The lie behind the economy


Jim_Macklin

New member
The news today is that the DOW-Jones Index will close above 13,000, first time that high in years.
Yeah, obama, NOT.

The Congress has appropriated many trillions of dollars in the past 4 years, several trillion is not account for "on te books" it is lost.
People think the DOW shows the strength and vitality of the nation and business, it does not. The DOW is an Index score card of the activity in the stock market, like counting the money and chips on a poker table in Reno. In a real world people and businesses buy stock because they look for an ownership position in companies that are profitable and growing.
When a company begins operation, it sells a portion of the ownership, in the form of stocks which are given a starting or PAR value. That IPO [initial public offering] money goes to the company to be used for expansion, raw materials and machinery.
All sales of stock other than an IPO is strictly a trade between gamblers, the price for buyers and sellers is an emotional ranking. If the public thinks a company is profitable, they will buy the stock and hold it for years in some cases, getting a cash dividend or more shares if the company "splits" the stock.
But back to the missing trillion dollars the Congress and obama have had their fingers in, dealing the stock market like a shell game. The object is to inflate the index which just looks at number of stocks bought and sold.
Stocks are purchased and held a few days or weeks, then sold, not to increase the value of the industrial output, but to simply create activity. The money is cycled back and forth, between industries that are in terrible shape; airlines, petroleum, steel, machine tools, what ever.
We are told that inflation is low although a gallon of milk cost a lot more, that gasoline price is up because of evil corporations, that the unemployment rate is going down.
Of course, in many cities apartments are vacant because the workers and their families have moved and are looking for work in greener pastures.
Even the Mexicans are going south to find work.
Congress and the obama administration attack corporate aviation, while many thousand union aircraft workers are not building airplanes. obama awards a USAF airplane contract to Brazil.
obama is also funding off shore oil drilling in Brazilian waters.
Everything possible is being done to fool the people, so obama can be re-elected for four more years during which time he will have loaded the courts, including the SCOUS with judges who will destroy the Second Amendment and reverse Heller and McDonald
 

fuhr52

New member
Good old liberal politics. Destroy society then come riding in on their white horse and shinning armor with some kind of temporary solution. The private sector could do a better job left alone. Liberals can't let that happen. Only they have solution. After all look how well the liberals war on poverty has work over the last 50 years. Well at least they have good intentions. Let's see what shall we do next?
 

bpenlandjr

New member
OMG! Can we please stick to this being a GUN FORUM, and leave uninformed commentary out?! The stock market operates like any other market - it is based on supply and demand. Take an economics class and get your head out of your ass. If the market could be manipulated by "secret government trade accounts" as you suggest, then please explain to me why every other president did not use it to their advantage? Do you know what the average return was undwe G.W Bush? It was -3.5%. Do you think he would have affected that more if he could?! Conspiracy theorists give the rest of us a bad rep. Stick to facts, not made-up "facts". That is how Repubs can actually win!
 

fuhr52

New member
If you don't like the political section, don't come here. There is plenty of activity in the firearm section. The sections are clearly marked for your convenience.
 

Grognard Gunny

New member
If you look in or listen to any solid business news media, they will constantly tell you that the markets reflect not only the present, but the perceived future.

Today, at least for a while, the markets are going up. This can be attributed to many things, but most of them are emotional rather than reality. Exactly why certain "news items", totally removed from the realm of "valuation of the market" can and does affect the prices.

For instance, uncertainty of any sort, lowers the markets, in general. A suspician of higher inflation in the near future will affect prices. The rumor of Government "control" measures on the markets can affect them negatively.

Right now, the markets are showing upward strength. Is this pent up demand? Is this the sign of strong expected growth (for a change) in the economy? Is this a manifestation of general "feel good" attitudes coming back after all these years of gloom and doom over the economy? Any and all combinations are also part of the computations/considerations.

Or is this just another "bubble"? (Always a concern.) Rest assured, whatever the cause, Obama and his merry maladroits had nothing to do with it, but equally assured, they will try to take the credit for it. (It IS an election year, ya know. Anything goes.)

Also keep in mind, as they make their grandeous claims, that the markets are valued based on the almighty Dollar as scoring means. If the Dow happens to "hit" the all time high again, do not be too impressed, for there have been four years of inflation to take into consideration to make that new "high" compatable in real value to the old "high".

The markets are complex and get more complex through applied advanced technology every year. I Mastered in Finance with top honors but didn't keep up with the field as I should have. Thus, while I could readily realize that there was going to be a "crash" soon, back in '04-'07.... all the "indicators" were plainly visible for anyone looking to see.... due to technical innovations in the Industry that I let go by unnoticed, I was in no way prepared for the severity of that crash.

The markets are a fast and furious endeavor, you either keep current or you take notes, hire a money manager to manage your 401k, and hope you get one that knows what he/she is doing. (Take a look at the turnover rate of fund managers on Wall street.... they are composed of three types. 1) The "winners" who have accumulated enough fortune to do something else with the rest of their lives (or simply NEED to do something else). 2) Those who simply break down from the stress of the job. (Your job depends on positive productivity, ALL the time.) 3) Those who are losers of the great game and are fired. (Which expected results contributes greatly to those in category "2".)

End of Finance lesson for class 201 today. Hadn't been for a personal choice NOT to go for my Doctrate, I would probably be teaching Finance at some college to this day. (.... AND I WOULD BE BORED TO DEATH WITH IT BY NOW! As it is, it is nothing more than a personal hobby of sorts.... proper application of things learned over the years only shows up as "winnings" in my wife's retirement funds.)

GG
 

Oldgrunt

Well-known member
OMG! Can we please stick to this being a GUN FORUM, and leave uninformed commentary out?! The stock market operates like any other market - it is based on supply and demand. Take an economics class and get your head out of your ass. If the market could be manipulated by "secret government trade accounts" as you suggest, then please explain to me why every other president did not use it to their advantage? Do you know what the average return was undwe G.W Bush? It was -3.5%. Do you think he would have affected that more if he could?! Conspiracy theorists give the rest of us a bad rep. Stick to facts, not made-up "facts". That is how Repubs can actually win!

My, my, somebody else's cat whizzed in their Wheaties this morning. FYI, this is the political forum where all of us who "have our heads up our a$$" come to vent our spleens about various and sundry things other than guns. There is a caveat at the Main Category that warns people entering here to be ready for strong opinions. I dare say that there are some on here who are keenly aware of the workings of the stock market and, probably some who don't know have any idea about the Dow-Jones index. For those who may know about the market and opine, there are others who like what they may have to say. So.......if you don't like the exchanges on here, please feel free to find another forum. If you do care to stay, we would probably be interested in some of your enlightening comments if presented in a different manner.
 

FN1910

New member
About 10 years ago I realized that everything I had learned in college from all the economics and business courses I had taken was evidently wrong. I do remember all the tests in economics class were multiple choice and "Choose the most correct answer". More than once I convinced the professors that my choice was just as correct as his. The stock market of today is driven much more by emotion than actual data and with the advent of computers day trading is now the norm rather than the exception. The stock of many or most companies is so overpriced compared to the actual value of the company until it is scary.

The DOW or "Dow Jones Industrial Index" is based completely on the stock price of 30 companies. So how much faith you want to put in that is up to you. I ask people where is the biggest gambling casino in the world and they usually say Las Vegas or London thinking of actual casinos. I tell the that it is actually in Chicago, the CBOT. That was the largest at one time but now it may be Wall Street with the regualr stock market or possibly the NASDAQ. But the CBOT deals much more in futures so I would say it is still the worlds largest casino.
 

Ringo

A WATCHMAN
I ask people where is the biggest gambling casino in the world and they usually say Las Vegas or London thinking of actual casinos. I tell the that it is actually in Chicago, the CBOT. That was the largest at one time but now it may be Wall Street with the regualr stock market or possibly the NASDAQ. But the CBOT deals much more in futures so I would say it is still the worlds largest casino.
Yep, it's nothing more than high tech gambling.
 

agrippakc

New member
You are correct. Numbers are always fudged to some degree, but they would give you some indications as to the overall situation as it stood. Today the numbers are so off, and everything that would naturally affect them are so artifically manipulated, that the numbers can't be brought to the table. We are a world shouded in darkness and staring into an artificial light, telling ourselves that it is the sun and eveything is going to keep getting brighter. Precious metals, food, ammunition with enough planning will see us through to the other side. Whatever that will look like.
 

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