Unpaid Speeding Ticket and Carry Permit

[se7en]

Hello everyone. I'm new to the forum but have been a long time lurker. Recently, I decided to go about getting my carry permit here in Tennessee. I have done everything that is required, including finger printing...which is the last step before it goes to the TBI.

One problem, though. When I was going over anything that could possibly stop me from obtaining the permit, my wife reminded me of an 11 year old unpaid speeding ticket from Marion County Indiana (Indianapolis). Long story on why I decided NOT to pay the ticket, but let's just say that it was total BS...and my wife still agrees with me to this day. Other than that, I'm squeaky clean.

Will this stop me from getting the permit? If so, I guess I could try and handle it quickly. I heard from the handgun safety instructor that there is a 28% increase in permits this year and they are running true to the allotted 90 day window for issuance.

I would really appreciate your thoughts...or better yet, facts if you have them.

 

[TheMan]

It may or may not come up during your investigation. I wouldn't worry about it as precluding you from a carry permit in a different state, but it's hard to say.

 

[OldOwl]

Check the two states for reciprocity. If they honor each others permits it is likely to come up. If not, it's unlikely. States aren't usually willing to go out of their way for states which don't reciprocate and do stuff for them.

Also, some states the law says a misdemeanor disqualifies you for a gun permit, while some like here, assachusetts, you're only supposed to be denied if you have a felony or drug conviction. But since its upt to the police chief of the city you reside in, they can deny you by saying you have "disregard for the law" for any stupid little thing.

See if the two states reciprocate.

 

[jmcrooks]

I don't know about Tennesse but I don't think Florida's back ground check goes very deep, I had to send in proof of U.S. citizenship because being born in Panama while my dad was in the Army. The thing that got me was I had been in the Navy held a confidenctial clearance and now I work for the DoD and have a Secret clearance. None of which a foreign national can hold. Go figure.

 

[Willard Of Oz]

Pay the ticket.

They don't want to hear any excuses, you wouldn't win anyway.

You make a stand and may not get the permit.

It is possible that you have a bench warrant for your arrest in IN, you would not neccesarily know.

Sometimes you just have to suck it up to get what you want.

Pay the ticket.

 

[2beararms]

Reading the Tennessee requirements, unless the ticket was for DUI I do not see where you have a problem. Tennessee does not require you to have a "clean" record it requires you to have no felony convictions, no convictions punishable by more than 1 year, no DUI and no Domestic Violence convictions. The important thing also is the word conviction, not arrests.

Tennessee is a SHALL ISSUE state, not a may issue. It is a central issue state with the Dept of Safety doing the issue, so it is not up some individual county sheriff or police cheif or anyone else, the law is simple, if you don't have the convictions, you DO get the permit. There is no "we'll think about it". So as to your permit, you should have no problem with this at all... unless there is a warrant for you for a felony.

That said, deciding not to pay a speeding ticket because it is BS is simply stupid. Deciding not to adhere to a legal order anytime is simply stupid. Either pay the ticket or take it to court. It is not possible to fight the system by deciding you don't have to follow it. You can do what you want, but get it handled for it will come back to haunt you sooner or later and for my bet, paying it is the easy way out.

 

[ronwill]

The best way to fight the ticket would have been going to traffic court. Of course that may not always be possible. According to the Tennessee state page here on USA Carry, tickets are not listed as a reason for denial. Here's the list:

Requirements:
1. Successfully complete a handgun safety course offered by a handgun safety school that is certified by the Department of Safety
2. Resident of the State Of Tennessee
3. 21 years of age
4. Applicants shall not currently be under indictment or information for any criminal offense punishable by a term exceeding one (1) year;
5. Shall not be currently the subject of any order of protection;
6. Shall not be a fugitive from justice;
7. Shall not be an unlawful user of or addicted to alcohol or any controlled substance and the applicant has not been a patient in a rehabilitation program or hospitalized for alcohol or controlled substance abuse or addiction within ten (10) years from the date of application;
8. The applicant has not been convicted of the offense of driving under the influence of an intoxicant in this or any other State two (2) or more times within ten (10) years from the date of application and that none of such convictions has occurred within five (5) years from the date of application or renewal.
9. Shall not have been adjudicated as mental defective; has not been committed to or hospitalized in a mental institution; has not had a court appoint a conservator for the applicant by reason of a mental defect; has not been judicially determined to be disabled by reason of a mental illness, development disability or other mental incapacity; and has not, within seven (7) years from the date of application, been found by a court to pose an immediate substantial likelihood of serious harm, as defined in Title 33, Chapter 6, Part 5, because of mental illness;
10. Shall not be an alien illegally or unlawfully in the United States;
11. Shall not have been discharged from the Armed Forces under dishonorable conditions (dishonorable discharge, bad conduct discharge or other than honorable discharge Chapter 1340-2-5-.02 (5);
12. Having been a citizen of the United States, applicants shall not have renounced their citizenship;
13. Shall not have been convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence as defined in 18 U.S.C.A. 921 (33);
14. Shall not be receiving social security disability benefits by reason of alcohol dependence, drug dependence or mental disability;
15. Shall not have been convicted of the offense of stalking.

 

[se7en]

That said, deciding not to pay a speeding ticket because it is BS is simply stupid. Deciding not to adhere to a legal order anytime is simply stupid. Either pay the ticket or take it to court. It is not possible to fight the system by deciding you don't have to follow it.

Maybe it was stupid, but sometimes its the point of the matter. IN THIS CASE, I would rather disregard the law because his interpretation of the law was not valid. The side of the road was not the time or place to argue the law...not that I would have won anyway. LEOs are ALWAYS right...even when they're wrong. Being that I was from out of state and would not be venturing into that state again anytime soon, I thought I would "boycott" his decision to issue by simply not paying. Going to court in another state would require me missing a day of work, spending gas for the trip, probably a room for the night...yada, yada, yada. Obviously spending way more on that than the tickets cost.

You can do what you want, but get it handled for it will come back to haunt you sooner or later and for my bet, paying it is the easy way out.

I may still yet because this is more important than that incident 11 years ago. It still stings, though. I haven't even thought about it for years until yesterday...and I got pissed all over again. :angry:

 

[se7en]

That said, deciding not to pay a speeding ticket because it is BS is simply stupid. Deciding not to adhere to a legal order anytime is simply stupid. Either pay the ticket or take it to court. It is not possible to fight the system by deciding you don't have to follow it.

Maybe it was stupid...but sometimes its the point of the matter. I chose not to pay as a way to "boycott" his decision to issue a ticket. Sure, I could have decided to contest it in court. That would require a day from work, gas, probably an overnight stay...yada, yada, yada. Obviously, I would have spent way more than the ticket's value and it would have been all for not. IMO, LEOs are right...even when they're wrong and most judges will back them up a thousand times before seeing our point. Especially when you're from out of state.

You can do what you want, but get it handled for it will come back to haunt you sooner or later and for my bet, paying it is the easy way out.

I may still yet as this is more important to me than an 11 year old beef. It still stings, though. I haven't thought of the incident for years until yesterday...and I got pissed off all over again. :angry:

 

[2beararms]

...even when they're wrong and most judges will back them up a thousand times before seeing our point. Especially when you're from out of state.

I could not agree more with your sentiment, but I also realize that no matter, I have to live within the system. I have paid many an undeserved ticket or other penalty over the years because it was less aggrevation than fighting it and NEVER worth damaging my credibility by ignoring it.

I had a friend who got a $25 bill from a Doctor she claimed she never heard of so she decided not to pay it on principle. They turned it over to collections, she simply ignored it ... I don't owe it, I won't pay it was here attitude. The other year she decided she wanted to buy a half million dollar house, which was a great deal and she could afford the payments. The judgement on her credit record over that damn $25 bill however prevented her from being able to get a mortgage in reasonable time and the deal fell through.

Was it worth it to her? Today she says she wishes she had paid the bill and not screwed up her credit over a lousy $25 bucks.

If idealism was all that mattered, why would you apply for a permit in the first place. According to nearly all here, carry of a firearm IS a right afforded us by the constitution, yet we all do the process to get the permit.

I, perhaps unfortuantely, see the system for what it is ... flawed but the only one we've got so I figure I have to work within it, period.

 

[FN1910]

I doubt that TN would even check with other states on traffic tickets so I would be willing to bet the actual ticket would be no problem. However if you have a fugitive warrant against you for the ticket it may show up and that is much more than just the traffic ticket.

One more word of advice is don't get pulled over in Indiana. Were you a TN resident at the time or an IN resident? If it hasn't shown up on a NICS check it ptobably won't on a TN background check. Let's see a $25 ticket from 11 years ago with penalties, interest, court costs, warrant fees you sould be able to settle for about $4,000 now. :laugh:

 

[se7en]

Were you a TN resident at the time or an IN resident?

I was and still am a TN resident.

If it hasn't shown up on a NICS check it ptobably won't on a TN background check.

This is my thought exactly. I've recently purchased a firearm and passed the NICS as late a November 2008. If I passed that, then the TBI likely won't do MORE investigation, right?

Let's see a $25 ticket from 11 years ago with penalties, interest, court costs, warrant fees you sould be able to settle for about $4,000 now. :laugh:

OMG! Are you serious? I was thinking that if I really had to pay it, I'd be out maybe $200 - $300...but $4K is a lot. If what you say is true, I'll not be settling up on that until absolutely necessary...and a permit does not a necessity make. And, BTW, the original ticket was for 5 MPH over and cost $110! Got me for 60 in a 55.

 

[FN1910]

I was and still am a TN resident.


This is my thought exactly. I've recently purchased a firearm and passed the NICS as late a November 2008. If I passed that, then the TBI likely won't do MORE investigation, right?


OMG! Are you serious? I was thinking that if I really had to pay it, I'd be out maybe $200 - $300...but $4K is a lot. If what you say is true, I'll not be settling up on that until absolutely necessary...and a permit does not a necessity make. And, BTW, the original ticket was for 5 MPH over and cost $110! Got me for 60 in a 55.

LOL - I am kidding about the $4K. I have no idea but $110 for 5 over is BS. In SC they usually give you 5 on most roads and 10 on the Interstate. I have know people being pulled for 6 over but never 5. Years ago states did not share information at all but the insurance companies put pressure on them to do it. I have know people that were banned from driving in NC but SC didn't care one bit. As long as they didn't get caught driving in NC they were fine but if they did then off to jail they went. :cray:

 

[se7en]

I have no idea but $110 for 5 over is BS.

See. My point exactly. Not to mention how they trapped me into it. Wait, stop! I'm getting all pissed again.

(deep breath)

At any rate, I think I'll take my chances and see what happens.

 

[defender829]

se7en, don't do it! You still have your driver's license, don't you? I had an old ticket once, went into a police station, and told some jerk. He pretended to find something on the computer. I was booked, insulted, and fingerprinted while being insulted, even though I was perfectly courteous the whole time. I had to stay behind a locked door until somebody came to pay bail. Later, went to court, plead guilty, and was fined $5 plus "cost of court".
I was young and foolish at the time. I believe they had lost the record, and I went thru a bunch of crap and expense just to add a blemish to my driving record.
Isn't there a statute of limitations for such a minor 'offense'?

 

[se7en]

Isn't there a statute of limitations for such a minor 'offense'?

I read somewhere online (not a good source of fact) that it was either 5 or 10 years. I also read where there isn't a SOL. If it happens to be one of the 5-10 year variety, I'm good. It was 11 years ago. Still, though, I did pass the NICS check, so that in itself should indicate something, right? Meaning, there are no outstanding warrants on me...

 

[LVLouisCyphre]

If the ticket went to a warrant, it would be a prohibiting condition for a Nevada CFP. You can pass a NICS check with a misdemeanor DUI or controlled substance conviction.

 

[se7en]

If the ticket went to a warrant, it would be a prohibiting condition for a Nevada CFP. You can pass a NICS check with a misdemeanor DUI or controlled substance conviction.

So wait. You can receive a warrant for an unpaid speeding and/or parking ticket and therefore be denied the right to possess a firearm. However, you can get approved for a firearm with a convicted DUI charge or other controlled substance? How f'd up is that?

 

[LVLouisCyphre]

So wait. You can receive a warrant for an unpaid speeding and/or parking ticket and therefore be denied the right to possess a firearm. However, you can get approved for a firearm with a convicted DUI charge or other controlled substance? How f'd up is that?

No, that's to get a Nevada CFP.

If you have a traffic warrant it may affect your ability to pass a NICS check depending on how it shows up. If it shows up as you being a fugitive from justice then yes it will result in being denied under NICS. It will result in a denial of your Nevada CFP until the warrant is cleared. If there's a warrant it should result in you being denied under NICS even if it's a traffic or parking cite as you are technically a fugitive from justice. It also depends on what traffic and parking cites are considered to be. If they are civil infractions and not a crime per se then it will not show up on a NICS check or affect your ability to get a CCW unless the issuing authority looks beyond your criminal background and at your driving record.

If you have a misdemeanor DUI or controlled substance conviction it will not preclude you from passing a NICS check, it will preclude you from getting a Nevada CFP if the conviction is not at least five years old.

 

[se7en]

Okay. Now I understand what you meant.

Using me as the example, I passed the NICS check, therefore I SHOULD, and I use that loosely, receive the carry permit. Or at least that's a positive sign that apparently there is no warrant on me in Indiana, right?