Reciprocity - IN.

[jfisch]

Hello Vermonters,
I just noticed that my state, Indiana, honors permits from every state except Vermont. Anyone know why this is?
I couldn't really find a good answer for it and thought maybe you guys might know.

 

[BC1]

Vermont residents don't need a permit to carry a concealed weapon.

 

[mooncusser]

It is because in VERMONT, you do NOT need ANY permits. They are civilized

 

[alduane]

Vermont has no permit to honor. That's why some States, like Alaska for example, have a permit residents can get even though they don't need it in their own State.

 

[rpeckham]

My information regarding Vermont is dated so things may have changed but when last I checked some years ago Vermont was the only state in the nation that that did NOT require a permit to carry a concealed firearm. Ergo, since no license was required, recognizing out-of-state concealed
firearms permits was probably considered redundant and unnecessary.

rpeckham

 

[VT Patriot]

As a Vermonter, all of the above is true. We have what is called "Constitutional Carry". That is, if not otherwise restricted from owning a weapon, you may walk into a store, pick out and buy a handgun, rifle or whatever. Buy a holster, strap it on, buy some ammo, load the handgun, put it in the holster, pay the man, walk out of the store, wave to officer friendly, get in your truck, and drive away. Stop at the grocery store with your new toy strapped on your hip, and continue on. The only major restriction is carrying a LOADED rifle or shotgun in a car. No case law, but to prevent some nutcase from 'jacking' deer from a car.
So, many people carry, and we have no paperwork AT ALL. (We also have the lowest violent crime rate in the lower 48) As such, most other states can't honor a carry permit that does not exist. For us to carry away from VT (thru Mass, NY) to get anywhere we have to apply in those states to get 'out of state' permits.
An interesting side note, if in VT you may carry with no permit if you come from any of the states that won't allow us to carry there. Reciprocity?? :fie:

 

[JimSmitty]

Non-residents DO need a permit from their home state to carry in VT. As per federal law, you DO need to be a resident of VT to purchase a firearm there and carry it out of the store.

 

[NavyLCDR]

Non-residents DO need a permit from their home state to carry in VT. As per federal law, you DO need to be a resident of VT to purchase a firearm there and carry it out of the store.

Completely wrong on the first statement and partially wrong on the second statement.

1. Show the law that requires a non-resident to have a permit from their home state to carry openly or concealed in VT. There ain't one.

Here's your Vermont statute chapter:
http://www.leg.state.vt.us/statutes/sections.cfm?Title=13&Chapter=085

and the applicable section which makes no reference to resident or non-resident:

§ 4003. Carrying dangerous weapons

A person who carries a dangerous or deadly weapon, openly or concealed, with the intent or avowed purpose of injuring a fellow man, or who carries a dangerous or deadly weapon within any state institution or upon the grounds or lands owned or leased for the use of such institution, without the approval of the warden or superintendent of the institution, shall be imprisoned not more than two years or fined not more than $200.00, or both.

2. You only have to be a resident of Vermont to purchase a firearm other than a rifle or shotgun in Vermont. It is perfectly legal for a non-resident to purchase a rifle or shotgun from an FFL in Vermont and carry it out of the store if the possession and purchase of that rifle or shotgun would also be legal in the purchaser's state of residence. That is in Federal law 18 USC 922 (b)(3) and there is no Vermont law against it. In fact, Vermont law SPECIFICALLY ALLOWS IT! See it quoted below.

I look forward to your reply to the challenge.

Vermont Statute, Title 13, Chapter 85, § 4015. Purchase of firearms by nonresidents


Residents of a state other than the state of Vermont may purchase rifles and shotguns in the state of Vermont, provided that such residents conform to the applicable provisions of the Gun Control Act of 1968, and regulations thereunder, as administered by the United States Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, and provided further that such residents conform to the provisions of law applicable to such purchase in the state of Vermont and in the state in which such persons reside.

Federal law:

18 USC § 922 - Unlawful acts

(a) It shall be unlawful—


(3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section



(b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or deliver—


(3) any firearm to any person who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the licensee’s place of business is located, except that this paragraph (A) shall not apply to the sale or delivery of any rifle or shotgun to a resident of a State other than a State in which the licensee’s place of business is located if the transferee meets in person with the transferor to accomplish the transfer, and the sale, delivery, and receipt fully comply with the legal conditions of sale in both such States (and any licensed manufacturer, importer or dealer shall be presumed, for purposes of this subparagraph, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, to have had actual knowledge of the State laws and published ordinances of both States)

 

[VT Patriot]

Thanx LCDR. It's nice to know that some people know and understand the great laws we have here. I am always careful to keep my long arms unloaded in the truck. but the handgun is always loaded, and either on my side, or in the vehicle.
I don't seem to have much trouble. Just a shame that the other 47 (or is it 57 LOL) states don't have them. :yes4:

 

[NavyLCDR]

Thanx LCDR.

It will be interesting to see what law Mr. Smitty comes back with that says a non-resident requires a permit from their home state to carry in VT. I'm betting he won't reply. It was probably something he heard from a CCW instructor, LEO or gun shop employee somewhere.