Michigan domestic violence & carry laws

M

Ms. Jerri

New member
:wacko:My date & I were visiting Travers City, Michigan over the holidays. I had my .38 (registered to my ex-husband) in a suitcase with the bullets in completely seperate suitcase. My date began assaulting me and the hotel called the police. They took him to jail for domestic violence so he told them about the gun. It had not been taken out of the suitcase since I left Texas and was not involved in anyway in the episode. They said they wanted to check out the registration and that I should be able to pick it up before I left for Texas(yeah, on Christmas Eve! Not!). NOW, they pretty much tell me I can't have it back and should be glad they didn't haul me for illegally possessing a handgun. SSSOOOO.....I get beat up. Sent back to Texas to deal with an angry stalker ex-boyfriend and no protection for my small children and I. Is this legal???? I wasn't charged with anything and would really like the gun returned.
Anyone familiar with Traverse City, Michigan gun laws???
 
Ms. Jerri said:
:wacko:My date & I were visiting Travers City, Michigan over the holidays. I had my .38 (registered to my ex-husband) in a suitcase with the bullets in completely seperate suitcase. My date began assaulting me and the hotel called the police. They took him to jail for domestic violence so he told them about the gun. It had not been taken out of the suitcase since I left Texas and was not involved in anyway in the episode. They said they wanted to check out the registration and that I should be able to pick it up before I left for Texas(yeah, on Christmas Eve! Not!). NOW, they pretty much tell me I can't have it back and should be glad they didn't haul me for illegally possessing a handgun. SSSOOOO.....I get beat up. Sent back to Texas to deal with an angry stalker ex-boyfriend and no protection for my small children and I. Is this legal???? I wasn't charged with anything and would really like the gun returned.
Anyone familiar with Traverse City, Michigan gun laws???
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Because we have pre-emption, local gov't can't have any gun laws stronger than the state. But I would suggest contacting a lawyer. I don't know if Travers City is in his area or not, but you could probably at least get some advice from James Simmons, at 586-566-1900. He could give you better advice as to whether or not you have a chance to get your gun back.
 
I agree with the above poster. Sounds like a question for a lawyer. And I wouldn't be giving too much details on the forum about the incident until it is resolved.
In the mean time I'd be searching for a private transaction purchase so you aren't "naked" so to speak until it is resolved.




I hope this means there won't be a second date?
 
Big Gay Al said:
Because we have pre-emption, local gov't can't have any gun laws stronger than the state. But I would suggest contacting a lawyer. I don't know if Travers City is in his area or not, but you could probably at least get some advice from James Simmons, at 586-566-1900. He could give you better advice as to whether or not you have a chance to get your gun back.
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I have to echo Al & Ruger... SEEK Legal assistance. Good Luck
 
Maybe some on is listening.
Ariz. Senate Panel Approves Concealed Weapons Bill
Updated: Tuesday, 02 Feb 2010, 8:32 AM MST
Published : Tuesday, 02 Feb 2010, 7:06 AM MST

An Arizona Senate committee has approved a bill that would allow people to carry a concealed weapon without a permit.

The Senate Judiciary Committee approved the measure Monday on a 4-3 party-line vote.

Mesa Republican Sen. Russell Pearce is sponsoring the measure.

He says it is designed to preserve constitutional rights and to reduce legal barriers preventing law-abiding citizens from protecting themselves.

Opponents worry it would lead to more violence.

Arizona Association of Chiefs of Police lobbyist John Thomas says the measure would "take Arizona back into Wild-West carry with no consideration for officer safety."

It now goes to the full Senate after a legal review. A House committee is scheduled to hear a similar bill Wednesday
 
rsdonb said:
Opponents worry it would lead to more violence.
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Why should it? Arizona is a true concealed weapons State already! If there were going to be a problem with citizens carrying weapons, I'm sure it would have materialized by now.
More anti-Constitutional alarmist Bull Poop.
 
If you had a Texas permit you would have been good in Michigan too. And with a Texas carry permit you would be able to buy another handgun in Texas, bypassing the NICS check. So, get yourself a ccw for Texas. It's good in 31 other states.
 
Arizona Association of Chiefs of Police lobbyist John Thomas says the measure would "take Arizona back into Wild-West carry with no consideration for officer safety."
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I see this line of the "wild-west" trotted out from time to time. Yet, I have never seen any state that has turned into the image of the lawless, guns-blazing, vigilante-driven condition that the "wild-west" implies due to changes of the concealed carry laws for that state.

Personally, I would think it would be beneficial to the officers to have more citizens that would be able to help in a dire situation. There are far more good guys out there than bad guys.
 
I would say the reason you did'nt get the gun back was bacause you were in possesion of a gun that wa not registered to you. just from what I know to posses a gun that is not yours you have to have a purchase permit. I guess this makes it leagle to have an unregistered gun but they are only good for 10 days. That being said I agree with the seeking leagle advise from a lawyer.
 
I haven't actually looked at Michigan codes, but if the previous poster is correct, then your probably screwed.

Now if you had been traveling to Kentucky, you wouldn't have had a problem as long as the suitcase had a lock. No gun registration and it would have fell under the federal law protecting interstate travel with a handgun since it would have been unloaded and in a locked container.
 
Unfettered Might said:
I haven't actually looked at Michigan codes, but if the previous poster is correct, then your probably screwed.

Now if you had been traveling to Kentucky, you wouldn't have had a problem as long as the suitcase had a lock. No gun registration and it would have fell under the federal law protecting interstate travel with a handgun since it would have been unloaded and in a locked container.
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Maybe, maybe not. The OP is not a Michigan resident, so our registration laws would/should not apply to her. But again, I'm not a lawyer, and she should at least talk to one who knows, and get their opinion.
 
In Michigan, a person "shall not purchase, carry, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol," as prescribed in MCL 28.422.

I took the above off the Michigan State Police site.

I am not an attorney but it is my understanding that "pistol in possession"; the possessor must either have a valid purchase permit (I don't know if one from another state would suffice) or a CPL from a reciprocity state. Since the gun was registered to another person and Ms. Jerri was the possessor, MI law states she must have one or the other. I don't believe that she'll be getting the gun back unless one of the two apply to her personally.
 
I live in Traverse City, been around the law enforcement community for 25 years in this area. Not knowing the rest of the story and taking the circumstances at face value, I would seek legal council. Officers can make errors, paperwork and work flow can get messed up especially over the hollidays due to vacations and shortages of personnel, police are people too. Did you call them? If so and still had no resolution, that is why we keep attorneys in business.
 
MI .45 said:
In Michigan, a person "shall not purchase, carry, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol," as prescribed in MCL 28.422.

I took the above off the Michigan State Police site.

I am not an attorney but it is my understanding that "pistol in possession"; the possessor must either have a valid purchase permit (I don't know if one from another state would suffice) or a CPL from a reciprocity state. Since the gun was registered to another person and Ms. Jerri was the possessor, MI law states she must have one or the other. I don't believe that she'll be getting the gun back unless one of the two apply to her personally.
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I'm pretty sure the stuff from MCL 28.422 generally applies MOSTLY to residents of Michigan. And as apparently, Texas has no registration laws, I also believe the OP was referring to the form her ex filled out when he bought the firearm.

However, having said that, I do believe she should have had a Texas CHL, in order to lawfully possess the firearm, while in Michigan. But, that's only a guess on my part. She should still consult with a Michigan based attorney who can give her the best advice.
 
I'm no attorney, and you should consult one, but...

Ms Jerri: If you observed the law in transporting the handgun, and have a valid TX CCW, a cursory review of the laws suggests you should have been legal in MI. Carry, possession, loaded or unloaded should have been covered. You can look up the statutes yourself, at:
Michigan Legislature - Basic MCL Search

If you do not have a carry permit for TX, the waters are certainly muddied. However, you were not carrying a concealed weapon, it would appear, so possession would appear to be the question. "Registration" is not allowed in the US, and guns can be given or sold privately, so long as the recipient is legally able to have possession. Assuming you hadn't stolen the pistol from your ex, and you were otherwise legally entitled to possess the handgun in TX, you'd need to look at statutes from MI to see how they apply to you. Below is an excerpt from 28.422 that seems to apply:
(8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:

(a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.

(b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).

(c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.

(d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.

(e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state.

(9) An individual who is a nonresident of this state shall present the license described in subsection (8)(a) upon the demand of a police officer. An individual who violates this subsection is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.

Good luck. Either way, legal or not, you'll have to have an attorney intervene now to get your pistol back, and having it shipped home will be another exercise in adminsitrative process and expense.
 
Longhairwitha357 said:
I would say the reason you did'nt get the gun back was bacause you were in possesion of a gun that wa not registered to you. just from what I know to posses a gun that is not yours you have to have a purchase permit. I guess this makes it leagle to have an unregistered gun but they are only good for 10 days. That being said I agree with the seeking leagle advise from a lawyer.
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That's interesting except that many states don't "register" a handgun. They will do a background check (maybe not if you have a carry permit) but have no "registration" that the state keeps. The dealer keeps the Federal forms on hand but the state has no copy. Now some states (Kalifornia as one) do have handguns registered but I'm pretty sure that Idaho, as an example, does not.

All law enforcement can check for is if the gun serial number has been reported as stolen.

I wonder if the lawyer cost, particularly if he would have to file suit would not be more than the cost of a new gun? A better solution might be to contact the Second Amendment Foundation, Gun Owners of America, and/or NRA-ILA and see if it's possible to get them to put legal pressure on the town.
 
MI

Longhairwitha357 said:
I would say the reason you did'nt get the gun back was bacause you were in possesion of a gun that wa not registered to you. just from what I know to posses a gun that is not yours you have to have a purchase permit. I guess this makes it leagle to have an unregistered gun but they are only good for 10 days. That being said I agree with the seeking leagle advise from a lawyer.
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He is right on about that. You CCL carriers in MI are breaking the law if the handgun is not registerd in your namePeaceful
 
Peacefulpatton said:
He is right on about that. You CCL carriers in MI are breaking the law if the handgun is not registerd in your namePeaceful
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What is this "registration"? If I buy a handgun in Idaho, there is no "registration". In Kalifornia, yeah, handguns are registered. Was this handgun really "registered"?
 
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