Loaded weapon encounter with the law

[harmondundee]

More Title 36 information pertaining to National Parks

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLE=36&PART=2&SECTION=4&YEAR=1998&TYPE=TEXT

[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 36, Volume 1, Parts 1 to 199]
[Revised as of July 1, 1998]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 36CFR2.4]

[Page 19-20]

TITLE 36--PARKS, FORESTS, AND PUBLIC PROPERTY

CHAPTER I--NATIONAL PARK SERVICE, DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR

PART 2--RESOURCE PROTECTION, PUBLIC USE AND RECREATION--Table of Contents

Sec. 2.4 Weapons, traps and nets.

(a)(1) Except as otherwise provided in this section and parts 7
(special regulations) and 13 (Alaska regulations), the following are
prohibited:

(i) Possessing a weapon, trap or net
(ii) Carrying a weapon, trap or net
(iii) Using a weapon, trap or net

(2) Weapons, traps or nets may be carried, possessed or used:
(i) At designated times and locations in park areas where:
(A) The taking of wildlife is authorized by law in accordance with
Sec. 2.2 of this chapter;
(B) The taking of fish is authorized by law in accordance with
Sec. 2.3 of this part.
(ii) When used for target practice at designated times and at
facilities or locations designed and constructed specifically for this
purpose and designated pursuant to special regulations.
(iii) Within a residential dwelling. For purposes of this
subparagraph only, the term ``residential dwelling'' means a fixed
housing structure which is either the principal residence of its
occupants, or is occupied on a regular

[[Page 20]]

and recurring basis by its occupants as an alternate residence or
vacation home.
(3) Traps, nets and unloaded weapons may be possessed within a
temporary lodging or mechanical mode of conveyance when such implements
are rendered temporarily inoperable or are packed, cased or stored in a
manner that will prevent their ready use.
(b) Carrying or possessing a loaded weapon in a motor vehicle,
vessel or other mode of transportation is prohibited, except that
carrying or possessing a loaded weapon in a vessel is allowed when such
vessel is not being propelled by machinery and is used as a shooting
platform in accordance with Federal and State law.
(c) The use of a weapon, trap or net in a manner that endangers
persons or property is prohibited.
(d) The superintendent may issue a permit to carry or possess a
weapon, trap or net under the following circumstances:
(1) When necessary to support research activities conducted in
accordance with Sec. 2.5.
(2) To carry firearms for persons in charge of pack trains or saddle
horses for emergency use.
(3) For employees, agents or cooperating officials in the
performance of their official duties.
(4) To provide access to otherwise inaccessible lands or waters
contiguous to a park area when other means of access are otherwise
impracticable or impossible.

Violation of the terms and conditions of a permit issued pursuant to
this paragraph is prohibited and may result in the suspension or
revocation of the permit.
(e) Authorized Federal, State and local law enforcement officers may
carry firearms in the performance of their official duties.
(f) The carrying or possessing of a weapon, trap or net in violation
of applicable Federal and State laws is prohibited.
(g) The regulations contained in this section apply, regardless of
land ownership, on all lands and waters within a park area that are
under the legislative jurisdiction of the United States.
[48 FR 30282, June 30, 1983, as amended at 49 FR 18450, Apr. 30, 1984;
52 FR 35240, Sept. 18, 1987]

 

[DJ58]

I would consider the hand gun loaded, one chambered should not matter the mag installed and loaded, put your self in there place, they don't know your son, in MI behind the seat of a truck does not get it, I'm sure he is a great kid sounds like a lesson learned, make sure ALL the lights are working gives them no reason to pull you over unless your doing something wrong.

 

[SnowCajun]

I am venting a little, but I would like some input from you guys.

I can't even begin to tell you how many times I've been through the Natchez Trace and been carrying with my CCW. Sure you see the signs along the highway saying it's the Natchez Trace, but I've never looked at the Natchez Trace as a park in comparison to Yellowstone or Yosemite .. I've always thought of it more like a pretty drive through the countryside! Other than it being a historic area it's not like you're going to be getting out and camping or bear watching in Yellowstone or Yosemite, it's more like you're using the road to get somewhere and it just happens to pass through this scenic area! I'm sure I've seen RV areas there before but seriously it just doesn't fit in with the image of a regular National Park, it's more like a pretty drive through the wooded countryside.

I'm always so careful not to carry where it's not allowed, I really missed the boat on this area. Live and learn as they say!

SnowCajun

 

[harmondundee]

ticket paid

Latest update: Ticket was paid, and begrudgingly so. My attorney said that it could be challenged, but it would be very expensive, with no guarantee of a favorable outcome. We simplly did not have the money to carry this to where it needed to go with legal counsel to challenge the charge and get it dropped or dismissed.

Too bad that we have allowed our second amendment rights to be compromised (See previous post with link to the NRA/ILA website). "Additional legislation needed".

We as a group need to contact our congressmen and have this law clarified or removed altogether. The law, as is, DOES restricts and violates our second amendment rights (see previous post). The officer in question was enforcing an existing law. They did not write the law, and their job is to enforce the law. It is our job to get our congressmen to change the law. I only wished that the officer in question would have acted on the fact that it was obvious that no laws were intentionally being broken and he was not hunting, like they originally thought. A loaded rifle on the front seat is one thing, but a self-defense weapon is another. I am sure that many LEO's and gun-ban people would want to have an unarmed populace, but so would the criminals.

A very famous historical figure once said that if we allow someone to take away one of our rights, we never really had it (or did not deserve it) in the first place. I can't remember the exact words, but they ring true. We lose a little more of our rights each day.

Paul Harvey once said that "self government won't work without self dicipline." A lot of laws are written to restrict a right that someone abused, thereby affecting all of us. When that law is inclear, it leaves a lot of grey area that the courts have to interpret to apply the law. Out in the field, an officer's discretion comes into play, and the intent of the parties involved have to be examined. If no criminal intent is present, then "no harm, no foul". I believe that to be true in our case. They should not have ticketed my son. Anyway, that's my opinion.

People, thank you for all of your input. This is a very good website, and I have told many others about it. Keep it up!

 

[Memphis]

So can your son continue to buy guns or obtain/maintain his CCW?

I had a similar situation while traveling into southern Maryland for a competition shooting when I was 19. I ended up with 2 years of probation and a $2000 dollar fine because I was honest when I told the 25 year old State Trooper that I indeed had several firearms with me. He went ape s#@t and they tried to make me out like a mass murderer. The charge was "handgun in vehicle". My lawyer was useless and it took years to get my rights recognized. Still not valid for an expungement. My lawyer was USELESS!!!

 

[harmondundee]

Update On Right-To-Carry In National Parks And Wildlife Refuges

Check out this new link:

Link Removed

"We, the people", are trying to get something done about the restoration of our rights.