Regular scope on AR question

[AndeyHall]

Since I don't have the funding to afford good optics for my AR, I'm throwing on a cheap 3-9x32 that came with my Marlin 30-30 in the mean time. But I tried bore siting it at about 30-40 yards the other day and I can't seem to get the laser up high enough to the center of the reticle and its pretty much maxed out in the "up" direction. Do I need to find a way to cant the scope to a certain MOA? I would have though that wouldn't be necessary but maybe so. I'm just wanting to sight it in at 100 yards.

 

[Purple]

Not sure I understand what's really going on. You said you can't get the laser up high enough to the center recticle? The laser bore sighter doesn't move, it's stationary. If you can't see the laser in your scope, then your scope alignment is off or the laser bore sighter is not set in the barrel correctly. If you can see the laser in your scope, you move the recticel's to cross on the red dot.

 

[AndeyHall]

Not sure I understand what's really going on. You said you can't get the laser up high enough to the center recticle? The laser bore sighter doesn't move, it's stationary. If you can't see the laser in your scope, then your scope alignment is off or the laser bore sighter is not set in the barrel correctly. If you can see the laser in your scope, you move the recticel's to cross on the red dot.

What I mean is, the laser was at the bottom of the reticle when I started, just barely inside the scope. I started turning the elevation adjustment in the "up" direction while looking through the scope and it creates the illusion as though the dot is moving up towards the center of the reticle, so that's why I referred to it in that way. But before the laser reached the center of the reticle, I topped out the elevation adjustment.

 

[jcreek]

On an AR, there should be no need for a 20 MOA base. How much internal adjustment does your scope have? Sometimes those cheap ones don't have very much. With that said you should still have enough to zero. Make sure your scope is mounted properly, and with a level reticle. Make sure your bore sight is sitting correctly in the bore and fully inserted and make sure the laser is still shooting straight. Point the rifle at a wall and spin the bore sight in the bore. If it doesn't move it's good, if it moves in a circle it's out of alignment. You can also try lightly "banging" on the scope tube. I know it sounds crude but sometimes the adjustments in the scope become caught up and need to be broken loose. It's actually SOP now in the USMC when zeroing our ACOGs. Other than that I would suggest just skipping the short zero and jut bore sighting it at 100yds and see if that solves it. Best of luck.

 

[AndeyHall]

Yeah I think I'm just not going to worry about it and wait till I can take it to the range. I did check the bore sight though and it does work properly.

 

[Mac357]

If you can afford to spend about $70 try a trueglo red dot optic. I put one on my Sig M400 and it actually works very well and is really easy to zero. I first zeroed it at 50 yard and it is dead on at that range. The 55 grain .223/5.56mm actually rises about 3 inches at 100 yards. So once you run enough rounds through it you will find the proper hold over to be dead on at 100 yards. Truglo's red dot scope works pretty damn well for a low cost optic. It is the red dot with no magnification and is similar to an eotech typr reticle. Just suggestion..

 

[JMoriarty]

Yeah I think I'm just not going to worry about it and wait till I can take it to the range. I did check the bore sight though and it does work properly.

Hello Andey, Is it possible that you are attempting to adjust your scope at less than 100 yards?.. if so this would be the problem.. at a short distance like 30 feet, the distance from your barrel to the center height of your scope will be magnified and impossible to align.... taking it to the range is the best plan or at least get the laser out to 50 yards..... otherwise you may strip the scope by over adjusting to compensate. Of course please disregard if this is not what you are doing and it is otherwise obvious.

 

[jcreek]

Hello Andey, Is it possible that you are attempting to adjust your scope at less than 100 yards?.. if so this would be the problem.. at a short distance like 30 feet, the distance from your barrel to the center height of your scope will be magnified and impossible to align.... taking it to the range is the best plan or at least get the laser out to 50 yards..... otherwise you may strip the scope by over adjusting to compensate. Of course please disregard if this is not what you are doing and it is otherwise obvious.

This is not entirely correct. 30 feet? Yes that might cause an issue depending on the magnification and adjustment range of your optic.

However, he said 30-40 YDS. Rough zeroing a rifle at this range is extremely common practice. It's called a near zero. If you know anything about external ballistics you know that a projectile crosses the optic's LOS twice due to its curved trajectory in relation to the optic's straight LOS. These two crossing points are called the near and far zero.

When zeroing your rifle at 100 yds, firing a 55 grain .223 projectile at roughly 3240 fps will give you a near zero distance of 75yds (the first time it crosses the LOS.) Zeroing your rifle at 200 yds, firing the same projectile, will give you a near zero distance of 35 yds.

This is extremely useful, when you don't have the range necessary to do a standard far zero (100/200yd) on your rifle. It's always advised to do a far zero when you get the chance because with the lesser range of a near zero, the margin of error is amplified and your zero will not be as accurate (why it's often called a rough zero.)

Just thought is clear that up.

 

[JMoriarty]

Hello JCreek, thank you... and while adding that he was zeroing with a bore laser there will be only one zero.. All I was trying to say was his scope height will seem amplified and difficult to zero at too short of a distance. Meanwhile, I might venture that the scope, the angle of mount, or the laser itself is more likely the problem. Of course a little time at the range is always the cure, as it is for so many things...

 

[AndeyHall]

Problem solved...since I made the deans list this past spring my parents volunteered to buy the scope I wanted. So I'm putting the Nikon M-223 2-8x32 BDC with their M-223 mount. Just put in the order to optics planet.

 

[gunnerbob]

Gawd... rich kids....

 

[AndeyHall]

Gawd... rich kids....

Ha far from it. Just changed my major during my senior year and had to pretty much start over so they're giving me incentives to get done as soon as possible. Their logic...spend a couple hundred here might save us a couple thousand down the road.

 

[jcreek]

Gawd... rich kids....

Ha far from it. Just changed my major during my senior year and had to pretty much start over so they're giving me incentives to get done as soon as possible. Their logic...spend a couple hundred here might save us a couple thousand down the road.

They're still paying for your college lol.. My parents are well off and told me to pay for my own damn school if I wanted to go. They've also made it very clear that they plan on leaving most of their estate to charity when they pass. I love working for a living, but I'm not cut out for white collar jobs. I'd go insane in an office. Therefore, I have next to no chance of ever making anything on par with them. Makes my expensive hobbies a little harder to obtain lol.

 

[AndeyHall]

They're still paying for your college lol.. My parents are well off and told me to pay for my own damn school if I wanted to go. They've also made it very clear that they plan on leaving most of their estate to charity when they pass. I love working for a living, but I'm not cut out for white collar jobs. I'd go insane in an office. Therefore, I have next to no chance of ever making anything on par with them. Makes my expensive hobbies a little harder to obtain lol.

You must have had a damn good job then...I get paid really good for a part time job and even if I worked 40 hours a week it wouldn't come close to paying for living expenses and school. It's either that or no school at all. I think in today's day and age, college is pretty much a given. If you aren't willing to pay for your kids to go knowing they probably will want to, then you probably shouldn't have kids.

Plus they weren't too pissed about it since the majority of it was paid through scholarships and what not, so they're just now having to pay and it's only for another year and a half. I'd say they're getting a sweet deal. It would probably be a whole different story if I was barely getting by, but I don't disappoint in the grade department.

 

[AndeyHall]

Here's the finished product btw.
Link Removed

 

[jcreek]

They're still paying for your college lol.. My parents are well off and told me to pay for my own damn school if I wanted to go. They've also made it very clear that they plan on leaving most of their estate to charity when they pass. I love working for a living, but I'm not cut out for white collar jobs. I'd go insane in an office. Therefore, I have next to no chance of ever making anything on par with them. Makes my expensive hobbies a little harder to obtain lol.

You must have had a damn good job then...I get paid really good for a part time job and even if I worked 40 hours a week it wouldn't come close to paying for living expenses and school. It's either that or no school at all. I think in today's day and age, college is pretty much a given. If you aren't willing to pay for your kids to go knowing they probably will want to, then you probably shouldn't have kids.

Plus they weren't too pissed about it since the majority of it was paid through scholarships and what not, so they're just now having to pay and it's only for another year and a half. I'd say they're getting a sweet deal. It would probably be a whole different story if I was barely getting by, but I don't disappoint in the grade department.

I completely disagree. I know tons of people who's parents were not going to pay for college. They might give them an interest free loan but they expect it to be paid back. It's not cause they're greedy it's about earning your own way and teaching a work ethic. I had a few friends in HS whose parents paid for everything including college. One of them didn't get his first job until he was 24 flipping burgers (arts degree) and another dropped out and blew his college fund on heroin. I'm in no way saying that you or everybody whose parents pay for college is like that, I'm just saying it never hurts to instill a work ethic early. If you know where you look you can go to a decent school with just about any full time job. Lots of programs out there.

 

[AndeyHall]

I completely disagree. I know tons of people who's parents were not going to pay for college. They might give them an interest free loan but they expect it to be paid back. It's not cause they're greedy it's about earning your own way and teaching a work ethic. I had a few friends in HS whose parents paid for everything including college. One of them didn't get his first job until he was 24 flipping burgers (arts degree) and another dropped out and blew his college fund on heroin. I'm in no way saying that you or everybody whose parents pay for college is like that, I'm just saying it never hurts to instill a work ethic early. If you know where you look you can go to a decent school with just about any full time job. Lots of programs out there.

I pay for everything except school. There's no way I could have the time or the money to stack that in there.

It's just very peeving how a lot of people have a very condescending way of telling how they had to pay for their own way when they hear my parents voluntarily pay for some of my stuff. I get it all the time.

 

[Firefighterchen]

I pay for everything except school. There's no way I could have the time or the money to stack that in there.

It's just very peeving how a lot of people have a very condescending way of telling how they had to pay for their own way when they hear my parents voluntarily pay for some of my stuff. I get it all the time.

People gave me grief too. My school was my job. My parents are also well off, and any school I wanted to go to was paid for. I always held another full time job outside of school. I also volunteered at the local fire department wherever I lived. I was either always on the dean's list or vice presidents list 3.8 - 4.0 GPA. My older brother followed the same path as me. We both now have very well paying jobs.

My younger brother took a different path. He focused solely in school. He joined Crew in college, got a scholarship for that. He now manages a Uniqulo store (largest clothing store in the world) in the States. Works nearly 80 hours a week.

Both my brothers and I plan on paying for our children's schooling.

Those that had schooling paid for do not lack a work ethic. That can be instilled in a child other ways.

 

[AndeyHall]

People gave me grief too. My school was my job. My parents are also well off, and any school I wanted to go to was paid for. I always held another full time job outside of school. I also volunteered at the local fire department wherever I lived. I was either always on the dean's list or vice presidents list 3.8 - 4.0 GPA. My older brother followed the same path as me. We both now have very well paying jobs.

My younger brother took a different path. He focused solely in school. He joined Crew in college, got a scholarship for that. He now manages a Uniqulo store (largest clothing store in the world) in the States. Works nearly 80 hours a week.

Both my brothers and I plan on paying for our children's schooling.

Those that had schooling paid for do not lack a work ethic. That can be instilled in a child other ways.

Exactly! I think most of the problems with college kids can be traced back to lack of discipline rather than having their things paid for. To do well in school takes just as much work ethic as a job, if not more. I mean hell, the majority of people put in their 8 hours a day and then go home without giving it another minute's thought. I put in that or more AT school, then have to go home just to do even more when I get there. 60-80 hours a week working on school work sounds about right for any well disciplined college student.

 

[jcreek]

Those that had schooling paid for do not lack a work ethic. That can be instilled in a child other ways.

I didn't mean to insinuate that all necessarily do. I definitely agree that work ethic can be instilled several ways. Including using a college fund as an incentive. I was just saying, I've seen the effects of parents not installing a work ethic in their kids.

My parents "spoiled" me when I was growing up but only if I earned it. Hell, my dad footed the bill for my pilot's license training, which wasn't cheap, when I was 17. But I was also working 65 hours a week between two separate jobs and going to HS full time.

Maybe it was because they were kind of pissed off that I moved out and in with my girlfriend at 17, but they pretty much cut me off and said you're on your own when I graduated.