Snyder vetoes enhanced carry bill, proving again he is a spinelss, gnat-brained idiot

[shop tom]

Read it and weep:

Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder Vetoes Bill, Keeps 'Gun Free' School Zones - ABC News

tom

 

[ezkl2230]

I'm convinced Snyder never actually intended to sign it in the first place. Newtown just gave him a pretext to veto it.

 

[alduane]

The problem with Snyder is that he isn't man enough to take a stand on much of anything. It's whatever the puppet master tells him to do. Reminds me of a line from the Meatloaf song "Paradise By the Dashboard Light." "What's it gonna be boy, Yes or No?"

 

[MyOpinonTC_MI]

No so idiot but not ready and prudent.

Hi,

I have study and re-study that Bill and it is progress. It is also complex and hard to follow. The end of the year bill adoption rate and the gun crises made it impossible for the Governor to go along. I think that after taking the time, he may as small modification to it, but it will pass. I personally don't want to see open-carry in public places. Not all people feel OK when there are weapons. A police officer has an uniform that identifies him. A nobody like us would just create interrogation about their safety. Open carry is good on public land, your place, shooting stand, but where there already law and order, kids, wives and elderly it's not appropriate. Second amendment is OK but the society has evolved and cowboy time is the pass.

 

[Sir Diealotz]

Hi,

I have study and re-study that Bill and it is progress. It is also complex and hard to follow. The end of the year bill adoption rate and the gun crises made it impossible for the Governor to go along. I think that after taking the time, he may as small modification to it, but it will pass. I personally don't want to see open-carry in public places. Not all people feel OK when there are weapons. A police officer has an uniform that identifies him. A nobody like us would just create interrogation about their safety. Open carry is good on public land, your place, shooting stand, but where there already law and order, kids, wives and elderly it's not appropriate. Second amendment is OK but the society has evolved and cowboy time is the pass.

Learn to English LOL

 

[ezkl2230]

Hi,

I have study and re-study that Bill and it is progress. It is also complex and hard to follow. The end of the year bill adoption rate and the gun crises made it impossible for the Governor to go along. I think that after taking the time, he may as small modification to it, but it will pass. I personally don't want to see open-carry in public places. Not all people feel OK when there are weapons. A police officer has an uniform that identifies him. A nobody like us would just create interrogation about their safety. Open carry is good on public land, your place, shooting stand, but where there already law and order, kids, wives and elderly it's not appropriate. Second amendment is OK but the society has evolved and cowboy time is the pass.

If you really believe that the reason Snyder didn't sign SB 59 was because there were too many bills crossing his desk, then you need to take another look. This is something I posted on another thread:

Look for a serious attempt to eliminate open carry in a pistol free zone in the new session. The governor sees no "value in having guns really present in the schools, hospitals, places like that." SB 59 was vetoed "because schools were not given a path to block guns from their buildings."

Duh. That was kind of the whole point of SB 59 - to allow people with a CPL to legally CC in places like that. And no, I did not support the part of the bill that would have repealed OC in a PFZ, which is also curently legal.

Why does the Gov. oppose these bills?

Because, like the other state universities, U of M has a Constitutional right to make its own rules and declare itself "gun free." When Snyder was a student there, a fellow RA was killed when an armed intruder entered their building. Snyder has been carrying the guilt from that incident for years because, according to this article, if he had not been "detained" that night, HE would have been the one confronting an armed intruder instead of his fellow RA, and HE would have died instead. He feels guilty about the results of a criminal's actions, and now the legal carry community must pay the price. You would think this would have demonstrated to him the value of being able to defend one's self. It didn't. It put him squarely on the side of anti's. When it comes to seeing the value of personal firearm carry for self defense, in his own words,

“There is a difference of opinion on that. I’m not on that side in terms of looking at it.”

I have been warning people that Snyder is not pro 2A. To be completely honest, I was shocked that he even considered signing the pro 2A bills that passed in the state legislature (I was shocked when he signed taser carry into law earlier this year). It now appears that his willingness to "consider" signing these latest bills was actually a ploy to give him the opportunity to very publicly shoot them down and give him a platform from which to lunch his own anti-2A agenda; the Newtown shooting just put an exclamation point on it in his mind.


Tim Skubick: Concealed weapons veto moves Gov. Snyder back toward the middle | MLive.com

To make matters worse, the president of Michigan Open Carry attended a Grand Rapids city meeting wearing his sidearm (Gun-toting visitor draws ire at Grand Rapids City Commission meeting with children in audience | MLive.com). While this is currently legal under Michigan law, it merely confirms Snyder's position about firearm carry, especially because there were children present at the meeting. Yeah, I know, that shouldn't be an issue. But right now, the anti's are on the warpath, and Snyder is probably personal friends with Bloomberg. MOC's president didn't help our cause, he merely highlighted what the governor considers to be a major problem. Getting any Pro-2A legislation passed in this state while Snyder is governor is highly unlikely.

 

[ezkl2230]

Learn to English LOL

This is the first time I have accused someone of this, but someone is trolling. He has 4 posts to his credit, and ALL of them are anti-carry and spouting the Anti misinformation crap that Bloomberg and his group were feeding into Michigan leading up to Snyder vetoing SB 59 and gutting HB 5225.

 

[Sir Diealotz]

Learn to English LOL

This is the first time I have accused someone of this, but someone is trolling. He has 4 posts to his credit, and ALL of them are anti-carry and spouting the Anti misinformation crap that Bloomberg and his group were feeding into Michigan leading up to Snyder vetoing SB 59 and gutting HB 5225.

Yes I agree

I replied to another one of its posts
"The troll is strong with this one"

 

[Itstjs]

Ive read somewhere that the bill had "too much nonspecific language" in the bill which had apparently "influenced the Governor" ontop of the Newtown shooting. Ive also read the bill will be modified next year and is expected to pass.
Question for those of you in Michigan, how exactly can one apply for a pistol free zone class license anyways?
Worst part about this bill is I had my class signed for already, spot reserved and all (thank God I didnt pay for it yet) and had to cancel yesterday...I think Ill put the money towards an "Assault Weapon" as Im sure within a month theyll be in short supply.

 

[ezkl2230]

Ive read somewhere that the bill had "too much nonspecific language" in the bill which had apparently "influenced the Governor" ontop of the Newtown shooting. Ive also read the bill will be modified next year and is expected to pass.
Question for those of you in Michigan, how exactly can one apply for a pistol free zone class license anyways?
Worst part about this bill is I had my class signed for already, spot reserved and all (thank God I didnt pay for it yet) and had to cancel yesterday...I think Ill put the money towards an "Assault Weapon" as Im sure within a month theyll be in short supply.

You can't. The bill that would have provided the application for an exemption to CC in a PFZ was shot down. And as I have said in a couple of posts, there was nothing about the bill's language - which Snyder knew about since he specifically demanded that OC in a PFZ (which is legal in MI if you have a CPL) be done away with - or the bill's timing that led to its veto. However, since the bill was vetoed, you CAN OC in a PFZ if you have a CPL.

For the real reason Snyder vetoed it, refer to my posting above to MyOpinionTC_MI.

SB 59 was a bill that specifically provided an exemption for those in MI CPL holders who 1) applied for it, 2) took an additional 9 hours of class and fired nearly 200 more rounds. The point was to increase carry in a PFZ. Snyder was upset that the bill didn't let schools (and other public property) declare themselves to be PFZ's like privately owned businesses and organizations can do.

Like I said, read my previous post above. I am a former legislative aide; I have been over this and other bills MANY times. There is nothing about the language in this bill that is any more confusing than most others that come out. It is LONG (about 65 pages).

 

[alduane]

Ive read somewhere that the bill had "too much nonspecific language" in the bill which had apparently "influenced the Governor" ontop of the Newtown shooting. Ive also read the bill will be modified next year and is expected to pass.
Question for those of you in Michigan, how exactly can one apply for a pistol free zone class license anyways?
Worst part about this bill is I had my class signed for already, spot reserved and all (thank God I didnt pay for it yet) and had to cancel yesterday...I think Ill put the money towards an "Assault Weapon" as Im sure within a month theyll be in short supply.

I don't believe that if the bill is "modified" like Snyder wants it will have anything to do with enhanced carry for normal citizens. It will outlaw open carry in places where Snyder doesn't think we can be trusted and who knows whatever else he thinks is best for his "subjects." Snyder isn't MAN ENOUGH to come out and say what he thinks of our right to carry. He'd rather waffle his words with things like "nonspecific language" and use incidents like Sandy Hook to lay the blame anywhere but on him. He said that Sandy Hook gave him "clear pause" when all it meant was he had an excuse to cover his own agenda. Snyder is nothing but a Lying Weasel.

 

[Andrew49417]

Snyder wrote an explanation as to why he vetoed it. His excuse was because it didn't allow for schools, public libraries, etc. to prohibit concealed weapons.

I thought that was the whole point of the expanded CPL. With a modified law with public places able to prohibit guns, we'll likely be even more restricted than now.

 

[alduane]

Snyder wrote an explanation as to why he vetoed it. His excuse was because it didn't allow for schools, public libraries, etc. to prohibit concealed weapons.

I thought that was the whole point of the expanded CPL. With a modified law with public places able to prohibit guns, we'll likely be even more restricted than now.

Exactly. He liked that it did away with open carry for CPL holders but he doesn't want to allow any expanded carry. Why doesn't he just come out and say that responsible citizens shouldn't be able to carry outside their homes instead of waffling his words.

 

[Nightmare45]

They are talking about having a gun free zone around the President and Vice President, yep that should work, once again you nut cases and I am speaking of the other nut cases not the criminal nut cases have come up with a brilliant idea, one can only hope it works as well as the other gun free zones. PS: I will expect the honest secret service to lock up their guns when in the zone. I continue to be amazed at stupid it always jumps up.

 

[ezkl2230]

I don't believe that if the bill is "modified" like Snyder wants it will have anything to do with enhanced carry for normal citizens. It will outlaw open carry in places where Snyder doesn't think we can be trusted and who knows whatever else he thinks is best for his "subjects." Snyder isn't MAN ENOUGH to come out and say what he thinks of our right to carry. He'd rather waffle his words with things like "nonspecific language" and use incidents like Sandy Hook to lay the blame anywhere but on him. He said that Sandy Hook gave him "clear pause" when all it meant was he had an excuse to cover his own agenda. Snyder is nothing but a Lying Weasel.

He HAS said what he thinks about it. 1) He sees no value in defensive carry in public places. 2) He wants to give public places, schools especially, specific legal authority to ban (his word) firearms carry on their premises. How much clearer do you want him to get?

Bloomberg understands what Snyder did:

New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg praised Snyder’s veto, saying it showed a commitment to rational gun policy.

“Now we need similar courage and leadership from our elected officials in Washington,” said Bloomberg, co-chairman of the group Mayors Against Illegal Guns and the founder and majority owner of Bloomberg News parent Bloomberg LP.

Michigan?s Snyder Vetoes Bill on Concealed Guns in School - Bloomberg

Snyder finally tipped his hand. He has been a closet Bloomie; he's out of the closet now. I don't expect to be able to pass ANY legislation that expands CPL rights under Snyder.

Here is another post I wrote showing how close Snyder came to initiating a stealth public carry ban - and using Pro-2A legislators to do it: http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firearm-politics-2nd-amendment-issues/32451-how-close-michigan-just-came-losing-right-carry-public.html