If someone starts shooting in public, should I shoot back?


civilian75

New member
In times like this, never hurts to go over the basics. From The Oregon Washington County Sheriff Office:
One way we process tragic events like the Newtown, Connecticut school or the Clackamas Town Center shootings, is to run through the scenario in our heads. How would we react, what would we do, what if my family is with me? Planning and thinking through various situations is a healthy way to give yourself peace of mind and to live safer.

Drivers learn and practice driving on icy roads. Businesses have fire or evacuation drills. It is the same if you carry concealed - have a plan and practice. If you have a plan, improve it. If you don't, start today. Here is a list of some considerations from our firearms experts to get you thinking:

If at all possible, have someone call 9-1-1 immediately.

Can you assess your situation accurately? How many shooters are there? Are you in a position of tactical advantage or are you already cornered? If possible, choose a position behind an object or structure that both conceals your location and provides a barrier before engaging the shooter. If the shooter comes to you, you may have to take immediate action.

We know a shooter's field of vision will narrow to some degree, often to pin-point vision. They may lose the ability to see peripherally and suffer diminished hearing. They could feel like they are in slow motion. This may also happen to you, depending on your experience.

Finally, and this is the toughest part of the plan, are you prepared to take the shooter's life to save the lives of others? The shooter has already made the decision to kill people. Have you ever considered this scenario? Is it part of your mental plan?

If you do take action and are able to successfully engage the shooter, you need to understand that you are now presenting an armed, unknown threat to responding law enforcement. If you continue to display your weapon, when police encounter you there are only fractions of a second when life or death decisions are made. After you successfully engage a shooter, our trainers recommend you ensure your empty hands are plainly visible. Either re-holster or put your gun down depending upon the environment, situation, and proximity of police.

It is highly unlikely that you will ever find yourself involved in an active shooter situation; however, if you do, and you have a CHL, it is good to be prepared. It's like putting that spare tire and some extra emergency items in the trunk of your car before a long trip. You never know when you may need it, but you will have it just in case.

Practice regularly with the gun you carry. Practice regularly drawing from a concealed carry position using the holster you will be wearing. Practice until you are proficient with your gear. Be aware of your surroundings. Have a plan.

Sheriff's Office News Carry - Your Questions Answered
 

mmckee1952

New member
There are more legal ramifications with you op than you can ever realize. What to might do is contact a pro-gun lawyer in your location and talk to him concerning your proposal, too many sticky wickets with just a short answer.
 

UDoggie

New member
+1 for our Sheriff's department. (From a fellow Washington Co Oregon resident.)

Not dodging the issue, and at least some thoughtful consideration.

UD
 

Gettysburg Bill

Gettysburg Bill
Times like these, never hurts going over basics.
You know what a DA would say about this?
The whole thing would be turned around and
used against you in a court of law.
~Premenitaded~
 

recithree

New member
it is bad that we should have a plan for every possible scenario that we may experience in life but it is a mistake to have a plan for deadly self defense.i guess you are suppose to have a plan to get out of every situation using non deadly force and let it never cross your mind that a gun is a option.never ever let it cross your mind to pull it.however purely as a hobby continue going to the range and shooting at silhouettes of humans.also never visit this site or at least never read posts about self defense with a gun.
 

TroutStalker

New member
Self-Defense Insurance

Is it worth it and if so does anybody have any suggestions on reputable companies that offer self defense insurance in the event the day you never hope happens does...
 

Austin

New member
If I can get out and to safety thats what Im going to do. However if I am unable to get out of the situation then I am going to do whatever I can to protect myself and my family. If you are not a sworn LEO you do not have duty and to responding officers you look like another man with a gun.
 

Dekul34

New member
If I can get out and to safety thats what Im going to do. However if I am unable to get out of the situation then I am going to do whatever I can to protect myself and my family. If you are not a sworn LEO you do not have duty and to responding officers you look like another man with a gun.

Unfortunately, you don't have a duty to help and neither do the police, their only duty is to enforce the law after the crime is committed. That said, if I can get me and mine out of harms way quickly and safely I'm going to do it, if that proposition is risky well then I'll be firing back, until a safe path exists at least. As soon as any law enforcement is on scene however you'd best instantly disarm and capitulate lest you wind up taking the fall.
 

kerb

pinche gringo
Interesting read.

I noted that there's no mention of insuring that the area beyond the target is reasonably clear.
I'm not sure it would be morally correct to engage a shooter if doing so would endanger a bystander.

Anybody got thoughts on that?
 

Dekul34

New member
Interesting read.

I noted that there's no mention of insuring that the area beyond the target is reasonably clear.
I'm not sure it would be morally correct to engage a shooter if doing so would endanger a bystander.

Anybody got thoughts on that?

If the shot's not clear and I'm not in direct danger, no fire, if he's turning to aim at me? I'm taking the shot, I didn't cause the situation, he did, I'd rather deal with possible consequences than be dead.
 

kerb

pinche gringo
If the shot's not clear and I'm not in direct danger, no fire, if he's turning to aim at me? I'm taking the shot, I didn't cause the situation, he did, I'd rather deal with possible consequences than be dead.

If the shooter is shooting at me, I would probably hesitate to shoot if the area beyond isn't reasonably clear.
If he was shooting at my kid or my wife, I think I'd take the shot regardless.

I don't value my life above an innocent's. Wife and kid, different story.
That's just my take on things, other's view may be different, and I ain't gonna judge if that happens to be the case.
 

dogshawred

New member
Greater Good?

Interesting read.

I noted that there's no mention of insuring that the area beyond the target is reasonably clear.
I'm not sure it would be morally correct to engage a shooter if doing so would endanger a bystander.

Anybody got thoughts on that?

Look what happened with the two NYPD officers who shot 9 bystanders along with a man on the street shooting.
Depending on the circumstances it will be a disaster unless you know your surroundings. Who of the normal CCer's are emotionally equiped to fulfill that requirement in a split second. Especially any public setting where there are gatherings of people.
As long as there is a chance that a CCer will engage a weapon there will be a chance of collateral damage and there are some that will say that is for the greater good. I can not however acknowledge that I would willing put innocences in harms way for the greater good.
 

JimTh

Banned
I don't believe that checking to see if innocent bystanders are around before you decide to engage a shooter is something most people will have the time to do or have the presence of mind to do. I have never been in a situation like that before and hope I am never in one. I think the prudent thing to do would be to eliminate an active shooter very quickly if you have a shot. The shooter is going to be killing people while someone is trying to make up their mind about a clear shot. What if the shooter is killing people and you don't think it is a safe bet to shoot. How many will he kill before it becomes a safe shot. Let's say you can take a shot but some bystander will likely get hit too but if you take the shot and knock the shooter down you may have prevented 3 bystanders from being shot dead. It's the old ethics debate...who gets thrown out of the boat! I will weigh the odds, talk to God, ask for forgiveness, and then take the shot or shots. I don't want to be a hero I just want to remove the plague!
 

Sheldon

New member
each situation will be different, and lots of good advice has been given....

find safe cover for your family and self.
call 911 asap.
if you are a confident enough shot, have a fire solution, I say take it with out regret.

BTY I practice Mozambique, and single head shots with the HK... out to 100 yards, and yes it can be done reliably, all you need is a steady hand, a rest point, and proper breathing, (with practice).
 

mmckee1952

New member
Unfortunately, you don't have a duty to help and neither do the police, their only duty is to enforce the law after the crime is committed. That said, if I can get me and mine out of harms way quickly and safely I'm going to do it, if that proposition is risky well then I'll be firing back, until a safe path exists at least. As soon as any law enforcement is on scene however you'd best instantly disarm and capitulate lest you wind up taking the fall.


If you shoot someone, there’s a rule you need to remember, if you have an avenue to retreat from the situation without any harm to yourself you need to take it, the lawyers will emphasize this at trial and will win the argument and you will most likely go to jail and loose everything in the outcome.
 

Nightmare45

NRA LIFE MEMBER
I will move seek cover, defend myself and family, those of you who don't have guns can wait on the police to protect you, it was nice knowing you.
 

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