What You Need to Know about Defensive Shooting

opsspec1991

opsspec1991

Active member
What You Need to Know about Defensive Shooting
By Home Defense Gun
Defensive shooting is a lot different from shooting on the flat range on a nice sunny day. You might have moving targets. It might be at night. Defensive shooting Your adrenaline will be pumping, so on and so on.
Now that being said, that doesn’t mean that you can’t get someone started quickly to at least understand what they need to do and to protect themselves in case they need to.
I came up with this subject and thought it would simple to find a YouTube video to explain it. Well, I was wrong. There a lot on defensive shooting but I don’t like their approach. Too many want to train flat range techniques to get someone shooting paper targets.
So I finally found the video below. I like the approach in that it talks about these important topics:
How to control the gun
How to align the gun to get hits
Dealing with malfunctions
How to reload
This is going to get your spouse, loved one or anyone else at least able to get a gun from a location in a safe room and use it if need be. Don’t wait until they are blistering IPSC or IDPA standards. They need to use the weapon before then.
Of course, training should always continue both with dry fire and range work, hopefully moving work if the range will let you do it.
Remember – when the time comes you will have the rest of your life to get it right or not.
Check out the video
Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCoteFr9fHk
What You Need to Know about Defensive Shooting - Home Defense Gun
 
The biggest difference I find in defensive shooting versa target shooting other than the fact that there is no threat, no adreliline and targets usually done move or shoot back..is that when target shooting you use the sights ( look down the sights to acquire a stationary target ) in defensive shooting ( I use ) muscle training and don't look at the sights.. when someone is moving , you need to keep your eye on them , or multiple threats, you have to constantly adjust for conditions ahead of you.. you look at the sighs and not the field of fire or the threat or multiple threats and you could get blind sided easily... also many defensive coaches and You tube videos show emptying a clip at a threat, then reloading.. both of those things are filled with peril.. Most personal attacks occur in les than 30 seconds. chances are slim you will have time to reload.. if you have to take the time to reload ,even if you are lucky enough to do it without a problem , when a threat is 15 feet away, you will be dead. You never unload your gun at the outset of a defensive encou8nter.. you use controlled fire.. usi9ng your muscle memory.. never taking your eyes off the threat.. shoot three rounds and re-access the threat, the position of the threat and any change in angle, while most threats will come right at you some threats may try some evasion if they know you are armed. if you unload your weapon and miss, in the next three or four seconds you will be dead. If a threat at 25 feet is able to advance to ten feet and your weapon is empty you are dead.. I want to make sure that if he gets to ten feet , That I will have three rounds left, to defend myself in the event that I miss two other exchanges.. not only that.. if you happen to hit your target and the threat still is advancing you need to have something left to defend yourself.. that why I carry 45 ACP. If you read in the paper , lately there have been a few rappers take three or four 9mm and survive.. placement is all important but in the few seconds that you are trying to kill someone for the first time.. shot placement is not guaranteed, no matter how much you practice shooting at stationary targets that don't want to kill you. and don't shoot back.
 
Shot placement matters with 45 ACP also, many stories people taking a lot of 45 rounds also. Handguns in general suck at putting people down.
 
It is not what you do with your hands that allow you to win a gun fight, or your eyes, ears, it is your feet that will ultimately win or loose a gun fight. Walking away from a confrontation cannot be beat, unless you can run away. That is the best.
 
opsspec1991 said:
...Defensive shooting is a lot different from shooting on the flat range on a nice sunny day. You might have moving targets. It might be at night. Defensive shooting Your adrenaline will be pumping, so on and so on...
Click to expand...
I've told my wife this on countless occasions, and of the need to train under these conditions. But sometimes when I think about my wife under stress, with the adrenalin pumping, action happening unexpectedly from conceivably any direction, a loaded gun in her hands, I'm not really sure I want to be there. :lol:
 
I'm guessing you never spent any time in South east Asia going from Hooch to hooch in a hostile village... my 45 served me well for 22 months in South East Asia. both Vietnam and Cambodia... Ill take my 45 to a close in gun fight any day, why throw a pebble when you can throw a rock.? Shot placement is a nice thing when no one is shooting back... until you get into a life event, then you can not talk shot placement .. when someone is trying to kill you, you don't stop breath, let it 1/2 out, take up the slack and squeeze.... LOL that's what all the Monday morning quarterbacks say.. shot placement in combat is called luck.....that's why is took 1100 rounds to kill one NVA. IN East LA I posted that 10 gang members from two gangs engaged in a shooting. 275 rounds were fired, and out of the ten gang members engaged, only two were hit, and no one died... ( 275 round fired) this is reality. those 2 cops in Ohio who took out that guy with the AK-47.. shot 56 9 mm rounds to put down a guy that was out in the open with no cover and only 20 feet away.. one cop was a seasoned veteran, a professional and a sergeant, who practiced shot placement weekly, but never fired his weapon to defend himself, and the rookie, a female was the one that took the kill shot ( Luck shot ) between the two cops they fired 56 shots, the bad guy was hit 6 times with a 9mm, of the six shots , only one was lethal.. and these cops were only 20 feet away... and the guy wanted to commit suicide by cop., He wanted the cops to kill him and it took 56 shots to put him down.... shot placement indeed... its joke.. its a nice thought but until you are under fire... Good shot placement is not something that actually happens without luck..
 
I don't know? I've had some experience at these things, too; and, as far as I'm concerned, when it comes to CQB pistol gunfighting: A warrior's mindset, pistol caliber, manageable recoil, and shot placement are everything.

After a half century of doing this my very first choice for a combat pistol is a semiautomatic 45 ACP. It hits hard, points well, and has highly manageable recoil characteristics. My second choice for a combat pistol is a standard capacity 9 x 19mm semiautomatic pistol. I have no (gun forum) illusions, though. When you're wielding a 9 x 19 shot placement is considerably more important than when you're using a 45 ACP. (If I've got a target that's still standing after the first three shots then I will begin focusing on the target's head.)

It would be nice; it's certainly politically correct; but it's, also, not always possible to walk or run away from a dire threat. Neither is it 100% correct to repeat the popular gun forum mantra about: tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, time compression, adrenaline dumping, and so on, and so forth. These are all FEAR RESPONSES. (Haven't any of you people ever gotten really mad before?)

ANGER RESPONSES are entirely different. Here a combatant's concentration and focus can be so intense that you can, almost, knock a target over with your mind!

Personally, I have no good use for popularly perceived combat handgun calibers, or chamberings, like: 40 S&W, 357 SIG, or 10mm. Why? Because I spent more than 10 years of my life (and I don't know how many thousands of dollars and expended rounds) learning how to shoot a pistol quickly and well. The very sharp recoil characteristics and peak ignition pressures of the aforementioned cartridges requires me to have to slow down in order to group my shots well; and in CQB pistol combat that's never been something that I've been willing to do.

(If you're having trouble grasping this concept study the pistol gunfighting technique of a world class CQB gunfighter like Jim Cirillo: Gun in hand. Center target focus, and one fast rush while firing as many as 18 closely grouped rounds!)

Whenever you're well practiced, used to, and good with a pistol all you've got to do is exactly what you've spent your time training for. Draw, capture either the back of the slide, OR the front sight, and let your proprioceptive reflexes take over. Don't think about it. Just do it, instead! For, perhaps, the first time in your life look past all the internet gun forum folderol, and realize that emotions like: anger, rage, hate, and contempt can also be very useful emotions.

Food for thought? Read about the life of Jim Bowie and, in particular, about several of the knife fights Bowie fought. He was one viciously angry really mean bastard! (They don't make too many like Bowie, anymore; do they.) Then ask yourself the question: Whoever heard of a Japanese Samurai or Ninja with, 'tunnel vision' or, 'auditory exclusion' and trembling hands? There were no computer gun forums in medieval Japan - Not even in WWII Japan - and no Japanese warrior so much as even imagined that anybody would fight like that! Victims exhibit physiological fear responses like what's always being written about on internet gun forums. Aggressors (i.e. 'survivors') do not.
 
Naturally , not getting into a gun fight if you can avoid it...is the best move... but run away from a gun fight?? not unless your can run @ 1000 ft per second.
 
The only reason that I ever bring up shot placement to someone, who has never had to defend themself is that shot placement is not something you can rely on under stress.. I'm not for one second condoning not practicing. For me.. IM 70 years old, I've been carrying as a civilian for 30 years. and prior to that, I was in the military... I go to my gun range every week.. I shoot 50 rounds of 45 ACP + P...at 21 feet. ( the avatar is a target for 21 feet ) just to keep my edge, IM left handed. but I shoot at least 10/15 rounds in burst of three , right handed... prior to being 65 I would fire my carry weapon once a month with 50 round.. AS you get older , you need to retain the muscle memory on a weekly basis.. If IM practicing defense I dont use the sights... if Im target shooting I use the sights.
I've seen a lot of people here say they are good shots...that's all well and good but how good are you when someone is shooting back? its far from the same.. so don't put a lot of faith in shot placement.. focus more on surviving.. most civilian encounters only last 20/30 seconds or less.. you wont have time to reload... so don't put all your eggs in one basket.. don't unload your weapon, like what is taught at many defensive training centers.. the reason they do that is because, many customers get off unloading their weapon.. its an adrenalin rush.. customers tell others that their defensive training was fun..( defensive training should not be fun , it should be serious business ) target shooting is fun... ! . if you want to practice survival.. shot three round bursts. if you unload your gun and miss. you will be dead in 30 seconds.. if you shoot three and re-access, then shoot three more, and at 30 seconds you still have three to defend an attack that will be under 6 to 8 ft.. Keep in mind thata bag guy wont be yelling at you from 20 feet away that he wants your wallet. He is going to get up on you with a gun or a knife.. its your job to be vigilant enough to see a potential threat approaching you.. how you do this is with a sixth sense... you move in such a way that your gut feeling of a problem becomes reality if the threat changes direction when you do.. hopefully you are smart enough to change directions when the threat is 30 or 40 feet away... So by the time he's 20 foot away and the potential danger become eminent.. you can draw your weapon... so forget shot placement.. learn how to recognize a threat and what to do to confirm it. Realize the threat as being life threatening, and react. I've had two separate civilian encounter where I had to draw my weapon.. I had the green light to shoot in both cases but was able to Bark loudly enough to order the bad guys to retreat with their lives. in both cases.. first case was a single black man about 25 to 30.. the second encounter was three 18 to 25 black thugs one with a pipe or a baseball bat, verbally threatening my life.. No one died. And because I was armed, I was able to walk away without grief... no law suits, no cops, no blood spilled..

Most people go through life carrying but never have to draw their weapon.. but its always nice to know its there... I don't cower down when some young punks want to stair me down. This stair down is an effective way for bad guys to identify potential victims.. Hopefully my body language is that of an old guy who just might be carrying... how you carry yourself, can keep you out of trouble..
Just some food for thought.. Its how I do it.. IM not trying to ram what I do down anyone's throat. I've had that stair down, a dozen times in my life...I've had some punks say to me what are you looking at white boy?/ and my retort back at them in as much arrogance as I can muster is .. " Not much at all " ! No IM no tough guy anymore...but IM going to walk proud everyday ...
 
2 Professional cops ( one seasoned veteran, who have to qualify their shot placement ( of course no one is shooting back ) shoot 56 rounds total to take down a guy from 20 foot away and was under no cover or concealment, ( body fully exposed ( Video is on line )... 50 shots completely miss.. 6 shot hit, only one is lethal.. that tells you how reliable shot placement can be when some one is firing back. both cops were qualified professionals. If you talk to anyone who has actually defended their life, they will tell you exactly what IM telling you. If you think you are John Wayne and a good shot... hope you don't have to defend yourself, because with thinking like that you will wind up dead. You would be much better served to practice survival.
 
50 missed did nothing to the bad guy and he still thinks shot placement isn't key...lol

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
 
Firefighterchen said:
Speed is good, accuracy is final. Shot placement > caliber.
Click to expand...
All true, but caliber is still good just like speed is. You wouldn't sacrifice speed because it's important. I think ET's just trying to point out that caliber is subject to the same reasoning. You shouldn't sacrifice it because it's important too. But caliber, just like all other aspects of shooting, can't be considered in a vacuum. It isn't an absolute because you can take it to the point of degrading your ability to shoot. That's why I always tell people that the best caliber is the largest and most potent that they can shoot, carry and conceal both proficiently and comfortably. That gets the most available power without sacrificing other aspects of the overall equation. I shoot 45s almost exclusively, but my wife doesn't shoot that caliber well. So the best caliber for her right now is 9mm. But I'm not telling you anything you don't already know.
 
Rhino said:
All true, but caliber is still good just like speed is. You wouldn't sacrifice speed because it's important. I think ET's just trying to point out that caliber is subject to the same reasoning. You shouldn't sacrifice it because it's important too. But caliber, just like all other aspects of shooting, can't be considered in a vacuum. It isn't an absolute because you can take it to the point of degrading your ability to shoot. That's why I always tell people that the best caliber is the largest and most potent that they can shoot, carry and conceal both proficiently and comfortably. That gets the most available power without sacrificing other aspects of the overall equation. I shoot 45s almost exclusively, but my wife doesn't shoot that caliber well. So the best caliber for her right now is 9mm. But I'm not telling you anything you don't already know.
Click to expand...

My advice to new shooters is close to yours. Carry the biggest caliber you can shoot proficiently (placement then speed). I feel concealing and comfort is a holster issue. For those that buy ammo of the shelf, 9mm is a lot cheaper to get proficient. If one can't be more accurate and faster than his adversary, the bullets will do nothing to help.

I like how Travis Haley instructs in his videos (wish I was close enough and made enough to go personally). Slow rhythmic trigger pulls. Speed up till you start failing in placement. Reassess technique, fix your problems, reach for the next rung in the ladder of excellence. All aspects are important, but placement trumps all.

Amateurs train until they get it right, professionals train until they get it wrong.

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
 
Rhino said:
I like that! Is that what Haley says, or is that a Firefighterchen original?
Click to expand...

I wish I was that awesome...hah

That's actually from Travis Haley and Chris Costa when they did the Magpul Dynamic videos.

What I would give to get that level of training.

Sent from my D6616 using USA Carry mobile app
 
ET said:
The biggest difference I find in defensive shooting versa target shooting other than the fact that there is no threat, no adreliline and targets usually done move or shoot back..is that when target shooting you use the sights ( look down the sights to acquire a stationary target ) in defensive shooting ( I use ) muscle training and don't look at the sights.. when someone is moving , you need to keep your eye on them , or multiple threats, you have to constantly adjust for conditions ahead of you.. you look at the sighs and not the field of fire or the threat or multiple threats and you could get blind sided easily... also many defensive coaches and You tube videos show emptying a clip at a threat, then reloading.. both of those things are filled with peril.. Most personal attacks occur in les than 30 seconds. chances are slim you will have time to reload.. if you have to take the time to reload ,even if you are lucky enough to do it without a problem , when a threat is 15 feet away, you will be dead. You never unload your gun at the outset of a defensive encou8nter.. you use controlled fire.. usi9ng your muscle memory.. never taking your eyes off the threat.. shoot three rounds and re-access the threat, the position of the threat and any change in angle, while most threats will come right at you some threats may try some evasion if they know you are armed. if you unload your weapon and miss, in the next three or four seconds you will be dead. If a threat at 25 feet is able to advance to ten feet and your weapon is empty you are dead.. I want to make sure that if he gets to ten feet , That I will have three rounds left, to defend myself in the event that I miss two other exchanges.. not only that.. if you happen to hit your target and the threat still is advancing you need to have something left to defend yourself.. that why I carry 45 ACP. If you read in the paper , lately there have been a few rappers take three or four 9mm and survive.. placement is all important but in the few seconds that you are trying to kill someone for the first time.. shot placement is not guaranteed, no matter how much you practice shooting at stationary targets that don't want to kill you. and don't shoot back.
Click to expand...

That's all I needed to read to know this poster is full of it. Internet war hero
 
I'm going to keep this as simple as I can
When someone is shooting at you, you are going to default to your muscle memory. You are going to respond almost exactly how you trained and how you practiced . I recommend stress drills I also recommend force on force training.

If you have to stop and think in your average civilian encounter it's over.
 
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