Open Carry while shopping: Please take your gun outside

[Danmc]

I need to go to work now. Thanks for all responses. As for the troll accusations, you are entitled to your opinions as well. I am not trolling with my OP, not trying to stir the pot, simply have a real life situation and am going straight to the folks who I sometimes am required to approach...you... to get some feedback. Please keep posting so that I can send a copy of this thread to corporate. Hopefully I will continue to get some respectable comments as most have posted.

 

[Bighouse Doc]

My point in asking for the name is so that we can bring some pressure to bear on the management to reverse a stupid policy!

-Doc

 

[BRBruce]

In my opinion, the store needs to POST THE POLICY. I don't care whether or not the law requires it. POST IT.

It could be argued that the employer is putting you in a compromised position by forcing you to be unarmed, then forcing you to confront an armed customer. You could point out that if something were to happen to an employee in such a position, the employee would have very solid grounds for a lawsuit and workers comp claim. I bet THAT would get them to put the damn sign up!!

(I'm sure your attorney could phrase it better...but there ya have it.)

I think the law should require businesses to post their policy if they are anti-gun. That would give us a chance to decide if we want to shop there or not before we enter.

Anyone frightened of a man with a gun shopping for frozen pizza is an idiot. A gentleman with a holstered firearm shopping does not an active shooter make.

 

[Firefighterchen]

Its also one of those risks you run as an OCer. But certainly two sides to this. Store policy and the self righteous OCer. Too bad on all levels.

This is not a risk at all for an OC. At least for me, I do not think about this as being a "risk." More as figuring out which stores deserve my money or not.

Concealing you can keep giving your money away to stores that don't believe in your 2A. Specifically with this store...they can yell "surprise" we don't believe in your 2A and we are endorsing this anti-gun politician. Too bad on all levels.

 

[Flanmedic51]

Its also one of those risks you run as an OCer. But certainly two sides to this. Store policy and the self righteous OCer. Too bad on all levels.

This is not a risk at all for an OC. At least for me, I do not think about this as being a "risk." More as figuring out which stores deserve my money or not.

Concealing you can keep giving your money away to stores that don't believe in your 2A. Specifically with this store...they can yell "surprise" we don't believe in your 2A and we are endorsing this anti-gun politician. Too bad on all levels.

Well call it what you will. I say its a risk because people have been asked to leave. With CC, nobody knows and the CCer can remained armed unless there is a prohibition sign. But I'm not necessarily advocating for either just calling it the way I see it.

 

[Bikenut]

Well call it what you will. I say its a risk because people have been asked to leave. With CC, nobody knows and the CCer can remained armed unless there is a prohibition sign. But I'm not necessarily advocating for either just calling it the way I see it.

Personally I do not see being asked to leave a business as a "risk" of OC'ing. I am not afraid of being asked to leave nor am I afraid I might be embarrassed for I do not feel any need to hide my gun and sneak it in because I am not ashamed to carry a gun nor do I worry about being inconvenienced because standing up for the right to bear arms is worth being asked to leave and politely complying and a little inconvenience.

I also see being asked to leave or cover up as an opportunity to identify an anti gun business that I will then refuse to support their anti gun mentality with my money and I will spread the word to all and sundry not to support that business.

In my not very popular, certainly not politically correct, or minced words to save folk's feelings opinion... those who CC and say that if no one knows they are carrying a gun they won't be asked to leave and can continue to frequent a business are "anti gunner lites" because they support the anti gun business with their money... and I personally think the folks who do that are fair weather "convenience supporters" who are all for supporting the right to bear arms as long as they don't have to suffer any inconvenience along the way.

And I don't care if folks OC or CC... but it would be nice if folks would look past the method of carry and take a firm stand for the right to bear arms instead of putting convenience, or a feeling of "I'm gonna shop here and give you my money anyway because I've got a secret gun no one knows about so piss on your anti gun policy. Neener neener." before the right to bear arms.... because if we don't very very soon no one will be able to carry in any method what so ever....

 

[walt629]

You are correct crow...I say the dude is a troll!

If you're judging a person according to the number of postings, you're in trouble smartass! You got a whopping grand total of 11 posts. Must be a troll! Ooooh! Stop being so damned childish. If you have something positive to add do so but if you're going to be a Richard Cramium, don't bother.

 

[Axeanda45]

I think everyone so far (including the OP) has missed one of the most important aspects of this...
The store is NOT open to the general public.... It is a Private "membership" business.... I have argued in the past about this HUGE difference in types of Businesses... One is open to the public and has invited the PUBLIC onto its property, hence they get the "public" with all of their "rights" intact.... However, this is not the case in this situation.... A "customer" here has to JOIN.... and by "joining", do they not have to read and sign a "rules" or "customer/club member agreement"?

Right there is where the issue needs to be brought up... If I was a customer/member there, and the "agreement" I signed said nothing about firearms, I would be VERY pissed about someone later telling me it is against "policy" for me to be armed there...


So, That (the customer/club member agreement they signed) is how you should approach them.... IF it is in there, otherwise, your company MAY be setting themselves up for some "Breach of contract" lawsuits from some savvy members...


If the agreement does say something about no firearms, simply take one of the agreements like they signed and point it out to them.... (then duck, lol)

I work retail for a big box store(no not Wal-Mart)and one of the store's policies is no firearms allowed on the premises. Our store is a private membership business and the store is exempt from the laws of public accommodation. The store does not need to post signage, nor wants to clutter up the walls with signs that most people don't even read, all the store needs to do is make aware our policy, which is more often than not by direct personal contact.

 

[tuts40]

I suppose I would not have much to contribute to the original question as I CC, so I'd shop all day in the store and not get noticed...

 

[NavyLCDR]

Is there any good way for me to approach you concerning the matter? I want to respect your right, but I also want you to respect the store's right. Or put another way, why should you get mad at the store's right while wanting the store to respect yours?

Post the sign conspicuously at the entrances to your store that your store does not support the 2nd Amendment. That way we can make our decision before going into the store whether or not we want to spend our money there. If your store doesn't have the cahones to post their policy for us to see, then I don't appreciate wasting my time and yours because you don't. However, just tell me it is against store police to have my firearm there, I will mention that a sign would be nice, and leave to spend my money elsewhere that day.

The biggest thing that I appreciate, however, is just come up to me and tell me. Don't have 3 or 4 employees in tow, or cops, like I am some criminal because I lawfully wear a gun on my belt.

And don't wait until I am getting my change from the cashier and on the way out. Yes, been there, done that.

 

[Danmc]

I don't think there is anybody here who says that they do not participate in spending money with an "anti-gun" company, who has not in some manner spent money with an "anti-gun" company. Somewhere along the line with consumer goods of any kind, at least one business in that line certainly has a no firearms policy in place. You send your kids to school. You send and receive from the US Postal Service, UPS, FED-EX. You drive cars and trucks. You have televisions and computers. Furniture. You eat food. Somewhere along the line, a company involved in your life has a no firearms policy, and you still spend your money with them. So what I am hearing is that is ok as long as they don't ask YOU to not bring your gun in. But they have told an employee on up the line that they cannot bring their guns to work. Barring professions that use guns,how many OC'ers are allowed to take their guns to work? I am sure there are some, but probably many more who have to abide by the "rules". How many gun shows have you been to that do not allow you to bring your gun in? But yet you still pay an admission fee to get in and purchase products from the vendors. Lot's of hypocrisy. I doubt there are many people who believe in 2A who do not have something in their house or garage that was not made in China.

 

[Danmc]

Have a great night folks. Wife wants me to take her to the movie, and I will be CC because that's the way I roll.

 

[Bikenut]

I suppose I would not have much to contribute to the original question as I CC, so I'd shop all day in the store and not get noticed...

So you are willing to support an anti gun business and give them more money to open more stores where they can be... anti gun?

Is the convenience of shopping there more important than your right to bear arms?

By the way.. that "permit" is NOT the right to bear arms... it is the very worst kind of infringement that "shall not be infringed" is talking about because a "permit" is nothing more than "permission" granted by the government.

 

[walt629]

So you are willing to support an anti gun business and give them more money to open more stores where they can be... anti gun?

Is the convenience of shopping there more important than your right to bear arms?

By the way.. that "permit" is NOT the right to bear arms... it is the very worst kind of infringement that "shall not be infringed" is talking about because a "permit" is nothing more than "permission" granted by the government.

No argument on the concept of what you say, however, I ask you this: If there are not openly posted "NO GUN" signs and you are CCing and no one approaches you to remove yourself and your gun from the premises, how would you know that you were shopping at an "anti gun" establishment in the first place? I'm just asking...

 

[NavyLCDR]

I don't think there is anybody here who says that they do not participate in spending money with an "anti-gun" company, who has not in some manner spent money with an "anti-gun" company. Somewhere along the line with consumer goods of any kind, at least one business in that line certainly has a no firearms policy in place. You send your kids to school. You send and receive from the US Postal Service, UPS, FED-EX. You drive cars and trucks. You have televisions and computers. Furniture. You eat food. Somewhere along the line, a company involved in your life has a no firearms policy, and you still spend your money with them. So what I am hearing is that is ok as long as they don't ask YOU to not bring your gun in. But they have told an employee on up the line that they cannot bring their guns to work. Barring professions that use guns,how many OC'ers are allowed to take their guns to work? I am sure there are some, but probably many more who have to abide by the "rules". How many gun shows have you been to that do not allow you to bring your gun in? But yet you still pay an admission fee to get in and purchase products from the vendors. Lot's of hypocrisy. I doubt there are many people who believe in 2A who do not have something in their house or garage that was not made in China.

Nice deflection. All I am saying is if your company is going to prohibit firearms then have the balls to put a sign on the door and let people know that firearms are prohibited. That way you can notify those pesky people who hide their guns from you that they are prohibited as well. Or is it that you just don't want open carry in the store, but concealed is OK. Like a piece of clothing over the gun is going to change anything in regards to the person possessing the firearm.

 

[Firefighterchen]

So you are willing to support an anti gun business and give them more money to open more stores where they can be... anti gun?

Is the convenience of shopping there more important than your right to bear arms?

By the way.. that "permit" is NOT the right to bear arms... it is the very worst kind of infringement that "shall not be infringed" is talking about because a "permit" is nothing more than "permission" granted by the government.

No argument on the concept of what you say, however, I ask you this: If there are not openly posted "NO GUN" signs and you are CCing and no one approaches you to remove yourself and your gun from the premises, how would you know that you were shopping at an "anti gun" establishment in the first place? I'm just asking...

You wouldn't, but whether you know it or not, that doesn't change the fact it still strengthens an antigun establishment when you spend money there. To me, that's even more risky than being asked to leave.

 

[wooddoctor]

Grendel....go back to your cave or the Beowulf will take you out!

 

[NotTwoShure]

I do not have an issue with a store employee informing me of the policy. I do ask if we may CCW in your store, not sure of the state you may be in, but, in some states the law is quite explicit as to the owner's obligation to inform of restrictions. I have only been open carry in a few stores, I do not see the issue of open carry if one has the permit. In Arizona we have a very good law stating anyone other than a prohibited possessor my CCW with out a permit. Noted is the fact that it should be understood of the restrictions place not by the state buy by the Feds. I really have an issue with folks that would complain about a polite request to take the weapon outside.

 

[Wyldekard]

Danmc,

A while back somebody posted a link to two pdf files to make a "business" type card with a front and a back side.

The front has a no weapons symbol, a "no money" symbol, and says you've lost my business today and in the future.

The back says this:

You have chosen to ban firearms in your store. As such, I have chosen
to take my gun, and my money, to your competitors until such time as
you choose to allow law-abiding armed citizens in your establishment..
Citizens are legally allowed to carry firearms openly or concealed (with a
valid license) to protect themselves and their families in case someone else
threatens to harm them.
By prohibiting all weapons, you have disarmed and made helpless anyone
who enters your store—except for criminals, who won’t follow your policy
anyway. In essence, you’ve made your store more dangerous for patrons
who carry legally...and safer for criminals.
Please consider changing your policy. There may come a time when an
armed, law-abiding citizen stands between you and an armed criminal.

Do a search, download the files, and print some out. When you have to confront someone, give them the "card" and the address of the corporate office to send it to. This should let them direct their frustrations at the people who make the policy, not you. Plus if enough are sent in, the policy might be changed and you won't have to deal with the problem anymore.

 

[SGB]