Is OBAMA the ANTICHRIST? - 12 of 19 characteristics are met!

[Alaska444]

One other point to note after looking over the short synopsis on the Rosenthal theory:

According to the Prewrath perspective, the great tribulation begins 3.5 years after the Antichrist "makes a covenant with the many" (Daniel 9:27), in the middle of "Daniel's 70th week." The 70th week is a reference to Daniel 9:24, where each day of the week corresponds to a year (for a total of seven years). After the first 3.5 years, the Antichrist will make himself known with the abomination that causes desolation, and he will reign for 3.5 years (42 months or 1260 days). The latter half of the 3.5 years is characterized by the Antichrist deceiving the world and persecuting the church.

Revelation Chapter 12 deals with Satan and what he does in the Tribulation, but it is against the Woman with the sun and the moon and the 12 stars:

1And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

2And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

4And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and [to] his throne.

6And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days. . .

13And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man [child].

14And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

15And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

16And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

17And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Once again, we find another reference to the Rapture with the child of the woman caught up to heaven and then the dragon persecutes the woman, NOT the church.

 

[HK4U]

I feel that there are a lot of scriptures that those on either side of the debate could make a case for their belief. that is why when all is said and done I agree with what Mom said and the is the "Pan theory". I say that because I think all to often Christians get all bent our of shape arguing with each other over this issue and it can leave a bad witness to the lost. I may lean toward a post or at least mid trib time frame but our salvation does not hinge on which view one has on this issue. The only difference is because I do think we will be here for a part of it that causes me to take a look at how I am going to prepare where as if I don't think I will be here then I might not do any preparation. Scripture says that no man can buy or sell unless he has the mark, number or name of the beast. It says "let he who hath understand count the number of the beast" which to me means do something to prepare for that time. i.e. Storing up certain items, learning to barter and becoming more self sufficient. Anyway as I have said I am not going to let a difference of opinion on the issue become a bone of contention between me and other believers.

 

[Alaska444]

The Restrainer is the Holy Spirit indwelling every true believer. When "He is taken out of the way" (HE/Restrainer), the true church,which includes every true believer,will go with Him. Paul said, "don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day (Day of the Lord) will not come, and the man of lawlessness revealed, until He who retrains is taken out of the way." Not only is the Restrainer being removed a reference to the Rapture, but also the Day of the Lord is reference to the Rapture. Paul says, "For you yourselves know perfectly that the Day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night". Paul calls the coming of the Lord, which is the Rapture, "the Day of the Lord", and begins the time period (short time period after the Rapture preceding the 7 yr. Tribulation) known as the day of the Lord. Because the Restrainer is the true believing Spirit filled Church, and the anti-Christ cannot be REVEALED until the Restrainer is removed (taken out of the way), it is crystal clear that Christians will not see the anti-Christ. To say otherwise is to call God a liar, is it not? leasantry:

I agree that the Holy Spirit is the Restrainer. Take a look at the duties of the "Comforter" who is the Holy Spirit from John:

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

8And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

9Of sin, because they believe not on me;

10Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

11Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

12I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

13Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Look at the definition of Reprove, it speaks loudly as to who is the restrainer:

Main Entry: re·prove
Pronunciation: ri-'prüv
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): re·proved; re·prov·ing
Etymology: Middle English repreven, reproven, from Anglo-French reprover, from Late Latin reprobare to disapprove, condemn, from Latin re- + probare to test, approve -- more at PROVE
transitive verb
1 : to scold or correct usually gently or with kindly intent
2 : to express disapproval of : CENSURE <it is not for me to reprove popular taste -- D. W. Brogan>
3 obsolete : DISPROVE, REFUTE
4 obsolete : CONVINCE, CONVICT
intransitive verb : to express rebuke or reproof
- re·prov·er noun
- re·prov·ing·ly /-'prü-vi[ng]-lE/ adverb
synonyms REPROVE, REBUKE, REPRIMAND, ADMONISH, REPROACH, CHIDE mean to criticize adversely. REPROVE implies an often kindly intent to correct a fault <gently reproved my table manners>. REBUKE suggests a sharp or stern reproof <the papal letter rebuked dissenting clerics>. REPRIMAND implies a severe, formal, often public or official rebuke <reprimanded by the ethics committee>. ADMONISH suggests earnest or friendly warning and counsel <admonished by my parents to control expenses>. REPROACH and CHIDE suggest displeasure or disappointment expressed in mild reproof or scolding <reproached him for tardiness> <chided by their mother for untidiness>.

Link Removed

Since the Holy Spirit is taken up away, and since the Holy Spirit resides within the born again believers, what then of the believers? They are taken up in the Rapture and THEN the Antichrist is revealed, the man of sin. One of the duties of the Holy Spirit is to reprove the world and constrain and restrain evil until the time of Jacob's trouble. The restrainer is removed before the Antichrist is revealed which correlates to Revelation 6:1 and the first seal, not the sixth.

 

[Alaska444]

I feel that there are a lot of scriptures that those on either side of the debate could make a case for their belief. that is why when all is said and done I agree with what Mom said and the is the "Pan theory". I say that because I think all to often Christians get all bent our of shape arguing with each other over this issue and it can leave a bad witness to the lost. I may lean toward a post or at least mid trib time frame but our salvation does not hinge on which view one has on this issue. The only difference is because I do think we will be here for a part of it that causes me to take a look at how I am going to prepare where as if I don't think I will be here then I might not do any preparation. Scripture says that no man can buy or sell unless he has the mark, number or name of the beast. It says "let he who hath understand count the number of the beast" which to me means do something to prepare for that time. i.e. Storing up certain items, learning to barter and becoming more self sufficient. Anyway as I have said I am not going to let a difference of opinion on the issue become a bone of contention between me and other believers.

Dear HK, not trying to be contentious, just relating my own personal journey and studies of the rapture. Of a truth, the beginning of sorrows is a time that the Christian believer's will not be excluded and we do need to prepare, but I believe the spiritual preparation will be much more important than that of the worldly things, which are important in their own right, but not as much as the spiritual applications. Take a look at the last warning to those of us living in the last Laodicean church age:

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

We need to be looking to our Lord and Saviour to be rich in the Spirit and have His righteousness and to be doing the work of the Lord as we patiently await His return.

Matthew 24:42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed [is] that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49And shall begin to smite [his] fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for [him], and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint [him] his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

I am under no false pretense that my guns will save me in the day they come looking for us, nor shall the food or money we save do anything but prompt them to take it from us. My trust is not in Mr Ruger or any other gun maker, it is in Jesus and Him alone. That is what we need to begin preparing for spiritually so that that day does not catch us unaware.

 

[festus]

Obama may not be the anti-christ...

But he sure as HELL is Satan's little helper.
Abortion...check
guncontrol...check
dissolution of free speech...check
corruption...check
unreasonable taxes...check

 

[Ringo]

The Holy Spirit is one interpretation of what is meant by he will let until he be taken out of the way however it does not specifically say Holy Spirit. I will agree with you that it is clear that Christians will be taken out before the trib is "one view" however I do not agree that it is clear that it is the correct one.

Link Removed

Do you believe in the Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit? Each is a distinct person, 3 in 1. Only God could be the restraining force against evil and the evil one, therefore HE (GOD in the third person of the Holy Trinity, the Holy Spirit) is taken out of the way. God himself isn't taken out of the way, neither is it Jesus. It IS CLEAR that HE is the Holy Spirit, for once again, "Only God could be the Restraining force against evil & the evil one". There is only ONE TRUTH. If not the Holy Spirit, then whom do you say that He that restrains IS? Remember also that in the beginning God said, "let US make man in OUR image, He didn't specifically say Jesus & Holy Spirit, He said, "US". I'm not basing my belief on any "views", God's word is very clear.

 

[HK4U]

Dear HK, not trying to be contentious, just relating my own personal journey and studies of the rapture. Of a truth, the beginning of sorrows is a time that the Christian believer's will not be excluded and we do need to prepare, but I believe the spiritual preparation will be much more important than that of the worldly things, which are important in their own right, but not as much as the spiritual applications. Take a look at the last warning to those of us living in the last Laodicean church age:

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

We need to be looking to our Lord and Saviour to be rich in the Spirit and have His righteousness and to be doing the work of the Lord as we patiently await His return.

Matthew 24:42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed [is] that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49And shall begin to smite [his] fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for [him], and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint [him] his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

I am under no false pretense that my guns will save me in the day they come looking for us, nor shall the food or money we save do anything but prompt them to take it from us. My trust is not in Mr Ruger or any other gun maker, it is in Jesus and Him alone. That is what we need to begin preparing for spiritually so that that day does not catch us unaware.

I did not mean to infer that you were being contentious but rather that I know that is a possibility between Christians when the subject comes up and I do not want that to happen. We all have our opinions on the subject.

 

[HK4U]

But he sure as HELL is Satan's little helper.
Abortion...check
guncontrol...check
dissolution of free speech...check
corruption...check
unreasonable taxes...check

+1. I have said before if he is not he will do until the real one comes along.

 

[HK4U]

Do you believe in the Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit? Each is a distinct person, 3 in 1. Only God could be the restraining force against evil and the evil one, therefore HE (GOD in the third person of the Holy Trinity, the Holy Spirit) is taken out of the way. God himself isn't taken out of the way, neither is it Jesus. It IS CLEAR that HE is the Holy Spirit, for once again, "Only God could be the Restraining force against evil & the evil one". There is only ONE TRUTH. If not the Holy Spirit, then whom do you say that He that restrains IS? Remember also that in the beginning God said, "let US make man in OUR image, He didn't specifically say Jesus & Holy Spirit, He said, "US". I'm not basing my belief on any "views", God's word is very clear.

Ringo I realize that you believe scripture teaches pre trib. As I have said I don't. We will just have to differ on that point as it is doubtful either of us are going to be swayed on the subject.

 

[DocCurt]

Just a little historical note.

The original Westminster Confession of Faith stated that the Pope is the Anti-Christ (XXV,6). This was eliminated with the adoption of an American version in 1789.

 

[Conservative Wife & Mom]

ONE MORE TIME... I've said it before: to me, it matters NOT in what order the End Time events unfold. Just knowing that God is in control, that He has a perfect plan and that He holds every Believer in the palm of His hand is ALL that I need to know. In other words, I'm a Pan-Trib: it will all pan out in the end.

 

[Ringo]

One more verse of scripture for those questioning the pre-trib Rapture. The last two letters to the churches are the Church of Philadelphia and the Church in Laodicea. The Church of Philadelphia is the true church consisting of the Born Again Christians, the Church of Laodicea is the apostate church. Revelation 3:10 speaking to the Church of Philadelphia.."Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth". Is there any part of "keep you from" that is misunderstood?

 

[HK4U]

One more verse of scripture for those questioning the pre-trib Rapture. The last two letters to the churches are the Church of Philadelphia and the Church in Laodicea. The Church of Philadelphia is the true church consisting of the Born Again Christians, the Church of Laodicea is the apostate church. Revelation 3:10 speaking to the Church of Philadelphia.."Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth". Is there any part of "keep you from" that is misunderstood?

And those were real churches during that time which some attempt to use to prove that point. I understand exactly the message to "that" church at that time and the promise to"that" church to be kept from tribulation. Sorry Ringo. You can believe it if you will but I don't buy it. There again as I have said we all have opinions. If the catching away does come before the trib I will be happy and glad to tell you I was wrong. Whichever way it goes I think it very likely will be in my life time, and I am no spring chicken.

 

[Ringo]

And those were real churches during that time which some attempt to use to prove that point. I understand exactly the message to "that" church at that time and the promise to"that" church to be kept from tribulation. Sorry Ringo. You can believe it if you will but I don't buy it. There again as I have said we all have opinions. If the catching away does come before the trib I will be happy and glad to tell you I was wrong. Whichever way it goes I think it very likely will be in my life time, and I am no spring chicken.

. The Church of Philadelphia & the Church of Laodicea are future at the time John penned the scripture, not a church of "that" time. The seven churches are an outline of church history from" Beginning to End Times". Again, Philadelphia & Laodicea are the two churches described relating to End Times, the churches existing present day. The Lord certainly isn't telling a church of the past (non existent) that He would keep them from the hour of trial (Tribulation Period) to occur 2,000 years in the future. No offense, but this is scripture, not an "opinion". leasantry:

 

[Alaska444]

. The Church of Philadelphia & the Church of Laodicea are future at the time John penned the scripture, not a church of "that" time. The seven churches are an outline of church history from" Beginning to End Times". Again, Philadelphia & Laodicea are the two churches described relating to End Times, the churches existing present day. The Lord certainly isn't telling a church of the past (non existent) that He would keep them from the hour of trial (Tribulation Period) to occur 2,000 years in the future. No offense, but this is scripture, not an "opinion". leasantry:

Dear Ringo, that is exactly what the Bible is telling us. Jesus is the faithful witness who IS and Was and IS YET TO COME. This is the entire timeline on which the book of Revelation is based and the time that IS is the church age. He goes on to tell us that John is to write the things that he has SEEN, the things that ARE and the things that shall be HEREAFTER. The things he has SEEN is when he sees Jesus in His resurrected body. The things that are HEREAFTER are in Rev 4:1 and that is speaking of the rapture. What happens in between is the things that ARE which is the church age. The seven churches are real as well as prophetic of the church age, ending in the church of Laodiceans which we are now in. You can actually date each church age very accurately, but most attempts at doing this are deceptive, be careful which authority you trust. So, in chapter one of the book of Revelation, there are two separate lines of witness telling us about the things to come in the church age and those that will be beyond the church age which ends at the end of chapter 3 and the church of Ladiceans. If people don't want to take the word of Jesus Himself, there is certainly not much any of the rest of us can say.

 

[semonejs]

I agree completely with your statement HK4U.

 

[semonejs]

The antichrist is given power to make war with the saints!

Revelation 13:7 He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation.


Daniel 7:21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against the saints and defeating them,


Daniel 7:25 He will speak against the Most High and oppress his saints and try to change the set times and the laws. The saints will be handed over to him for a time, times and half a time.


Revelation 12:17 Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to make war against the rest of her offspring--those who obey God's commandments and hold to the testimony of Jesus.


Our Lord is so amazing, and has warned us over and over in scripture that we will face persecution....so I do honestly believe it does matter what we believe. God gave this to us so that we will be PREPARED. IF we are not prepared spiritually we will fall. Look how many times Jesus gave a parable on unprepared servants losing their place in the kingdom! This is extremely important!

But, we are not to be patient and kind with those who do not believe as we do, but we do not have to minimize the importance of knowing God's Word.

Those of us who believe in a post tribulation (and even a mid trib) view, seem to want to be prepared, and want to see the truth in God's Word. But, I have to be honest, every pre-tribber I've ever spoken with was more concerned with proving that God is too merciful to allow his people to endure such a horrible time.

But, the Bible makes it clear that the antichrist is given the power and authority to make war with Christians...the Bible says that...but the pre-trib view makes a distinction between "which" christians will endure persecution, but, the BIBLE does NOT. The BIble doesn't say "certain" (those left behind) believers will be persecuted.

I think we have to be focused on the truth, and not focused on trying to prove that we won't be here during that horrible time.

Jesus told us in Matthew 24 and 25 and Luke 17 when he was coming, and he said "immediately" after the tribulation. He didn't say anything about 7 years before the tribulation. He said, "Don't let anyone deceive you...as the lightning is from the east to the west, so shall the coming of the son of man be". He wants to us know that he is coming for us and every eye shall see him! He's not coming in secret...don't let anyone deceive you.

I used to have the pre-trib view...I was raised on it...until I just started reading the scriptures without preconceived notions...I just read what it says. It makes plain sense.

To support a pre-trib view we have to add our own interpretation to scriptures that aren't quite as plain as what Jesus said! For example, "being kept from the hour of trial" is debatable...and "the restrainer" is debatable.

But, what we cannot debate is the following because scripture tells us these things plainly:

1. Jesus emphasized over and over again that his servants needed to be prepared or they would lose their place in his kingdom. Matthew 25, Luke 12:35-48, 14-24

2. Christians are PROMISED persecution as long as they follow Christ. John 15:19-21, 2 Corinthians 12:10, Matthew 5:10-12, 2 Corinthians 4: 8-11

3. The Bible says the antichrist is given power to make war with the saints and it does NOT say anything about saints who are "left behind". (see scriptures in Daniel and Revelation above)

4. Jesus said don't let anyone deceive you about his coming for his saints. He said it will not be secret; it will be public. Matthew 24:23-28

5. Jesus rescues his servants from the antichrist. He says he is gathering his elect immediately after the tribulation in a very public display in power and great glory. Matthew 24:29-31


In order to believe a post tribulation rapture you have to just accept scripture at face value.

In order to believe a pretribulation rapture you have to "infer" from scriptures and even deny the plain scriptures.

For example:

God promised us persecution...but in order to support a pretrib view you have to deny that because the most common pretrib argument is that a good God wouldn't allow his people to suffer persecution. We also have to deny what the scriptures say about the antichrist being given power to make war with the saints, or we have to "infer" that it doesn't apply to some Christians.

We have to infer that what Jesus said about Philadelphia applies to us today....and that it means that they won't even experience persecution (it could also mean that they will be kept in peace and safe through persecution and not necessarily mean that they are taken out of the world..read John 17:15)

Jesus said he was coming immediately after the tribulation...we have to "infer" a coming 7 years before the coming of Christ....a coming that scripture speaks nothing of.

So, we can accept Jesus at his Word (I'm paraphrasing), "After my elect have been persecuted by the antichrist, immediately after the tribulation, I am coming back for them in all power and glory, in plain sight, everyone will see me, I am catching them up to the clouds, don't let anyone tell you any different, don't let anyone deceive you." Our savior took great care in explaining all of this to us, so all we have to do is take him at his word...plain and simple...no discrepancy about it. Jesus said look for this coming...this is when I'm coming back.

Or we ignore, deny and apply scripture selectively at our will to make some inferences and educated guesses that Jesus is coming back in a secret rapture for a select few believers because our feelings tell us that God wouldn't allow the antichrist to persecute us. And we look for a secret rapture that Jesus never mentioned to us????

So, my question is, why not just take him at his word? Why make it more complicated than it has to be. He told us when he is coming for us. Let's believe his word...and trust him.

 

[Sheldon]

Anti Christ no... Evil Conniving Deceitful Maniacal Socialist who we will vote out of office in 2 years, Yes....

 

[antietam]

I've studied this topic for many years - it's fascinating and will happen. Many good intentioned and knowledeable Christian has used solid bible reference to conclude very differently from another good intentioned and knowledeable Christian. The bible is only a starting point, not the end. The end of the knowlege and the actual revelation will be spirit. I do not know if he is the AC but can tell you that the spirit is telling me that he is quite different than any world leader, good and nefarious the world has ever experienced. He exudes an emptiness in his words, though they be flowery and clever. He is vacuous of normal feeling for this country and its people. He is arrogant to the people's wishes. He circumvents the Constitution with czars and more czars, albeit that preceding presidents did as well. Though the "birth certificate" thing has been played down to conspiracy nut meal, I think it may bounce back to be significant. I don't know if he is the AC. We can't assume that everything has to come from the US - we may not even be a player in the end. But, he gives me the creeps and so many others I know indicate the same.

 

[antietam]

As far as voting him out of office I hope it happens. But don't assume it will happen just because the tide is soooo against him at the moment. He can manufacture a crisis, use a dormant authorization buried in the ultimate "sleeper cell" against this country called the Patriot Act which is anything but patriotic, and suspend elections. Considering his arrogance which is so thick it can't be hidden, do not think that he will easily leave office merely because the People voted him out. I hope you're right and I'm wrong.