Positive (Mostly) Encounter in NYC

[Dekul34]

New poster just thought I'd share an experience I had, I am an AZ resident with CCW (The class/permit was my 21st birthday present from my father who is a former LEO)and I carry almost daily when at home, but I went to NYC to visit my mother who was working on a business project there. Clearly I knew to leave my firearms which I carry almost daily at home, however I did take with me a pocketknife which I carry all the time, not for defense (although it'll do in a pinch) but because it's just damn handy to have a knife and I'm a bit of a survivalist at heart, can't think of a more useful tool which can be carried all the time with little effort. Anyway, that aside, the encounter...

I was walking along the street with my mother, very close to times square, as we went from shop to shop spending our tourist dollars, barely conscious of the fact that I had a knife in my pocket however the clip on its side was sticking over the edge of my pocket holding it in place, and apparently this was enough evidence for a pair of young female officers (well my age, mid 20s) to step over and ask if I was carrying a knife. I was a little worried being that I hadn't even considered that it might be a problem, and it was at this moment I realized that the knife I brought along with me was my usual Benchmade automatic side folder, aka evil dangerous switchblade to the paranoid gungrabbing left so the pit of my stomach was rumbling, though I was very polite. After asking me to carefully hand them the knife, the officers asked where I as from (I didn't sound like a local) and informed them I was from Arizona, asked me to show my ID, which I did, and made a point to draw out my CCW card with it (it sits right behind my drivers license in my wallet) even though it's not valid there figured it couldn't hurt. One of the officers noted to the other that the knife had a lock but they made no attempt to open it, I'm not sure whether they recognized it as an automatic or not, they made me sign a warning and informed me that it would usually be a citation to carry a weapon but they cut me slack since I was from out of town, told me to put the knife back in my pocket and keep it concealed for the duration of my stay, and wished me a good night.

All in all positive and I do consider myself lucky had they pushed the issue I could have been in deep trouble for having a switchblade, I'll make sure to stick to an ordinary pocket knife next time I leave the state. (Although I will say it's silly had I been home or any of the states which allow it I'd have been carrying a handgun the knife is the last of anyone's worries!) Guess my only questions on the whole thing are if it's illegal to carry a pocket knife why would they hand it back to me and tell me to conceal it, and whether a clip on the outside of a pocket is really cause to assume there's a weapon. Though I believe in always being forthright and honest with the police, I'm also careful not to volunteer or say more than I have to especially in the instance of being 'stopped'.

 

[zacklmpd]

I don't believe I have heard of anyone being stopped for a knife here in ky reason 511249 why I won't visit new York. To many laws there plus no intrest or reason to visit ny, anyways welcome to the site

 

[KCD1974]

Knife laws are WORSE than firearm laws. They can vary from city to city in the same state! A good rule of thumb, avoid the "auto" knives and keep the blade to under 3". I also tend to avoid the pocket clip method of carrying one. Most of mine have the clip, I just don't hang it in the pocket.

 

[SGB]

You got dumbazz lucky

 

[Firefighterchen]

Again...I don't really understand how this is considered a "positive" encounter. If by positive you mean you aren't in jail...then ok that is a good thing. NYC PD has some pretty paranoid officers if a pocket knife spooked them...gotta agree with zack in that it is yet another reason to never visit there. I do not consider this a positive encounter, because this encounter would never happen in my city, so by default the fact it happened makes it a negative encounter to me. The only way that encounter could be considered positive to me, is if they wanted to know what kind of knife because they thought it was a good idea, and that they wished everyone could take care of themselves like you did...but alas that is exactly opposite of what happened..

 

[Dekul34]

No I agree, if I had my way I'd have been carrying a double stack automatic and maybe a backup gun or two in that city and one for my mom as well... but I guess it was positive in that they didn't make an issue of it aside from tell me to keep it in my pants, better than expected might be a more appropriate description than "positive"

 

[Dekul34]

Might as well post another while I'm here, this one was near Prescott, AZ while at an airsoft event with some friends all dressed up in military gear with airsoft assault rifles, machineguns, pistols. We were on public land and using biodegradable bbs and had called the sheriff's office ahead of time to let them know we were out there. But still had a car show up as we were packing our stuff who said someone had called about a bunch of men with rifles, we were close to but not right on the highway in a wooded area and near a turnoff for a camping site so someone driving by must have called. Though oddly only one officer showed to the call with no backup and seemed unconcerned, he was very polite and just asked what we were doing, none of the airsoft guns had orange tips or parts and many looked very real, not illegal in AZ but also probably not the most reassuring for an officer. Also as we were packing up and getting ready to leave I had taken my real handgun (locked in the car while we were playing) and was carrying it in (Decided to go open since I was already dressed up in full ACU gear and had a holster on the front of my interceptor vest) and I informed the officer it was real and I had a CCW, not that I needed it just figured I'd disclose it due to the circumstance, he just smiled and told us to be safe before leaving. This was what I consider to be a very good encounter, the officer was clearly just doing what he had to do they already knew we weren't up to no good and had a couple of LEOs and some active military among our group.

Then again I think AZ is very very gun friendly overall, here in prescott open carry is a common sight everywhere around town, anything from single actions in cowboy rigs to ak's slung over the shoulder in the more rural areas though have seen some carrying rifles downtown, and there was a recent story of President Obama giving a speech in AZ while a man with an AR-15 was open carrying in attendance, no negative consequence to him aside from probably having a secret service sniper aiming at his head the whole time, the only time I've ever been questioned by the police as to WHY I had guns was on a club/camping trip with some fellow college students, not all of whom were US citizens, I had a rifle and a handgun in locked cases in the back of the SUV and passed through a checkpoint near the border, even that was no problem once told we were going camping and wanted to do a little shooting were sent on our way with no more questions.

 

[m1gunr]

just another reason NOT to visit NY.......

 

[cawpin]

I agree...

I agree that this is not what I would consider a positive encounter. I just looked up New York knife laws and carrying a pocket knife is not illegal. They do have a law against switchblades, like most other states, but nothing against regular knives unless you are under 16.

 

[cgiven1]

In NY it's not illegal to own the knife or to carry it in your pocket. At least a folding knife. Switchblades are illegal and defined as a knife which has a blade which opens automatically by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in the handle of the knife. Their is no length limit in NY State. In NYC the legal limit is 4 inches for a folding blade. The illegality comes in if it can be seen, even if it is just the clip sticking out of your pocket. Then it is considered to be the illegal displaying of a deadly weapon. They saw the safety latch on it, but failed to recoginize it as a switchblade (probably not knife knowledgable).

From NYC law: 10-133 Possession of knives or instruments.

A. Legislative findings. It is hereby declared and found that possession in public places, streets and parks of the city, of large knives is a menace to the public health, peace, safety and welfare of the people of the city; that the possession in public places, streets and parks of such knives has resulted in the commission of many homicides, robberies, maimings and assaults of and upon the people of the city; that this condition encourages and fosters the commission of crimes and contributes to juvenile delinquency, youth crime and gangsterism; that unless the possession or carrying in public places, streets and parks of the city of such knives without a lawful purpose is prohibited, there is danger of an increase in crimes of violence and other conditions detrimental to public peace, safety and welfare. It is further declared and found that the wearing or carrying of knives in open view in public places while such knives are not being used for a lawful purpose is unnecessary and threatening to the public and should be prohibited.

B. It shall be unlawful for any person to carry on his or her person or have in such person's possession, in any public place, street or park any knife which has a blade length of four inches or more.

C. It shall be unlawful for any person in a public place, street or park to wear outside of his or her clothing or carry in open view any knife with an exposed or unexposed blade unless such person is actually using suck knife for a lawful purpose as set forth in subdivision d of this section.

D. The provisions of subdivisions b and c of this sections shall not apply to (1) persons in the military service on the state of New York when duly authorized to carry or display knives pursuant to regulations issued by the chief of stall to the governor; (2) police officers and peace officers as defined in the criminal procedure law; (3) participants in special events when authorized by the police commissioner (4) persons on the military or other service of the United States, in pursuit of official duty authorized by federal law; or (5) any person displaying or in possession of a knife otherwise in violation of this section when such a knife (a) is being used for or transported immediately to or from a place where it is used for hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, picnicking or any employment, trade or occupation customarily requiring the use of such knife; or (b) is displayed or carried by a member of a theatrical group, drill team, military or para military unit or veterans organization, to from or during a meeting, parade or other performance or practice for such event, which customarily requires the carrying of suck knife or (c) is being transported directly to or from a place of purchase in such a manner as not to allow easy access to such knife while it is transported; or (d) is displayed or carried by a duly enrolled member of the Boy or Girl scouts of America or similar organization or society and such display or possession is necessary to participate in the activities of such organization or society.

E. Violation of this section shall be an offense punishable by a fine of not more than three hundred dollars or by imprisonment not exceeding fifteen days or by both such fine and imprisonment.

 

[cawpin]

The illegality comes in if it can be seen, even if it is just the clip sticking out of your pocket. Then it is considered to be the illegal displaying of a deadly weapon. They saw the safety latch on it, but failed to recoginize it as a switchblade (probably not knife knowledgable).

1. Carrying it with a clip visible isn't displaying a deadly weapon, even in New York.
2. From his description, it IS NOT a switchblade. It is a spring assisted knife. They are not the same thing.

 

[The_Outlaw]

Again...I don't really understand how this is considered a "positive" encounter. If by positive you mean you aren't in jail...then ok that is a good thing. NYC PD has some pretty paranoid officers if a pocket knife spooked them...gotta agree with zack in that it is yet another reason to never visit there. I do not consider this a positive encounter, because this encounter would never happen in my city, so by default the fact it happened makes it a negative encounter to me. The only way that encounter could be considered positive to me, is if they wanted to know what kind of knife because they thought it was a good idea, and that they wished everyone could take care of themselves like you did...but alas that is exactly opposite of what happened..

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^What he said +1.^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[wuzfuz]

When I was a deputy sheriff in Arizona, there was no provision for a citizen to carry concealed. Only police and military could carry concealed, if in connection with their duties. When I got back to Arizona from lalaland, they had passed the CCW law. I went through the class, taught by my firearms instructor from the academy. I now carry a Washington Concealed Pistol License. My wife and I once had a business dealing in edged tools, pepper sprays, stun guns and such. You should have seen the list of things we could not ship to New York especially, but to several states as well. Probably the reason there was only one deputy who came to check you out with no backup is that in most counties in Arizona, that is pretty mush the complement for the district. Many times I patrolled our district's 986 square miles, and my closest backup was at least a half hour away. I didn't lose anything in New York city, and I won't go there looking for it.

 

[Dekul34]

Knives seem to be a black hole in this country with no two towns let alone states having the same laws on what is and isn't allowed, I'll not make the mistake of having any part of a knife showing in new york or any big city again. As for the sheriff deputy being the only one, maybe, but it was right outside Prescott within 10 minutes of the Sheriff office and county courthouse for Yavapai County so I doubt he couldn't have gotten backup if he felt it was needed.

 

[Deserteagle]

NYC PD has some pretty paranoid officers if a pocket knife spooked them...

Im going to disagree here.
Who said it spooked them? They were just enforcing the law. If they were spooked they probably would have tazed him or held him at gunpoint or called backup and tackled him. They handled it very calmly and politely as they enforced the law.

 

[Montanagyrene]

Not real sure it was a GOOD idea to carry ANY firearm while THAT close to the president...Of course, since I personally find VERY FEW things that I agree with him on, I most likely wouldn't be that CLOSE to him in the FIRST place!!

 

[Firefighterchen]

Im going to disagree here.
Who said it spooked them? They were just enforcing the law. If they were spooked they probably would have tazed him or held him at gunpoint or called backup and tackled him. They handled it very calmly and politely as they enforced the law.

I said it spooked them, I base it off of the account the OP stated. To me, it was a spook. If they would have tazed him or held him at gunpoint or called backup and tackled him, then I would say this was way beyond a spook, way beyond negative encounter, and I would hope the victim get a huge payday and the officers to lose their jobs. But..that wasn't the case either...though I wouldn't be surprised if it did happen in NYC...none the less they may have stayed calm but they were not enforcing the law, just their opinion, which makes it even a more negative encounter to me.

You don't get to take my cookie away now that you have given it to me!

Not real sure it was a GOOD idea to carry ANY firearm while THAT close to the president...Of course, since I personally find VERY FEW things that I agree with him on, I most likely wouldn't be that CLOSE to him in the FIRST place!!

huh? NYC? was the president in NYC at the time? Firearm? I thought we were talking about a knife...............you lost me...

 

[Dekul34]

He was referring to my comment contrasting NY to my home state of AZ where a man was able to legally open carry an ar-15 at a speech given by President Obama.

 

[Tom Connolly]

As a former NY'er, including my time as a NYC paramedic, may I first ask some of you to stop ragging on a city that you've never visited. NY is one of the best, most exciting, most engaging cities in the world, so get over yourselves. As for the knife, Charlie did a nice job in stating that is was "seen". Our cops aren't paranoid, nor were they spooked, they have reasons to talk to someone if they can see the knife. I agree that this was a good experience; the officers were pleasant, didn't take up too much time, explained that it had to be out of site, and he signed a warning (which covers their hind ends in case he makes a complaint like some would), and everyone went on their way. How is that bad? Just because it wouldn't happen in your town means little, you don't live in NYC; our crime rate is such that little things like that do make a difference. The knife could ave been boosted by a pick pocket, the carrier could have been targeted by a gang member who takes it as a sign of disrespect, or a rent-a-cop working in a store could have certainly overreacted. This was not a big deal.

 

[Firefighterchen]

As a former NY'er, including my time as a NYC paramedic, may I first ask some of you to stop ragging on a city that you've never visited. NY is one of the best, most exciting, most engaging cities in the world, so get over yourselves. As for the knife, Charlie did a nice job in stating that is was "seen". Our cops aren't paranoid, nor were they spooked, they have reasons to talk to someone if they can see the knife. I agree that this was a good experience; the officers were pleasant, didn't take up too much time, explained that it had to be out of site, and he signed a warning (which covers their hind ends in case he makes a complaint like some would), and everyone went on their way. How is that bad? Just because it wouldn't happen in your town means little, you don't live in NYC; our crime rate is such that little things like that do make a difference. The knife could ave been boosted by a pick pocket, the carrier could have been targeted by a gang member who takes it as a sign of disrespect, or a rent-a-cop working in a store could have certainly overreacted. This was not a big deal.

Comparing our towns and NYC and saying either has little to do with each other is absurd. It definitely matters, as my town has brought me up to enjoy freedoms, such as carrying a pocket knife in my pocket with the pocket clip exposed like it was meant to be, and NYC has taught you to bend over. It is the fact that that would not happen in my town, that makes NYC so bad. If all towns acted like NYC, then yea it would not be a big deal.

You have lived in that city way to long to understand what freedom is. Sorry chap You did get one thing right, I have never been to NYC...nor will I ever go to NYC...ever...I'd rather enjoy the rest of the country where I can be an American proudly without a good chance of being sent to jail. May I ask...exactly what reason does the police have to question someone with a pocket knife? Bikenut put it nicely, in New York City you are presumed guilty until proven innocent. These "charlies" and your post really hammer the nail into that coffin.

So to answer your question, can we/I stop ragging on a city I have never visited, no I will not stop ragging on that ridiculous city. BC1 has opened my eyes to the rest of the State, and while it's not perfect, I get it. I make it clear to reference NYC and not NY.