Debray
New member
Guys I need a little help, Adam Kokesh plans on marching on Washington DC with loaded rifles, and our Steubenville For Liberty Group has been asked to send letters and support the effort.
I am worried it may cause more harm than good, Wayne and I have be debating the issue.
Our current Congressman Bill Johnson (mule skinner) has fell into the Government Elite status and we hope to have Dr. Donald Allen ( editor of the letter) run against him in the Primaries next election.
Good Idea or Bad Idea?
Your thoughts, Please.
**********
Chuck,
I initially agreed completely with you when I heard his plans and thought, I wish Adam would re-think this as this is over the top. However, I listened to his interview with Alex Jones and came to believe that he is right- at least in principle- that we have so let our rights slip from us that we are conditioned to believe what our enemies say to and about us- that we really are not responsible enough to manage or carry loaded weapons. But consider, Adam was a Marine Sergeant in Iraq and that was a much more dangerous place, and not only Iraq, but Fallujah. He and his team went door to door kicking in peoples front door and evacuating them from their own houses. He managed not to shoot people indiscriminately or to harm with friendly fire any of his comrades just as the vast majority of the fellow soldiers with him.
He stated that the 2,500 men and women who have volunteered to date are also veterans and he will personally inspect and take his group as if he were on any mission. Also, consider, that we trust policemen and national guard personnel to amass regularly with loaded weapons and they manage to behave themselves. Open carry constitutionally has been upheld in all 50 states as dictated by the plain English of the second amendment to the constitution. Should the police in Washington agree to work and have an escort along the route, I see minimum danger and a powerful statement that the law- the constitution applies to ALL citizens of the USA- not just some. We have come to accept this "Pre-Crime" mentality of passing laws which is dead wrong. People should only be punished for committing a crime. I know that sounds like closing the barn door after the fact but really, do you for once think any elected official is in danger in Washington D.C, by allowing respectable law abiding citizens to openly carry?
No, the danger comes from those with bad intent who conceal a gun in their pants and commit crimes regardless of laws. There are tunnels under the grounds between the White House and Congress and all over, no elected official has to walk the streets and in fact, the only politician I have seen walking the streets and pressing flesh have been Ron Paul and Jim Demint. Jim Demint during the Tea Party rally of 2 million back in 2009 and I actually shook his hand.
Much in life is symbolic, and this whole thing is symbolic and I believe we should support the law- the real law which states very plainly: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to bear Arms shall not be infringed" That is why more for concern about Adam and his followers than the officials or the police, I have started a campaign to try and shame the police chief into politely allowing a group to pass through with a sufficient escort to provide them safety because knowing Adam since 2007, and listening to him, he is adamant, but a reasonable and an honorable man. Any threat that exists would come from the police or hecklers and not from them. Sadly, Adam and Jefferson, and Patrick Henry and a host of others like them are right, unless one stands his ground, the line will just keep getting moved further and further until one day, we will be in a corner with one option and that will be surrender. Once again, as Ronald Reagan once said: "If not now, then when? If not us, then whom". Right now while I will not be participating, I will lend Adam and his well regulated militia my prayers and any pressure on public officials I might be able to offer for their safety and the restoration of our republic.
I would urge everyone to send their own- or copy my own letter to the police chief in Washington D.C. and ask her to stand up for the law she plans on violating based on the U.S. Constitution, which clearly states: "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED":
******************
Good Morning Wayne,
Great letter and it proves Dr. Allen would be an improvement over what we have now in Congress with go along to get along Johnson.
On the other hand.
Showing up with a thousand (or even a few hundred) people openly carrying loaded weapons and marching toward the Capitol is not a good idea. There is no one more concerned with our loss of Liberty and preserving the Second Amendment than I.
This will do nothing but fuel the fire for the Communist Left.
Remember we didn't march on the British, they marched on Us.
"Stand your ground. Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here."
Please Join Steubenville For Liberty STEUBENVILLE for LIBERTY (Steubenville, OH) - Meetup
Next meeting May 23rd. Speaker Joseph Brom (THE MORAL IMPORTANCE OF GOLD AS MONEY)
Take Care
Chuck
**********************
----- Original Message -----
From: W Herrod
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 9:48 PM
Subject: Re: Draft of letter to Washington Police Chief before the July 4th March of Adam Kokesh
Donald Allen, our choice for candidate to run against the Mule Skinner did some editing for me, and this will likely be the final draft, feel free to sign mine or pass it along to others we need to deluge this lady with like minded letters, Wayne
******************
Hi Wayne,
I did a quick edit and spellcheck.
Don
Dear Police Chief __________
I saw your statement and You Tube video in the news, and you should be ashamed of yourself, claiming that you will break the law and arrest citizens that enter your town. While I only held the lowly rank of Seaman in the U.S. Coast Guard, I am sure that we both swore an allegiance to the same Constitution, and while I am not claiming sainthood as an individual, I at least know that taking a sacred oath is more than just a pocket full of mumbles to get a job.
One wonders if you are truly a tyrant or just ignorant of the law you claim to uphold? Had you looked into that document that you swore to uphold against all enemies foreign and domestic, you would have noticed that towards the end, there were a series of ten amendments that the writers inserted just to make it plain that man had certain unalienable rights granted by Nature and Nature's God.
While the 9th and 10th Amendments specifically state that the list does not exhaust all rights but for brevity sake, just the most basic were enumerated. But let us take them one at a time. Any 3rd-grade lawyer or judge would know that when stating rights or claims, the first listed are deemed the most important. The 1st Amendment then states that government shall not bully or mandate, nor interfere with a person's divine view of belief in a God or religion, that a man is free to express himself with words spoken or written or otherwise made symbolically to make his case known to others and to further clarify this, that no law or impediment is to be made by Congress (later backed up to apply to all state republican governments) to prevent a person from protesting or "addressing grievances" against that government – this dates back to the Magna Carta.
You are clearly threatening at least two parts of the 1st Amendment in making threats of violence and restraint against Mr. Adam Kokesh and his followers as he has plainly and publicly stated that he has a grievance and not just a light and transient one.
Further, it was written by the Founders after having fought a war against your type of arrogance and tyranny that in order to protect a free society it was necessary for the people to be able to not only arm themselves but to organize community, local and state militias. Further, all that aside, there was to be NO abridgment of the right of the people to bear arms. You are enforcing an unconstitutional law and as our third and fourth Presidents stated, any law passed contravening the Constitution and its protection of citizen rights is null and void and of no force – check the Kentucky (Jefferson) and Virginia (Madison) resolutions of 1798. You are the one breaking the law, not Mr. Kokesh et. al. You should stand down and apologize and to make that apology good, offer a respectful and professional escort to prevent any left wing whacko that might attack them from doing so. Should you do this, I am sure that you will go down in history as a beloved and wise police chief, but also guarantee that no law abiding citizen gets hurt.
We the undersigned do humbly ask you to think about your role as a "peace officer" and do the right thing – not lead us down the road of tyranny where the police are just viewed as the tools of the elite who wish to impose their power over the Liberty of the very people whose government this is: the people who vest you with power and pay your wages
Sincerely,
(You might add this quote
"Stand your ground. Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here."
Captain John Parker, April 19, 1775, Lexington, MA.
I am worried it may cause more harm than good, Wayne and I have be debating the issue.
Our current Congressman Bill Johnson (mule skinner) has fell into the Government Elite status and we hope to have Dr. Donald Allen ( editor of the letter) run against him in the Primaries next election.
Good Idea or Bad Idea?
Your thoughts, Please.
**********
Chuck,
I initially agreed completely with you when I heard his plans and thought, I wish Adam would re-think this as this is over the top. However, I listened to his interview with Alex Jones and came to believe that he is right- at least in principle- that we have so let our rights slip from us that we are conditioned to believe what our enemies say to and about us- that we really are not responsible enough to manage or carry loaded weapons. But consider, Adam was a Marine Sergeant in Iraq and that was a much more dangerous place, and not only Iraq, but Fallujah. He and his team went door to door kicking in peoples front door and evacuating them from their own houses. He managed not to shoot people indiscriminately or to harm with friendly fire any of his comrades just as the vast majority of the fellow soldiers with him.
He stated that the 2,500 men and women who have volunteered to date are also veterans and he will personally inspect and take his group as if he were on any mission. Also, consider, that we trust policemen and national guard personnel to amass regularly with loaded weapons and they manage to behave themselves. Open carry constitutionally has been upheld in all 50 states as dictated by the plain English of the second amendment to the constitution. Should the police in Washington agree to work and have an escort along the route, I see minimum danger and a powerful statement that the law- the constitution applies to ALL citizens of the USA- not just some. We have come to accept this "Pre-Crime" mentality of passing laws which is dead wrong. People should only be punished for committing a crime. I know that sounds like closing the barn door after the fact but really, do you for once think any elected official is in danger in Washington D.C, by allowing respectable law abiding citizens to openly carry?
No, the danger comes from those with bad intent who conceal a gun in their pants and commit crimes regardless of laws. There are tunnels under the grounds between the White House and Congress and all over, no elected official has to walk the streets and in fact, the only politician I have seen walking the streets and pressing flesh have been Ron Paul and Jim Demint. Jim Demint during the Tea Party rally of 2 million back in 2009 and I actually shook his hand.
Much in life is symbolic, and this whole thing is symbolic and I believe we should support the law- the real law which states very plainly: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to bear Arms shall not be infringed" That is why more for concern about Adam and his followers than the officials or the police, I have started a campaign to try and shame the police chief into politely allowing a group to pass through with a sufficient escort to provide them safety because knowing Adam since 2007, and listening to him, he is adamant, but a reasonable and an honorable man. Any threat that exists would come from the police or hecklers and not from them. Sadly, Adam and Jefferson, and Patrick Henry and a host of others like them are right, unless one stands his ground, the line will just keep getting moved further and further until one day, we will be in a corner with one option and that will be surrender. Once again, as Ronald Reagan once said: "If not now, then when? If not us, then whom". Right now while I will not be participating, I will lend Adam and his well regulated militia my prayers and any pressure on public officials I might be able to offer for their safety and the restoration of our republic.
I would urge everyone to send their own- or copy my own letter to the police chief in Washington D.C. and ask her to stand up for the law she plans on violating based on the U.S. Constitution, which clearly states: "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED":
******************
Good Morning Wayne,
Great letter and it proves Dr. Allen would be an improvement over what we have now in Congress with go along to get along Johnson.
On the other hand.
Showing up with a thousand (or even a few hundred) people openly carrying loaded weapons and marching toward the Capitol is not a good idea. There is no one more concerned with our loss of Liberty and preserving the Second Amendment than I.
This will do nothing but fuel the fire for the Communist Left.
Remember we didn't march on the British, they marched on Us.
"Stand your ground. Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here."
Please Join Steubenville For Liberty STEUBENVILLE for LIBERTY (Steubenville, OH) - Meetup
Next meeting May 23rd. Speaker Joseph Brom (THE MORAL IMPORTANCE OF GOLD AS MONEY)
Take Care
Chuck
**********************
----- Original Message -----
From: W Herrod
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 9:48 PM
Subject: Re: Draft of letter to Washington Police Chief before the July 4th March of Adam Kokesh
Donald Allen, our choice for candidate to run against the Mule Skinner did some editing for me, and this will likely be the final draft, feel free to sign mine or pass it along to others we need to deluge this lady with like minded letters, Wayne
******************
Hi Wayne,
I did a quick edit and spellcheck.
Don
Dear Police Chief __________
I saw your statement and You Tube video in the news, and you should be ashamed of yourself, claiming that you will break the law and arrest citizens that enter your town. While I only held the lowly rank of Seaman in the U.S. Coast Guard, I am sure that we both swore an allegiance to the same Constitution, and while I am not claiming sainthood as an individual, I at least know that taking a sacred oath is more than just a pocket full of mumbles to get a job.
One wonders if you are truly a tyrant or just ignorant of the law you claim to uphold? Had you looked into that document that you swore to uphold against all enemies foreign and domestic, you would have noticed that towards the end, there were a series of ten amendments that the writers inserted just to make it plain that man had certain unalienable rights granted by Nature and Nature's God.
While the 9th and 10th Amendments specifically state that the list does not exhaust all rights but for brevity sake, just the most basic were enumerated. But let us take them one at a time. Any 3rd-grade lawyer or judge would know that when stating rights or claims, the first listed are deemed the most important. The 1st Amendment then states that government shall not bully or mandate, nor interfere with a person's divine view of belief in a God or religion, that a man is free to express himself with words spoken or written or otherwise made symbolically to make his case known to others and to further clarify this, that no law or impediment is to be made by Congress (later backed up to apply to all state republican governments) to prevent a person from protesting or "addressing grievances" against that government – this dates back to the Magna Carta.
You are clearly threatening at least two parts of the 1st Amendment in making threats of violence and restraint against Mr. Adam Kokesh and his followers as he has plainly and publicly stated that he has a grievance and not just a light and transient one.
Further, it was written by the Founders after having fought a war against your type of arrogance and tyranny that in order to protect a free society it was necessary for the people to be able to not only arm themselves but to organize community, local and state militias. Further, all that aside, there was to be NO abridgment of the right of the people to bear arms. You are enforcing an unconstitutional law and as our third and fourth Presidents stated, any law passed contravening the Constitution and its protection of citizen rights is null and void and of no force – check the Kentucky (Jefferson) and Virginia (Madison) resolutions of 1798. You are the one breaking the law, not Mr. Kokesh et. al. You should stand down and apologize and to make that apology good, offer a respectful and professional escort to prevent any left wing whacko that might attack them from doing so. Should you do this, I am sure that you will go down in history as a beloved and wise police chief, but also guarantee that no law abiding citizen gets hurt.
We the undersigned do humbly ask you to think about your role as a "peace officer" and do the right thing – not lead us down the road of tyranny where the police are just viewed as the tools of the elite who wish to impose their power over the Liberty of the very people whose government this is: the people who vest you with power and pay your wages
Sincerely,
(You might add this quote
"Stand your ground. Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here."
Captain John Parker, April 19, 1775, Lexington, MA.
