Hunting and politics (remember, thick skin)

[Icewind]

Allow me to vent on the topic of hunting and politics. Remember thick skin is a must in this area. This not a troll post just a person stating what's on his mind.

I will admit, 1. i am against hunting. 2. I am not a member of any club including the NRA. 3. I am a gun owner and CCW card holder. 4. A veteran of this country's military. USN ftw!!

Ok I was reading the July 2011 American Hunter magazine, (belongs to guy here at work). Page 20 starts off with a beauty of an article "Taxidermy Goes En Vogue." But that's not that bad of an article. The next page has a story titled, "Seized by an Uncaring Bureaucracy" opening sentence is "Sometimes the US Fish and wildlife service law-enforcement divisions seems overzealous." It seems one of the magazine's editors shot a a beautiful leopard in 2009 and when it arrived in 2010 it was seized because of a new law at the time that took effect in 2010. It seems he broke 2 laws. It goes on to insult our goverment, its workers, and USFWS in general. But killing a wonderful animal like the leopard from 7 miles away in the safety of a jeep or what-not makes for great people! They should not only take his "trophy" what a stupid name, they could have locked him up for breaking 2 laws!

Back to the previous page, there is a snippet titled "Hunters Help Africa," yea, cause they're such caring people right?? They claim 18,500 hunters "pump" in 200 million a year into remote areas. What they forgot to mention it all goes to warlord and gang leaders. Then the 2 snippet headline reads "Private Hunting Conserve Wildlife" (by killing them). I love how hunters always defend their actions by claiming they're doing mother nature a favor by killing everything they see. The earth has survived billions of years and can care for itself just fine, but hunters think it's them that are to thank. No thanks! Another great hunter "line" is "I eat what I kill" cause I can't afford meat from the store. yea, nice 2k dollar rifle, 1k scope, and thousands of rounds. $$$

No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms- everyones favorite saying right? I agree with it, but Washington needs to look at hunting and curb it down a notch or two. Here in Arizona, the Arizona Bald Eagle, our nations very symbol was on the brink of extincion (hunters) and made a slight comeback and was immediately taken off the list to kill off yet again!! I mean dam!

A law I was thinking of would be something like, every adult gets 14 days of hunting in a lifetime. Used by the day or all at once. Not an exact but a rough draft let's say.

If it were that somehow a population got "too big" what a joke of an excuse, but I'll play along, they're could be lottery according to age. Again, rough draft.

Without touching our right to bear arms we could preserve wildlife and still enjoy rifles at the range with skeet shooting or just good ol fashion target shooting.

I think someone who runs on a platform of 2nd amendment rights and a tougher hunting laws campaign could win an election this next time around easy.

 

[chapinjs]

Thick skin? Yes you do.
You need to remember that ALL governmental restriction on behavior is something that someone thinks is a good idea, maybe even for good reasons, or at the very least for reasons that seem right to them. But this puts power in the hands of the government, rather than the governed, and eventually, there will be something that affects YOU.
Your line of thought is short-sighted and dangerous. If only the world were run exactly according to your ideas? None of us should have that kind of power.
We do eat what we hunt, and we are proud of the delicous, organic venison we harvest from our own property. We are also proud to process it ourselves, and no, that can't be replaced from the grocery store. You also can't replace the taste! Going back to beef is like eating poi. Pale, and no flavor.
Furthermore, if you've ever lived around here, you would know there is no shortage of "wildlife".
Your ideas are wrongheaded, and it is people like you who will one day wake up in a world where you can't do something YOU want to do, and you'll wonder what happened.

 

[Icewind]

Why is it, that all gun owners always think when someone says anything about guns/hunting and a little common sense/control right away THEY'RE deemed "the dangerous ones" while they think so high of themselves?

The world is losing species after species on land and in the sea. I for one think Washington needs to do something about it. I'm not talking 2nd amendment rights. I'm talking about rules and regulations concerning hunting and the prevention of the extinction of our wild life. Be honest with yourself and the forum. If let alone hunters would kill every animal until not 1 was left and then probably blame the government for taking away their rights to hunt.

 

[dumb okie]

You must be one of those that think we should all get our meat from the grocery store where it is made and no animals were harmed. We do not hunt solely for the purpose of killing, but to enjoy the outdoors with our friends and family and if we are lucky we bring home food that is healthier than any meat you can buy. I'm sorry nobody took you hunting as a kid so you could experience for yourself what it is really about.

 

[localgirl]

Ice: Your argument would work if all humans became vegetarians, and if all humans stopped breeding at geometric rates.

As it is, humans feel like they need to eat meat, and reproduce.

So, if you are a meat eater, the responsible thing to do is kill what you eat. Factory farms are disgusting abominations of nature. Animals are overcrowded, fed processed food, stressed, and slaughtered inhumanely. They never see the sun, they never run in the fields, and they never form the natural bonds that animals are supposed to form when they live in the wild. Furthermore, the amount of antibiotics and vaccines that the animals need to receive in order to survive in this man-made prison filter directly into the meat and do who knows what to us when we eat them.

In most areas of the country, deer are plentiful. In fact, in many places they are so numerous that they are causing problems. Deer and other wildlife are free-range, completely organic, and the healthiest possible source of animal protein. Plus, the herds need to be thinned.

Now, if you'd like to counter with the let the predators thin the herd argument, I would like to remind you that humans like you, in their infinite wisdom, have decided that high rises and Wal-Marts are more important than nature, so predators, which require vast expanses of breeding areas and hunting territories, are being pushed out, while the deer placidly linger in suburbia, fed and petted by the masses. Or worse, when the predators get too close to town, and to people's kids, they freak out and start demanding the predators be shot, trapped, or relocated.

This is not even to mention the toll on the environment from things like cattle. The amount of water and grain it takes to raise a steer to maturity could feed a family for a year. Plus cows are notorious producers of methane gas, further adding to our planet's stresses. There's also runoff into the water table, not just e.coli, but the residual drugs and hormones--both natural and artificial--that are produced in cow excrement.

Now do I think shooting and mounting a leopard is the solution to this problem? Not necessarily. But killing an animal in its natural habitat is a heck of a lot more humane than paving its environment for an apartment complex.

The further people get from nature, the worse off we are. We evolved the same as the rest of the animals, and that means we need every part of the natural world in order to thrive. The more we remove ourselves, the worse off we are. Most of our problems today are the result of trying to fashion an artificial world instead of living in the real one.

At least if you're hunting, you're taking one small step to restore some kind of healthy balance to the planet. If you believe you're doing less damage by buying a steak, you just aren't thinking it through.

 

[chapinjs]

Localgirl - if all people became vegetarians, then they would stop breeding. Because they'd all be too unhealthy to reproduce! Also, cows get a bad rap because of feedlots, but healthy cows, grazed on grass (their natural food), do not produce any more methane than any other animal, and produce excellent, healthy meat.
Ice, you are dangerous because you think you are the only one on this thread with any common sense, and you want your ideas to reign supreme. While I only want the freedom guaranteed by God and the constitution. I actually want you to have it, too, but your freedom stops at the end of my nose.
And yes, I DO think highly of myself. I just don't think HIGHER of my self than I do of anyone else. If I was worth creating, then I am worth caring for. The difference between you and me is that you seem to believe that your ideas are more important and worthy than mine. In other words, I stand for freedom, you stand for restrictions on those freedoms. But who exactly are you to tell me when, how often, or where I am to hunt, or what I should eat, how much of it, or how often?
My argument stands, and you need to think it through. Restrictions on freedom are a slippery slope, and one day, someone will decide it is a good idea to restrict something YOU think is important - is that the only time you will be willing to take a stand? Because by then, it will be too late.

 

[twogunwilly]

I'm a hunter. I've hunted my whole life and killed countless critters, yet walking in the woods I see no difference year after year. There are more deer here now than when the pilgrims landed. Wonder why your car insurance is so high? Thank the deer, they cause billions of dollars in damage to crops and cars. BTW the Bald Eagle is American not Arizonian. You don't like hunting---stop reading hunting mags.

 

[Ringo]

The world is losing species after species on land and in the sea. I for one think Washington needs to do something about it.

I for one think they've (EPA) been doing something about it for far to long and screwing over everyone in our country in the process. Any government or individual that puts the lives of fish, insects, etc. above the welfare of human beings is of a lower life than that of which they seek to protect. If species go extinct they go extinct. I won't miss them and it won't effect my life or anyone else I know in the least.

 

[localgirl]

I for one think they've (EPA) been doing something about it for far to long and screwing over everyone in our country in the process. Any government or individual that puts the lives of fish, insects, etc. above the welfare of human beings is of a lower life than that of which they seek to protect. If species go extinct they go extinct. I won't miss them and it won't effect my life or anyone else I know in the least.

You're joking, right? I mean, you DO know what will happen if we lose things like pollinators?

 

[scottbland247]

I don't even know where to start with how ridiculous this is

 

[Ringo]

You're joking, right? I mean, you DO know what will happen if we lose things like pollinators?

No I'm not joking. You know exactly what I'm talking about. I'm well aware of the pollinators, don't stretch it just for sake of argument.

 

[localgirl]

No, seriously, I don't know what you mean.

It SOUNDS like you mean anything on the planet could become extinct without having any effect on humans.

If that IS what you mean, I really hope you're right.

 

[dumb okie]

Ringo it's opinions like yours that give all hunters a bad name. You will be more help by keeping to yourself

 

[Ringo]

Ringo it's opinions like yours that give all hunters a bad name. You will be more help by keeping to yourself

Hey dumb okie, I'm not talking about hunting or killing off any species deliberately. I'm talking about those species that go "extinct" naturally. Wise up.

 

[JJFlash]

I was raised in the hunting tradition, I still hunt, and I will continue to hunt. Don't care to change anyone's mind about it, but if you've never participated, don't knock it till you've given it a full-faith effort. Then, come back and tell me how "easy" it was and how you've seen the woods and fields littered with the bodies of dead critters, all laid waste by those nasty hunters, who shoot everything they see.

I can skin a buck, I can run a trotline...a country boy can survive. What are YOU gonna do when the supermarkets are empty?

 

[Ringo]

No, seriously, I don't know what you mean.

It SOUNDS like you mean anything on the planet could become extinct without having any effect on humans.

If that IS what you mean, I really hope you're right.

You seem brighter than that localgirl. Like I said, not pollinators, I know that we need the bees. My statement is in reference to the ridiculous EPA restrictions on building, drilling, irrigation rights, etc. in order to protect certain insects, fish, birds, you name it, jeopardizing the quality of human life as a result. Common sense. If it is on the verge of extinction and has no effect on humans, it won't have any effect on humans if it continues to become extinct.

 

[R&M]

I want one of whatever he used to shoot the leopard 7 miles away from the safety of a jeep. Maybe 2 of em. Thats about a 12,000 yard shot.

 

[dumb okie]

I have to admit that is one hell of a shot. Haha

 

[localgirl]

I have to admit that is one hell of a shot. Haha

I did NOT know I was allowed to own an intercontinental ballistic missile. This changes everything.

 

[JimPage]

Icewind is unbelievable. I suspect he's just egging folks on.