What do the laws say?

[kwo51]

I will remeber that when you child is being beat down in front of me. Im calling 911 see ya. They will be here in a minute.:crazy_pilot:

 

[gdcleanfun]

Y'know, women aren't always weak. Some of us have our own CCWs. But it's nice to know there are people looking out for other people, both men and women.

 

[tattedupboy]

Y'know, women aren't always weak. Some of us have our own CCWs. But it's nice to know there are people looking out for other people, both men and women.

That's exactly teh point we've been trying to make. If I saw a woman being raped or assaulted by a man (like I did at work a few months ago where I am a security guard), I'm going to intervene first, then call 911.

 

[wuzfuz]

I intend to apply for my Washington CCW permit as soon as my regular driver's license arrives, and i have quite a few insights on this I would like to share. I was an LEO in Arizona, and after I left the department, I had a CCW permit. I read on the website the requirements for a Washington permit, and I must say I am a bit concerned. It say you must pay the fee and submit two sets of fingerprints for a background check....period. Arizona required the successful completion of a 32 hour course, which covers the laws in Arizona on when you may use deadly force, maintenance of your weapon and a written test as well as a qualification shoot on a range. Washington says pay the fee and pass a background check, nothing at all about any training or demonstrating you know which end of the gun the bullets go in. Arizona law, under justification for use of deadly force, lists felonies where any citizen may use any amount of force up to and including lethal physical force to prevent the coomission of. This list includes Armed Robbery, Sexual Assault and Arson of an Occupied Structure. When they first introduced the bill for the permits, sheriffs and cheifs of police badmouthed the idea, claiming people would be driving around looking for a bad guy to blow away. This did not happen, and the crime numbers dropped, as the BGs did not know who might be armed.

In Killeen, TX, there was a restaurant called Luby's, and one day a nutjob walked in and began shooting people willy-nilly. Later, when Texas was considering the CCW permit law, a young woman was interviewd on a television program. She was in Luby's that day, and since there was no CCW permit in Texas then, she was a good little doobie and her gun was locked in her car. She saw her mother and father murdered by this headcase with a gun. She said she vowed then, permit or not, she would never be disarmed again. I am one gun owner who is confident in my knowledge of not only the law, but tactics, that I can agree with her stance. BTW. No cop is ever going to pretend to hold up a business with customers around the place. If one did, he would be suspeneded immediately and ordered to mandatory counseling.

 

[LVLouisCyphre]

I intend to apply for my Washington CCW permit as soon as my regular driver's license arrives, and i have quite a few insights on this I would like to share. I was an LEO in Arizona, and after I left the department, I had a CCW permit. I read on the website the requirements for a Washington permit, and I must say I am a bit concerned. It say you must pay the fee and submit two sets of fingerprints for a background check....period. Arizona required the successful completion of a 32 hour course, which covers the laws in Arizona on when you may use deadly force, maintenance of your weapon and a written test as well as a qualification shoot on a range. Washington says pay the fee and pass a background check, nothing at all about any training or demonstrating you know which end of the gun the bullets go in. Arizona law, under justification for use of deadly force, lists felonies where any citizen may use any amount of force up to and including lethal physical force to prevent the coomission of. This list includes Armed Robbery, Sexual Assault and Arson of an Occupied Structure. When they first introduced the bill for the permits, sheriffs and cheifs of police badmouthed the idea, claiming people would be driving around looking for a bad guy to blow away. This did not happen, and the crime numbers dropped, as the BGs did not know who might be armed.

AL and NH do not have a fingerprinting or training requirement. WA State is big on the mental health check as there are more per capita mental health professionals in the greater SeaTac area than any other State. Some States are big on training; Nevada is. It's all about what the given State decides is acceptable for issuance of their respective CCW. All States that go shall issue go through the "blood in the streets" period.

In Killeen, TX, there was a restaurant called Luby's, and one day a nutjob walked in and began shooting people willy-nilly. Later, when Texas was considering the CCW permit law, a young woman was interviewd on a television program. She was in Luby's that day, and since there was no CCW permit in Texas then, she was a good little doobie and her gun was locked in her car. She saw her mother and father murdered by this headcase with a gun. She said she vowed then, permit or not, she would never be disarmed again. I am one gun owner who is confident in my knowledge of not only the law, but tactics, that I can agree with her stance.

That woman, Susanna Hupp, became a TX State legislator who could be called the mother of the TX CHL law.

BTW. No cop is ever going to pretend to hold up a business with customers around the place. If one did, he would be suspeneded immediately and ordered to mandatory counseling.

We don't know what a LEO may be required to do during an undercover assignment.

 

[t-diddy]

in SC apparently we have an "alter-ego" rule. the way i understand it is if you can justify using deadly force if you were in the situation the "victim" is in you can use deadly force on the BG. rule of thumb though is to announce your prescence as a cwp holder and that you're armed. maybe chances are that the "BG" will turn on you and you won't have any big legal issues to deal with if you kill him. maybe the "BG" is a plainclothes cop. hypothetical situation... you walk up on mr. t stabbing p.w. herman and beating the ever lovin fire out of him. you don't announce your prescence and open fire, killing mr.t, only to later (while you're in jail) find out that p.w. first shot mr. t in the belly with a .32 while trying to rob him.
the shooting in the WM situation seems right without announcing your prescence. no cop or anybody else that's defending themselves is going to stab this woman "over nine times".

 

[Scarecrow]

of course avoid a bad situation if you can.. no need to be a hero, unless need be. I don't think I could stand and watch people getting killed in front of me knowing that I have a way to stop it. at the same point, I don't think I would jump in the line of fire if there was a good chance at getting killed. I also have loved one's here on this earth and I would not want to leave them just yet. now if I could give my life to save a loved one.. I would do it. too many things to think about in these cases.. too many what if's. not to mention every situation would be different. would there be cover? would there be any innocent people in the line of fire if I could take out a bad guy. I think you never can say exactly what you would do in a given situation until you are actually in it. too many variables. if I could help. I would try to take out a bad guy the safest way possible.

 

[Michael K]

I just moved to Arizona from Florida this month and was wondering if Az. has a castle doctrine type law? Florida's stand your ground law had always made sense to me.

 

[S&WM&P40]

That is true you never know what you will do till it comes to it.Well thats a Lie right there. You have a idea( will pull the trigger in a heart beat)( i would have to think about it) and so on. But you never really know if when it comes to it if you will pull the trigger or have to think about it. Here is a Video of a Police officer (22 years old only been on the job about a year) Who took to much time to think about it and only shot back after he come under fire with the (mini 30). At that time it was to late and he was gunned down. When the guy turn with the rifle in hand the officer should have shot. Watch the video and then tell me if what you think you would do is still that. it all changes when you have bullets coming at you or you are looking down the barrel of gun. If there was a mass shooting and the person or person's had body armor and High power rifles. Me only having my hand gun i would do every thing i could to help people get out and render aid to the people i could. I would only engage if they came to me and the wounded. But any way watch the video.


YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

 

[LVLouisCyphre]

I just moved to Arizona from Florida this month and was wondering if Az. has a castle doctrine type law? Florida's stand your ground law had always made sense to me.

Yes, here's the Link Removed, it was signed into law 2006. One of the few things Empress Janet has done right.

It is not immunity to civil suits though, the way AZ does it if I read the statute correctly is that you get an automatic award of all court and legal costs if you win the civil suit. This statutory Corbomite device should deter most ambulance and hearse chasers as it includes an award for all monetary damages arising from defending a civil suit including the defendant's lost income. It's not as good as blanket civil suit immunity but it can be quite effective to keep you out of civil court because an attorney will think three or four times before taking such a case on contingency.

The AZ castle doctrine also extends to your vehicle while occupied if I read it correctly.

Not as much teeth as FL or MO, but far better than nothing.

 

[Slade797]

Dunno about the laws, but in my view: You have a duty to protect your fellow citizens. This is not something that can be laid down in a single legislative act to cover all situations. Each individual must use their own judgement, "laws" notwithstanding. In order to be a full, participating member of society, you must act withing the unspoken compact with your fellow citizens, and uphold your duty to protect them as they must act to protect you. Whether or not this is the politic stance, I don't know nor do I care. I see an old lady being attacked, I'm going to act in her defense. Same for anyone who needs my help.

Simple.

 

[MP3Mogul]

Just remember, if a LEO happens to show up, he's not gonna know you are the good guy, and you will more than likely be shot, and possibly killed.

Yes, in Virginia here we can intervene as well. I won't unless I or my family are threatened.

 

[HK4U]

If a LEO happens to show up, it will probably be well after the attack. I am not going to stand by and watch a gang of rapists viciously attack a young girl. I am not going to stand by while a gang of punks murders an old man or woman. I will not stand and do nothing, if I have the power to stop a mass gunman slaughtering a bunch of children. Yes I guess you can say "I am my brothers keeper".

 

[tattedupboy]

If a LEO happens to show up, it will probably be well after the attack. I am not going to stand by and watch a gang of rapists viciously attack a young girl. I am not going to stand by while a gang of punks murders an old man or woman. I will not stand and do nothing, if I have the power to stop a mass gunman slaughtering a bunch of children. Yes I guess you can say "I am my brothers keeper".

+1 to that. To those who say they'd intervene only if it were a loved one, are you saying if it were a total stranger being attacked, raped, or in any way accosted, are you saying that other than calling 911, you'd do nothing? What if this were you?

 

[wuzfuz]

Michael, in Arizona, there is no requirement to retreat. If you fear for your life, you may defend yourself and not have to take as much as one step backwards. Where in Arizona will you be locating? If you are near Casa Grande, (halfway between Phoenix and tucson,) I can recommend a top-notch instructor who teaches CCW classes. He was my instructor in the poilce academy and my CCW instructor.
BTW, I am speaking as a former LEO when I say that no cop would ever pretend to be holding up a business, I don't care what his undercover assignment may be. There are some things permitted, such as not having more than a .05% BAC while on an assignment, and the pretending to be using drugs, of course. But pretending to be pulling a 211 would never be okayed, for any reason. I do know this, whether anyone else does or not. (211 is an armed robbery)