Why people don't train.


wolf_fire

New member
Forget firearms training, let's focus on doing anything. Why do people do anything? They either have a desire or feel the need to do it. If they don't do something it's either because they don't feel the need or they don't have a desire to do it.

I know a lot of folks who have huge arsenals and haven't fired most of their firearms in years, sometimes decades. They have surrounded themselves with so many firearms that they feel they are always protected.

I know others that only have one or two firearms... they feel they have overcome the hurdle of getting "some protection" that they are now done.

Still there are others who go out 2x a month or more to the range. They perform static and dynamic exercises at the range. When not at the range, they do many different types of dry fire drills and holstering practice. I have found this is the smallest group of firearms owners out there. They are the ones that either have a strong desire or have seen a real need and have placed their utilization of firearms at top priority in their lives.

It all comes down to what priority level one puts their firearms in their life. Many things can trump time away from a firearm. For example, is it right to not spend time with your son, because you needed to spend time on the range to keep your son protected? Well great, your son will be protected but you won't have a relationship with him. Or, is it right not to work those two or three jobs to put food on the table... you know you could really use that time out on the range? Everyone's situation is different.

Range-time consists of two major components: actual time (a lot of people don't have that), and money (a lot of people don't have that either). Two great excuses not to train as much as you think you need to. But what if you are someone who has both time and money. That person, if not training, just doesn't place it as high of a priority compared to other things in his life.

Personally, I feel if someone is going to go down the road of gun ownership for self-protection, one should find the time to continually train and be proficient with it in a variety of different scenarios.
 

WyattEarp

New member
Availability of good, reasonable priced facilities impacts many IMHO. Ammo is an issue but punching paper is not training.
 

7yFQQd

New member
too much gun

In addition to lack of time and money, I think a lot of people, especially women, don't train because they buy too much gun, which is unpleasant to shoot.

Saw a poster here not long ago, who was all proud that his wife finally got a CWP, and chose to buy the S&W 642 Airweight at the gunshow for her first purse gun.

That's a 15-ounce gun, which is painful to shoot after less than a box of ammo. Most likely, she will go to the range once with it, and will learn how uncomfortable it can get during practice. After that, my bet is that she will avoid shooting it more than once a year, if that, for as long as she carries it.

There are a lot of people like that, and not only women, who get these tiny, light guns in duty calibers, which are unpleasant to shoot for practice. Then going to the range becomes like going to the dentist.
 
In addition to lack of time and money, I think a lot of people, especially women, don't train because they buy too much gun, which is unpleasant to shoot.

Saw a poster here not long ago, who was all proud that his wife finally got a CWP, and chose to buy the S&W 642 Airweight at the gunshow for her first purse gun.

That's a 15-ounce gun, which is painful to shoot after less than a box of ammo. Most likely, she will go to the range once with it, and will learn how uncomfortable it can get during practice. After that, my bet is that she will avoid shooting it more than once a year, if that, for as long as she carries it.

There are a lot of people like that, and not only women, who get these tiny, light guns in duty calibers, which are unpleasant to shoot for practice. Then going to the range becomes like going to the dentist.
I don't blame the women. In just about every case I have seen it's been boyfriend, husband ( because they like it.) or some dealer trying to get crap off the self. Once they get fitted with something they like it's not a problem.
 

telpinaro

New member
I don't blame the women. In just about every case I have seen it's been boyfriend, husband ( because they like it.) or some dealer trying to get crap off the self. Once they get fitted with something they like it's not a problem.

I got lucky... my husband suggested my gun, and I LOVE it. I took a huge risk buying it because there weren't any in stores/at ranges for me to try, but if I didn't like shooting it I would have given it to him. It's a .357 Magnum revolver that shoots from the bottom cylinder, the Chiappa Rhino. It's a good weight, muzzle flip is very reduced (I'm quicker back on target with it than a 9mm Glock 26) and recoil is nearly imperceptable. I couldn't imagine shooting an airweight of the same caliber. I've seen a few men complain that their wife/mother/girlfriend won't practice with the gun even though they "love" it... Sorry guys, they don't... they are just being nice.
 

gunnerbob

PEW Professional
I don't get to live fire as often as I'd like, with my work, wife's school/work and my kids... along with the $$$, it's tough to get out when I want to. I do dry-fire practice with Snap-Caps though, I have some for nearly every caliber.
 

7yFQQd

New member
This!

+1! A lot of revolver traditionalists talk down the Rhino, and call it all kinds of names in heated debates I've seen at some of these forums.

I think it's a remarkable design, which brings the revolver into the 21st century. That low barrel concept was pioneered by the Russians for one of their competition pistols. It shot so great against the conventional guns that it was eventually banned by the International Shooting Union from their competitions:
American Rifleman - MC-3: The First Upside Down Gun

If I didn't already have a .357, too many guns, and if it were made in the US, I would have bought a Rhino.
I got lucky... my husband suggested my gun, and I LOVE it. I took a huge risk buying it because there weren't any in stores/at ranges for me to try, but if I didn't like shooting it I would have given it to him. It's a .357 Magnum revolver that shoots from the bottom cylinder, the Chiappa Rhino. It's a good weight, muzzle flip is very reduced (I'm quicker back on target with it than a 9mm Glock 26) and recoil is nearly imperceptable. I couldn't imagine shooting an airweight of the same caliber. I've seen a few men complain that their wife/mother/girlfriend won't practice with the gun even though they "love" it... Sorry guys, they don't... they are just being nice.
 

7yFQQd

New member
great practice ammo

I have bought practice ammo from Georgia Arms for 20+ years now, and can highly recommend it in any caliber.
For the Rhino, the .357 you can get from them at ~45 cents a round, which is still a lot, but reasonable for great ammo:
Link Removed

Of course, you can use .38 Special in that also, which would let you practice for ~26-27 cents a round, which is the same cost as a 9mm:
Link Removed

It's factory-reloaded, US-made ammo, with which I've never had any trouble over the years and thousands of rounds.

Mine is expensive ammunition. However, I still do dry fire or some other form of practice (got a new holster, etc) after my son goes to bed.
 

telpinaro

New member
I have bought practice ammo from Georgia Arms for 20+ years now, and can highly recommend it in any caliber.
For the Rhino, the .357 you can get from them at ~45 cents a round, which is still a lot, but reasonable for great ammo:
Link Removed

Of course, you can use .38 Special in that also, which would let you practice for ~26-27 cents a round, which is the same cost as a 9mm:
Link Removed

It's factory-reloaded, US-made ammo, with which I've never had any trouble over the years and thousands of rounds.

I'll have to check my warranty, but I think factory-reloaded will void it. Rhinos can be touchy, and I don't want to have to pay to repair it any time if I don't have to! I'll definitely save that, though, so I can use it when the warranty expires! :wink:
 

7yFQQd

New member
practice ammo cost

I guess, then the best you can get is ~38 cents a round:
Link Removed

The .357 is really steep - looks like at least 75 cents a round for new ammo!

I'll have to check my warranty, but I think factory-reloaded will void it. Rhinos can be touchy, and I don't want to have to pay to repair it any time if I don't have to! I'll definitely save that, though, so I can use it when the warranty expires! :wink:
 

apvbguy

New member
I shoot because I enjoy shooting, it's been that way my whole life.
without knowing your routine at the range all I can offer is that shooting is not always training. the ability to place your shots in tight little groups is a good skill to possess but it is not necessarily the skill set that you need in a SD situation
 

jtg452

Member
Training isn't practicing. Just going to the range and shooting isn't training, it's practicing unless you are trying something new.

Training is being shown how to do something that you don't know how to do or a new way to do something you already know how to do.

Practicing is doing what you've been shown, the way you've been shown. It's like when a little kid is learning to write. At school (or when sitting down with his parents), he is shown how to write the letters of the alphabet. That's training. When he sits down and writes every letter of the alphabet 10 times, that's practicing.
 

Ringo

A WATCHMAN
without knowing your routine at the range all I can offer is that shooting is not always training. the ability to place your shots in tight little groups is a good skill to possess but it is not necessarily the skill set that you need in a SD situation
I don't have a "routine", I have common sense. You know, common sense? I don't suffer from 'Imagination Inflation" pertaining to SD situations, I'm always aware of my surroundings. Please don't "ass-u-me" that you are qualified to offer me any advise or that I lack any of what you again "ass-u-me" are necessary skills. If you lack skill and need training then speak for yourself and by all means get it.
 

BluesStringer

Les Brers
Training isn't practicing. Just going to the range and shooting isn't training, it's practicing unless you are trying something new.

Training is being shown how to do something that you don't know how to do or a new way to do something you already know how to do.

Practicing is doing what you've been shown, the way you've been shown. It's like when a little kid is learning to write. At school (or when sitting down with his parents), he is shown how to write the letters of the alphabet. That's training. When he sits down and writes every letter of the alphabet 10 times, that's practicing.

I may be seeing a distinction without a difference, but I don't agree with your definitions of training vs. practicing. I've trained under several different instructors for both professional and voluntary, personal reasons. After the first tactical training session, I already knew how to perform the required skill sets being taught in subsequent sessions, but the first (voluntary) one was for home defense pistol, while the second and third were for tactical rifle and shotgun respectively. All covered various overlapping skills necessary for completion which both my wife and I already knew from the pistol course we took together, but we were still training nonetheless.

Also, after taking all three of those training courses, I got a job in armed security. I could have taught the class and the range session much better than the dimwit who "trained" a group of us, but still, again, I was "training" nonetheless.

Some years later, long after leaving that job, I got a job as an armored truck driver. While there were a few new twists to the training, like how to position the truck for the most secure egress and ingress for the messenger in the back, or how to manipulate the gun ports, the rest of it was somewhere between the high-level instruction I received on my own dime, and the almost useless crap I got from the security session, but again, it was training nonetheless. We also had to "refresh our training" (exactly how it was stated in the Employee's Manual) at least every six months. It wasn't just re-qualifying on the range, it was a complete repeat of the initial training. I worked there for five years, so all told, I had at least eight of those training sessions, but I think it was nine as I left a couple or three months before that last six-month cycle was up. Whatever, every one was a training session, even though I knew all but the job-specific things for years before I started there.

I don't think the difference really matters, and if you want to call it practice instead of training when you already know most of the material being covered, have at it. Won't bug me at all. But when I do much of anything more than standing static at the firing line punching holes in cardboard or paper, I'm training, practicing, and honing my skills all at the same time.

Blues
 

telpinaro

New member
I guess, then the best you can get is ~38 cents a round:
Link Removed

The .357 is really steep - looks like at least 75 cents a round for new ammo!

Yes, it's pretty ouch! ammoseek.com helps... got some .357 for 45 cents/round that way.

And if we're differentiating between training and practicing... both are important. Quality training to learn the skills, practicing to keep sharp. I learned a fun/useful trick at my last class... Put tape over your sights. If you still hit the target in the right spot, your stance is good. Handy in low-light situations, too! For the record... I was just as accurate with no sights. So now I practice, and can effectively test myself and make sure I'm still doing everything correctly.
 

cougar98332

New member
There are those out there who dont train at all. I'm not one of those. If cost is an issue (for me it is), then i will (and do) find a way in which cost is out of the equation. The internet can be a source of info, like the state legislature website, because you gotta stay up to date on your laws. Books and videos can be found at local library. The "Armed Response" dvd series is a good one, dry fire practice is a good one, if you do any reloading and have the components from before the shortage then that is good for live fire practice. Many people have smartphones, that right there is access to info.

Onto the excuses, its been said, and the identity of the author escapes me at the moment, that a person usually has two reasons for something, a "good" one, and the real one. and for the real one it comes down to, i believe, laziness, and/or not really caring. they simply dont think that its important.

sent from my mobile using the USA CARRY 2.0 app
 

apvbguy

New member
i don't have a "routine", i have common sense. You know, common sense? I don't suffer from 'imagination inflation" pertaining to sd situations, i'm always aware of my surroundings. Please don't "ass-u-me" that you are qualified to offer me any advise or that i lack any of what you again "ass-u-me" are necessary skills. If you lack skill and need training then speak for yourself and by all means get it.

pms?
 

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