Transfer vs. Registration
- Thread starter utimmer43
- Start date
It probably depends on your state. In TN we do not have to go through a FFl on a private sale, however, the federal background check that the dealer does for an over the counter sale is just a background check to make sure you shouldn't own a gun. TN has no registration process and standard federal background check prior to buying a gun is not registration. The dealer told me that the feds do not keep any of the data sent in. They are not keeping a record of how many guns you have and what they are....Yet. The dealer has to keep the paperwork for a specific period of time though.
mrsandman224455
Member
Welcome to USA Carry btw!
There is not federal gun registration currently. Some states require it.
Make sure I "shouldn't own a gun" or make sure I'm "not prohibited from owning" or "eligible to purchase" a gun. :wink:
gf
"Not prohibited from owning" would be most correct answer I guess.
utimmer43
New member
Thanks again rrc. In that site you linked to it says "record of sale: Yes" Is this the "Transfer" that I asked about earlier? Is that basically to say that you need to pay a FFL to produce a reciept for a private sale between two friends?
BTW, the purpose of my question is that I am buying a handgun from my brother-in-law. I would just as soon give him the $$ and take the gun. But, he is hung up on this transfer thing. I'm just wondering what exactly is the purpose of the transfer?
BTW, the purpose of my question is that I am buying a handgun from my brother-in-law. I would just as soon give him the $$ and take the gun. But, he is hung up on this transfer thing. I'm just wondering what exactly is the purpose of the transfer?
Link Removed
The PA FFL requirement for private party sales applies only to handguns (6111(c) and (f)(2)):
(c) Duty of other persons. Any person who
is not a licensed importer, manufacturer or dealer
and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to
another unlicensed person shall do so only upon
the place of business of a licensed importer,
manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office,
the latter of whom shall follow the procedure set
forth in this section as if he were the seller of the
firearm. The provisions of this section shall not
apply to transfers between spouses or to transfers
between a parent and child or to transfers
between grandparent and grandchild.
(2) The provisions contained in subsections
(a) and (c) shall only apply to pistols or revolvers
with a barrel length of less than 15 inches, any
shotgun with a barrel length of less than 18 inches,
any rifle with a barrel length of less than
16 inches or any firearm with an overall length of
less than 26 inches.
There is no gun registration in PA (6111.4):
6111.4. Registration of firearms. Notwithstanding
any section of this chapter to the contrary,
nothing in this chapter shall be construed
to allow any government or law enforcement
agency or any agent thereof to create, maintain
or operate any registry of firearm ownership
within this Commonwealth. For the purposes of
this section only, the term "firearm" shall include
any weapon that is designed to or may readily
be converted to expel any projectile by the action
of an explosive or the frame or receiver of
any such weapon.
and:
6111(v):
(v) Unless it has been discovered pursuant to
a criminal history, juvenile delinquency and mental
health records background check that the potential
purchaser or transferee is prohibited from
possessing a firearm pursuant to section 6105
(relating to persons not to possess, use, manufacture,
control, sell or transfer firearms), no information
on the application/ record of sale provided
pursuant to this subsection shall be retained
as precluded by section 6111.4 (relating to
registration of firearms) by the Pennsylvania
State Police either through retention of the application/
record of sale or by entering the information
onto a computer, and, further, an application/
record of sale received by the Pennsylvania
State Police pursuant to this subsection shall be
destroyed within 72 hours of the completion of
the criminal history, juvenile delinquency and
mental health records background check.
The PA FFL requirement for private party sales applies only to handguns (6111(c) and (f)(2)):
(c) Duty of other persons. Any person who
is not a licensed importer, manufacturer or dealer
and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to
another unlicensed person shall do so only upon
the place of business of a licensed importer,
manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office,
the latter of whom shall follow the procedure set
forth in this section as if he were the seller of the
firearm. The provisions of this section shall not
apply to transfers between spouses or to transfers
between a parent and child or to transfers
between grandparent and grandchild.
(2) The provisions contained in subsections
(a) and (c) shall only apply to pistols or revolvers
with a barrel length of less than 15 inches, any
shotgun with a barrel length of less than 18 inches,
any rifle with a barrel length of less than
16 inches or any firearm with an overall length of
less than 26 inches.
There is no gun registration in PA (6111.4):
6111.4. Registration of firearms. Notwithstanding
any section of this chapter to the contrary,
nothing in this chapter shall be construed
to allow any government or law enforcement
agency or any agent thereof to create, maintain
or operate any registry of firearm ownership
within this Commonwealth. For the purposes of
this section only, the term "firearm" shall include
any weapon that is designed to or may readily
be converted to expel any projectile by the action
of an explosive or the frame or receiver of
any such weapon.
and:
6111(v):
(v) Unless it has been discovered pursuant to
a criminal history, juvenile delinquency and mental
health records background check that the potential
purchaser or transferee is prohibited from
possessing a firearm pursuant to section 6105
(relating to persons not to possess, use, manufacture,
control, sell or transfer firearms), no information
on the application/ record of sale provided
pursuant to this subsection shall be retained
as precluded by section 6111.4 (relating to
registration of firearms) by the Pennsylvania
State Police either through retention of the application/
record of sale or by entering the information
onto a computer, and, further, an application/
record of sale received by the Pennsylvania
State Police pursuant to this subsection shall be
destroyed within 72 hours of the completion of
the criminal history, juvenile delinquency and
mental health records background check.
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utimmer43
New member
Thanks for those codes NavyLT. Do you know then, what is the purpose of the transfer? Is this just a way to say "even though the law says that no one may sell a gun to someone who they know is a criminal, we're gonna make you run a PICS check anyway, just to make sure."
I know that regardless of it's purpose, I must do it in order to buy this gun. It just cranks me that I gotta pay someone $20-$30 to do it for a gun that I'm paying $50 for.
I know that regardless of it's purpose, I must do it in order to buy this gun. It just cranks me that I gotta pay someone $20-$30 to do it for a gun that I'm paying $50 for.
utimmer43
New member
Link Removed
Well, upon further investigation, I have found this PA Supreme Court ruling. I just read the whole thing :wacko: (talk about eyes glazing over...)
The "transfer" is a record of sale that is kept on file by the PA State Police, permenantly. The SC of PA found that this is technically not a registery because it only shows who "purchased" the handgun, not necessarily who "owns" the handgun. Hogwash, in my opinion.
On a more positive note, I just realized that since the record of sale need not be completed between spouses, child/parent, or grandchild/grandparent, I can form a chain that links me to my brother-in-law. He gives the gun to his wife (my sister-in-law), she gives it to her mom (my mother-in-law), she gives it to her other daughter (my wife), who gives it to me. :biggrin:
Well, upon further investigation, I have found this PA Supreme Court ruling. I just read the whole thing :wacko: (talk about eyes glazing over...)
The "transfer" is a record of sale that is kept on file by the PA State Police, permenantly. The SC of PA found that this is technically not a registery because it only shows who "purchased" the handgun, not necessarily who "owns" the handgun. Hogwash, in my opinion.
On a more positive note, I just realized that since the record of sale need not be completed between spouses, child/parent, or grandchild/grandparent, I can form a chain that links me to my brother-in-law. He gives the gun to his wife (my sister-in-law), she gives it to her mom (my mother-in-law), she gives it to her other daughter (my wife), who gives it to me. :biggrin:
I'd have to call BS on that one also. That stinks like registration so bad I can smell it from Tennessee...and presents a interesting scenario. Did your brother buy the gun legally? Is he the current owner on record with the SP? If he's not then he may be in some trouble selling the gun. The SP knows who is supposed to own it. If that's not the same person trying to sell it, there could be trouble. It would be like me trying to sell my neighbors car.
Be careful trying to beat the system. You DON'T want a weapons related charge on your record.
utimmer43
New member
No, it's a legit gun ownership. He bought it from a dealer and so he is the last person on record to have purchased it.
As far as the reg. vs. transfer... that's a distinction without a difference as far as I'm concerned. A registry is a registry. But, what can I do besides gripe about it to my state rep., right? (I think they are starting to recognize my voice.)
As far as the reg. vs. transfer... that's a distinction without a difference as far as I'm concerned. A registry is a registry. But, what can I do besides gripe about it to my state rep., right? (I think they are starting to recognize my voice.)
