Overkill!!?


Sparky1

New member
Been conceal carrying since the state of Illinois came to their senses a few years back. I always leave the house with my Glock 19 and spare magazine. If not that, I have a Sig P238 in my pocket. Lately I have been thinking of switching up to a Glock 29 (10mm), with a high speed/light weight cartridge (like Underwood perhaps). I see by this forum, that pistol(and that caliber) is not too popular. The weapon is the same size as my Glock 30, which I have never carried; stays home for use there. Anyway, is the 10mm just too much to be armed with? Also, would a court of law hold it against me for carrying such a "devastating" weapon?! You know, like the Rambo or Zombie Max stigma. Appreciate any conversation on this post; I want to get the Gen3 before it goes out of production. Actually it already is; have to settle for the 29 short frame issue.
 

bofh

Banned
I do carry my Glock 20 Gen 4 when in the woods with hot 10mm 200gr hardcast Underwood loads against four-legged predators. I also have 180gr Hornady XTP loads for two-legged predators. Now, the recoil of 10mm is stout. My first question would be, have you ever shot a warm or hot 10mm load?

Realize that 10mm gives you better performance at the price of higher recoil. This is why I carry my Glock 19 Gen 4 when on the street. I don't think the better performance is so much better that it justifies trading off speed.

As for your court of law statement. A justified self defense is a justified self defense and one that is not is not. If the caliber of 10mm comes up in court, that means your prosecutor has a weak case. Your lawyer will know what to do. 10mm is by far not a devastating caliber.

Any particular reason to go with the Gen 3 instead of the Gen 4?
 

Sparky1

New member
Thanks for the quick response. Actually no, I have not fired a 10mm. Seems like everyone tells me that if carrying one with weaker loads, may as well be going with .40 cal. though. I would be more than glad to take your advice (gives me an excuse to buy another Glock!). I do watch many videos on YouTube; hot loads in 10mm, and recoil does not seem terribly bad. How it would affect a follow up shot when in my hands, not sure. Regarding why the Gen3, guess its because I own four of them already and really like look and feel of them, Gen4 not so much. Thanks again.
 

jaenglish

New member
I carry a 10mm Glock 20 as my daily carry, usually. I am in a high-risk industry, and while the 10mm doesn't get a lot of love, I do think it's the perfect compromise between power and capacity. Yes, we all know a .44 magnum is more powerful, if you only need 6 rounds, but when you have to constantly think about the types of situations you normally only see in the movies, there really isn't anything that gives you that kind of power where you can carry 46 rounds comfortably. I usually have 2 extra mags in a paddle holster.

If you're used to the shorter grip and you're okay with the capacity, the Glock 29 should do just fine. I would definitely recommend you go rent and shoot one first. The first 10mm I ever shot was a friend's Colt Delta Elite, before I got the Glock, and I fell in love. It was exactly what I was looking for. I was planning on shelling out $1200 for one of my own. It is extremely heavy recoil, which does have an impact on accuracy. Think of it this way: The 10mm is to the 40 S&W what the .357 Magnum is to the .38 Special. The difference here is that automatics absorb some of the recoil with the action, so your accuracy doesn't quite suffer as much. A .40 S&W is basically a 10mm short. You won't get nearly the same power, but you need to decide what situations you anticipate getting caught in to decide if it's overkill.

I bought the Glock 20 almost on a whim, given that it had higher capacity and was on sale for less than half the price of the Colt. I have to tell you... this is one of the most accurate guns I've ever had. Despite the heavy recoil, I literally trust a Glock 10mm with my life. If you're going to go 10, considering price, frame options, capacity, and everything else, Glock is by far my first recommendation.

I would rent one at a shooting range before you buy to decide. Also, remember that a low-power 10mm is still going to be far more powerful than a .40S&W+P, and as far as penetration goes, 9mm is ballistically superior to almost every other (within reason, folks) round on the market. I'd recommend you read up on ballistics of various rounds. They are good for different things.

Also, and I guess this goes without saying, but a fully loaded 10mm is heavy. The Glock 29 would be much lighter than the 20, I imagine, but about the only way to carry it comfortably is in a Blackhawk SERPA paddle holster. That said, I can and do conceal that way, usually with a Hawaiian shirt or other loose article of clothing.

As for the legal aspect, I've never worried about it because of the risk involved in my job and my friends in local law enforcement, but I also wouldn't worry if I was, say, out at the movies or something. An attack on your choice of caliber and ammunition can also be easily diminished by, 'Well, I carry a Glock because that's what the police use...' (standard disclaimer: consult an attorney before saying anything in court, of course).

My usual advice in this situation, if you really can't decide, is to go ahead and buy the gun. If you decide later that you hate it, you can always sell or trade it for something else. Yes, there is a lot of backlash against 10mm, which I really don't understand. It's not the end-all be-all of ammunition. It has specific uses. But while not 'rare' they are rare enough that someone out there will always want one, if you go to sell or trade it.
 

badchad250

New member
I'd be worried about beyond my target in a bad guy scenario. ....especially with hyped up rounds... to much pads thru like a .357 and probably next to nothing expansion ... not for me hollow points I'd consider...in 10mm

Sent from my SM-G360T1 using Tapatalk
 

bofh

Banned
I'd be worried about beyond my target in a bad guy scenario. ....especially with hyped up rounds... to much pads thru like a .357 and probably next to nothing expansion ... not for me hollow points I'd consider...in 10mm

Like what our President would say, WRONG! 10mm JHP ammunition has excellent ballistics. Think about this. You are shooting a .40 S&W JHP round with more speed. What happens? The additional speed causes faster expansion and slightly deeper penetration. Here is the round I carry on the street:


17 inches penetration, that is within FBI spec. The hotter 200 gr JHP Underwood round has more weight, a different JHP design and the extra speed that causes even faster expansion and slightly less penetration (16 inches).

jaenglish, I mostly agree with your post, except for the holster. I carry my Glock 20 in an Link Removed. It is extremely comfortable and easily concealable.
 

badchad250

New member
Like what our President would say, WRONG! 10mm JHP ammunition has excellent ballistics. Think about this. You are shooting a .40 S&W JHP round with more speed. What happens? The additional speed causes faster expansion and slightly deeper penetration. Here is the round I carry on the street:


17 inches penetration, that is within FBI spec. The hotter 200 gr JHP Underwood round has more weight, a different JHP design and the extra speed that causes even faster expansion and slightly less penetration (16 inches).

jaenglish, I mostly agree with your post, except for the holster. I carry my Glock 20 in an Link Removed. It is extremely comfortable and easily concealable.
Didn't know all that detail.... thanks for the info sir

Sent from my SM-G360T1 using Tapatalk
 

bofh

Banned
More information on 10mm rounds:

  • Comprehensive 10mm Ammunition Stats, including bullet type/manufacturer, powder being used, and tested speed and energy out of a Glock 20 with standard 4.75-inch and longer 6-inch barrel
  • tnoutdoors9 tested a number of 10mm rounds on his YouTube channel.
  • Reasonably priced warm 10mm FMJ loads can be found at LAX Ammo.
  • Hot 10mm FMJ, JHP and hardcast loads can be found at Underwood Ammo.
  • Always check the weight and muzzle velocity of 10mm ammunition you intent to buy. Many, well known manufacturers produce 10mm ammunition with only .40 S&W or slightly better loads.
  • Yes, you can shoot hardcast bullets through a Glock barrel if they are gas checked. Shoot them at a paper target to check if a round key holes, i.e., tumbles. Clean your barrel after shooting hardcast to remove the lead fouling.
  • Shooting hot loads through a Glock 20 reduces the life of the recoil spring assembly (RSA). Glock normally recommends to replace it every 3,000-4,000 rounds (Gen 1-3) or 5,000-7,500 rounds (Glock Gen 4). I usually get failure to feed and failure to extract malfunctions ("nose up" problem and stove pipe) with about 4,000 rounds throgh my Glock 20 Gen 4. That's why I asked the OP why he wanted to go Gen 3. The service interval for the Gen 3 RSA will be really short. But then, Gen 3 RSAs are only $8, while Gen 4 RSAs are $17.
  • If you get failure to feed malfunctions on a fresh RSA with heavy bullets, such as 220 gr, the bullet geometry is probably the culprit and you should not use it. Therefore, always test ammunition before buying in bulk.
  • There is no need to buy an aftermarket barrel. 10mm Glock barrels have enough case support to shoot hot loads and have enough play to ensure reliability. Aftermarket barrels are often tighter, causing all kinds of feeding problems.
Link Removed
 

HKS

New member
I would expect that the additional recoil of the 10x25 would slow you down for additional follow up shots.

I prefer the 45ACP which is an 11x23.

Collateral damage can also be worse with the 10x25.

I take my 45ACP with me wherever I go. And finding ammo for it is a breeze too.
 

HKS

New member
I started out with a 9x19 (S&W Model 59) and liked it very much.

Not long thereafter I graduated to a G/I issued 45ACP and have loved it ever since.

With JHP's the 9's are fine. But the 45ACP is much better.

And the 10's are probably slightly too much.
 

BigSlick

New member
I have a Gen 3 20 & 29. The recoil with the 29 is very stout with full power loads. I carry the 29 when on business trips. Around town on my person is a G43 but the 29 is always close by. The 20 stands guard duty in the house by the night stand.
 

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