunpoint for police to arrive. Just a bunch of kids in this one, but say this happened to one of us, by let's assume an average size male of plenty age, and we decided we didn't really want to kill anyone but wanted to hold them for the cops to arrive. And there are two invaders. If they tried to escape, could you gun them down? Probably not right? So either physically take them on and restrain them for a citizens arrest or let them go right? What do you think?

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Wrong question! You never ask "could I shoot someone". The question is, do you have to shoot someone. I highly recommend to either take a legal training class or get some legal reading material about what happens after the fight. Realize that you will get taken into custody and you will go through the legal system.

Wrong conclusions! If someone is so dangerous that you point a gun at that person, he is also too dangerous to approach to "physically take them on" or to "restrain them". Just point your gun at the threat and wait for LEO backup. That means that you need to point your gun at the threat and call 911 with your cell phone while giving unmistakable commands to the threat and being aware of your surroundings. Clear commands are: "Stop!", "Don't move!", and "Put your hands above your head!". As burglars are rarely alone, there may be an accomplice around that you have not caught yet. He may be armed and may be shooting at you without warning. That's why you need to be aware of your surroundings.

By the way, "physically take them on" is pretty much the stupidest I ever heard in this context. Distance is your friend. You have no idea if the thread has a concealed firearm or knife. The threat may be also just physically stronger that you are. "Physically take them on" is a recipe for disaster that can land you in jail or get you killed. Get that movie hero mentality out of your head ASAP! If the threat runs away, let them and be a good (and alive) witness once law enforcement arrives.

Resources:

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5 Things Every Reasonable Gun Owner Ought To Know

 

[thomas0792]

Wrong question! You never ask "could I shoot someone". The question is, do you have to shoot someone. I highly recommend to either take a legal training class or get some legal reading material about what happens after the fight. Realize that you will get taken into custody and you will go through the legal system.

Wrong conclusions! If someone is so dangerous that you point a gun at that person, he is also too dangerous to approach to "physically take them on" or to "restrain them". Just point your gun at the threat and wait for LEO backup. That means that you need to point your gun at the threat and call 911 with your cell phone while giving unmistakable commands to the threat and being aware of your surroundings. Clear commands are: "Stop!", "Don't move!", and "Put your hands above your head!". As burglars are rarely alone, there may be an accomplice around that you have not caught yet. He may be armed and may be shooting at you without warning. That's why you need to be aware of your surroundings.

By the way, "physically take them on" is pretty much the stupidest I ever heard in this context. Distance is your friend. You have no idea if the thread has a concealed firearm or knife. The threat may be also just physically stronger that you are. "Physically take them on" is a recipe for disaster that can land you in jail or get you killed. Get that movie hero mentality out of your head ASAP!

Resources:

Link Removed

5 Things Every Reasonable Gun Owner Ought To Know

Yeah thanks, anyone else?

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[1911LVR]

If they run away it would not be self-defense any longer. I would hold them until help arrived, but if they ran I would let them go. I would not restrain them or take any force unless I was attacked.

 

[thomas0792]

If they run away it would not be self-defense any longer. I would hold them until help arrived, but if they ran I would let them go. I would not restrain them or take any force unless I was attacked.

I agree, I was just curious, bc say they have something valuable and decided to make a run for it? Can you not protect your property as much as your life?

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[bofh]

I agree, I was just curious, bc say they have something valuable and decided to make a run for it? Can you not protect your property as much as your life?

Stupid is as stupid does. Where did you get the idea that you can shoot a thief? Anyway, I will happily convict you of murder if I have the chance to be on the jury.

By the way, your legal costs will be more than what ever was stolen from you alone. Maybe instead of shrugging my post #2 off with a reply that was so quick that it didn't even capture an edit I did, you should watch that video and read that book. It may prevent you from getting more stupid ideas like this.

 

[thomas0792]

Stupid is as stupid does. Where did you get the idea that you can shoot a thief? Anyway, I will happily convict you of murder if I have the chance to be on the jury.

By the way, your legal costs will be more that what ever was stolen from you alone. Maybe instead of shrugging my post #2 off with a reply that was so quick that it didn't even capture an edit I did, you should watch that video and read that book. It may prevent you from getting more stupid ideas like this.

LOL get a life dude.

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[bofh]

LOL get a life dude.

You asked what I thought about your OP and I provided you with the information requested. It is not my fault that you seem to be hellbent on finding a moral justification to shoot someone illegally.

 

[thomas0792]

You asked what I thought about your OP and I provided you with the information requested. It is not my fault that you seem to be hellbent on finding a moral justification to shoot someone illegally.

Actually. I dread hearing from your arrogant, egotistical ass every time I post to this forum. And I wouldn't need moral justification if I shot them right away so your point is moot.

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[bofh]

Actually. I dread hearing from your arrogant, egotistical ass every time I post to this forum. And I wouldn't need moral justification if I shot them right away so your point is moot.

It's your life. You are free to throw it away with a stupid stunt. Just don't count on anyone else to understand or condone your actions.

Shooting a burglar right away, because you are in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm is justified in many sates due to the Castle Doctrine. Shooting a burglar that you caught and that later on runs away is murder as you are no longer in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm. Are you willing to spend the rest of your life in prison over shooting a burglar? I am certainly willing to convict you of such a crime, so should be every law-abiding citizen.

Your posts clearly demonstrate an utter failure of understanding the basics of self defense using lethal force. I presented you with valuable information by well-known authors about this topic. You responded rather childish, because I seem to have offended you in that gun belt thread. That's your problem, not mine.

By the way, those "what if" threads never end well, by design. It is always about an OP that desperately wants to know when he could shoot someone, not when he has to. The Deadly Force and The Law subforum has a number of these threads.

 

[thomas0792]

It's your life. You are free to throw it away with a stupid stunt. Just don't count on anyone else to understand or condone your actions.

Shooting a burglar right away, because you are in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm is justified in many sates due to the Castle Doctrine. Shooting a burglar that you caught and that later on runs away is murder as you are no longer in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm. Are you willing to spend the rest of your life in prison over shooting a burglar? I am certainly willing to convict you of such a crime, so should be every law-abiding citizen.

Your posts clearly demonstrate an utter failure of understanding the basics of self defense using lethal force. I presented you with valuable information by well-known authors about this topic. You responded rather childish, because I seem to have offended you in that gun belt thread. That's your problem, not mine.

By the way, those "what if" threads never end well, by design. It is always about an OP that desperately wants to know when he could shoot someone, not when he has to. The Deadly Force and The Law subforum has a number of these threads.

A stupid stunt? It was simple question. Am I better off shooting a person right away who has broken into my home, or would it be possible to try and hold them under citizens arrest without relinquishing the right to use my firearm. I knew the answer to my own question, I was curious what others might do or think, excluding you of course.

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[thomas0792]

It's your life. You are free to throw it away with a stupid stunt. Just don't count on anyone else to understand or condone your actions.

Shooting a burglar right away, because you are in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm is justified in many sates due to the Castle Doctrine. Shooting a burglar that you caught and that later on runs away is murder as you are no longer in fear of imminent death or severe bodily harm. Are you willing to spend the rest of your life in prison over shooting a burglar? I am certainly willing to convict you of such a crime, so should be every law-abiding citizen.

Your posts clearly demonstrate an utter failure of understanding the basics of self defense using lethal force. I presented you with valuable information by well-known authors about this topic. You responded rather childish, because I seem to have offended you in that gun belt thread. That's your problem, not mine.

By the way, those "what if" threads never end well, by design. It is always about an OP that desperately wants to know when he could shoot someone, not when he has to. The Deadly Force and The Law subforum has a number of these threads.

And the fact that you are "hellbent" on accusing me of being a trigger happy murderer is just comical. What do you even know about me? Or my intentions? And most importantly, the whole point of this situation would be to not end up killing someone, but I would like to make sure my property isn't taken in the midst of an escape. If it were up to me, yes I would like to be able to shoot someone who tries to escape who just broke into my home, unfortunately you are right, deadly force is not justifiable in this case, especially since I would most likely have to shoot them in the back. A woman about a year ago, shot a teenage boy who was hanging halfway out of her window as she pulled up from work. Killed him too. And I believe he was on his way out of the house, but not sure about that part. She was found of no wrongdoing. Just goes to show, you don't know everything and nothing is ever the same thing. Learn to be respectful and people would value your opinion more. Instead you think you know more than anyone and believe you have to belittle everyone to get your point across. Stupid is as stupid does I suppose.

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[bofh]

A stupid stunt? It was simple question. Am I better off shooting a person right away who has broken into my home, or would it be possible to try and hold them under citizens arrest without relinquishing the right to use my firearm. I knew the answer to my own question, I was curious what others might do or think, excluding you of course.

Your OP did not exclude me. I gave you an answer, you just didn't liked it because it was contrary to your preconceived idea of getting in close physical contact with a burglar.

 

[thomas0792]

Your OP did not exclude me. I gave you an answer, you just didn't liked it because it was contrary to your preconceived idea of getting in close physical contact with a burglar.

Lol you think I want to be fighting with a burglar? Why do I even own guns then? You are special.

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[thomas0792]

Your OP did not exclude me. I gave you an answer, you just didn't liked it because it was contrary to your preconceived idea of getting in close physical contact with a burglar.

And believe me, if knew how to and cared enough to do so, you'd be excluded, but at this point, it's just understood. I don't like you. One. Single. Bit. And I'd bet you couldn't find anyone on this forum that does. And I'd be even more surprised if anyone likes your outside of this forum as well. You're just one of those people.

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[bofh]

And the fact that you are "hellbent" on accusing me of being a trigger happy murderer is just comical. What do you even know about me? Or my intentions? And most importantly, the whole point of this situation would be to not end up killing someone, but I would like to make sure my property isn't taken in the midst of an escape. If it were up to me, yes I would like to be able to shoot someone who tries to escape who just broke into my home, unfortunately you are right, deadly force is not justifiable in this case, especially since I would most likely have to shoot them in the back. A woman about a year ago, shot a teenage boy who was hanging halfway out of her window as she pulled up from work. Killed him too. And I believe he was on his way out of the house, but not sure about that part. She was found of no wrongdoing. Just goes to show, you don't know everything and nothing is ever the same thing. Learn to be respectful and people would value your opinion more. Instead you think you know more than anyone and believe you have to belittle everyone to get your point across. Stupid is as stupid does I suppose.

Your post #5 is a well-known scenario to those that know the law. You are free to state your intentions more clear than asking forum members if you can murder someone. I just clarified that for you.

As for the case you mentioned, you did not provide any of the details. Feel free to use that case as your personal moral justification to shoot someone. However, the facts of a case decide if an action was justifiable or not. Even if you get cleared of wrongdoing, you will be likely facing a legal bill that is more than whatever was stolen from you.

Ask yourself, what property you own is worth your life? You ignored my post #2 that has all that information already in there, including a video and a link to a book that provides you with the answers you seek. It's your life, it's your choice to throw it away.

 

[thomas0792]

Your post #5 is a well-known scenario to those that know the law. You are free to state your intentions more clear than asking forum members if you can murder someone. I just clarified that for you.

As for the case you mentioned, you did not provide any of the details. Feel free to use that case as your personal moral justification to shoot someone. However, the facts of a case decide if an action was justifiable or not. Even if you get cleared of wrongdoing, you will be likely facing a legal bill that is more than whatever was stolen from you.

Ask yourself, what property you own is worth your life? You ignored my post #2 that has all that information already in there, including a video and a link to a book that provides you with the answers you seek. It's your life, it's your choice to throw it away.

Yep, thanks.

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[Reba]

This is a piece on a man who held his invaders at gunpoint for police to arrive.

If the homeowner could keep them down at a distance until the police arrive, that's OK. Warning shot though? No.

Just a bunch of kids in this one, but say this happened to one of us, by let's assume an average size male of plenty age, and we decided we didn't really want to kill anyone but wanted to hold them for the cops to arrive. And there are two invaders.

Being a smallish woman, 66 years old with Parkinson's Disease, I'm going to distance myself from any intruders as much as possible. If cornered, I'd shoot to stop the threat. If I could escape without firing, all the better. It's not my responsibility to "hold" them.

If they tried to escape, could you gun them down? Probably not right? So either physically take them on and restrain them for a citizens arrest or let them go right? What do you think?

I'm not shooting anyone fleeing or physically taking them on, so they get away. As long as I and my loved ones are safe, so what?

Anyway, that's just me.

 

[bofh]

And believe me, if knew how to and cared enough to do so, you'd be excluded, but at this point, it's just understood. I don't like you. One. Single. Bit. And I'd bet you couldn't find anyone on this forum that does. And I'd be even more surprised if anyone likes your outside of this forum as well. You're just one of those people.

You certainly know nothing about me. Get off your high horse and actually try to read and understand my posts. You may actually learn something. Once you understand my post #2, you will also realize how bad your OP and your followup post was. Being liked in an Internet gun forum is of no value to me. I don't seek vanity in life.

 

[thomas0792]

You certainly know nothing about me. Get off your high horse and actually try to read and understand my posts. You may actually learn something. Once you understand my post #2, you will also realize how bad your OP and your followup post was. Being liked in an Internet gun forum is of no value to me. I don't seek vanity in life.

Post #9,135,482

Kick rocks.

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