How to sight with bifocals

[joemendoza]

New pistol shooter -- and darned if I can get the sights properly in focus. If I'm wearing my reading glasses, no problem -- but how often will that happen in a self-defense situation? Hardly ever.

If I am wearing bifocals I could tilt my head up, but that is really unnatural and unreliable.

If I have no glasses on (burglar in the middle of the night). then it's nearly impossible. (I don't have terrible distance vision, but the near vision is shot) When I practice I find myself doing all kinds of head, eye, shooting position contortions, none of which makes for a smooth efficient sight and shot.

So, you instructors, how do you get guys like me to get a good focus?

I'm about to just say I need to get a laser ...

 

[Oldgrunt]

Joe: I wear trifocals and have the same basic problem. Hope you find an answer, I haven't.

 

[steve83814]

Joe -

I have the same problem too. I found an Optometrist who is also a shooter and here's what we came up with; when on the range I wear contacts to correct my astigmatism and far vision then a pair of single-vision safety glasses to bring my front sight into sharp focus. This blurs my far vision a bit but it isn't too bad. Whether this would work for you would depend on your particular vision and it is definitely a range only solution. For my carry guns I use laser grips.

The other solution my optometrist suggested was laser surgery but laser grips were cheaper.

This isn't much help I know but it was all I could come up with.

Best of Luck,

Steve

 

[CalicoJack10]

New pistol shooter -- and darned if I can get the sights properly in focus. If I'm wearing my reading glasses, no problem -- but how often will that happen in a self-defense situation? Hardly ever.

If I am wearing bifocals I could tilt my head up, but that is really unnatural and unreliable.

If I have no glasses on (burglar in the middle of the night). then it's nearly impossible. (I don't have terrible distance vision, but the near vision is shot) When I practice I find myself doing all kinds of head, eye, shooting position contortions, none of which makes for a smooth efficient sight and shot.

So, you instructors, how do you get guys like me to get a good focus?

I'm about to just say I need to get a laser ...

There is an inherent problem with the ability to focus at multiple parallaxes with glasses. That problem is that glasses are set up so that your eyes gravitate to a specific point where you can see most clearly. This is caused by the lenses being ground to accommodate a natural point of vision. When they fit you for your glasses they found this by putting the little dot in front of your eye when you tried on the frames. That effectively caused you to have a specific point in the lenses that was the clearest. If you look at many people with older glasses you can see that they always tilt their head (Even the slightest bit) while they are wearing their glasses. This is because the clearest vision through the lenses rarely matched the natural point of vision (Being the position your eyes sit in when you are not wearing your glasses).

There are 2 good ways to combat this.

First, try moving the gun and your head until the sights line up and are clear. This does not work for many people, but in nearly as many cases it will fix the problem. Keep in mind that this will adjust your natural shooting position and will take some time and practice to get used to.

Second, find yourself a good instructor that can teach you instinctive shooting. In self defense with a hand gun, instinctive shooting is far more effective and is a lot faster. A good instinctive shooting course costs about the same as a good laser, but will be good with all of your firearms and not just the one you bolt it to.

I hope this answers your questions. If I missed anything let me know.

 

[joemendoza]

Thanks for the information, guys. I'll look into all this. My brother just solved his problem by convincing his ophthalmologist to put new lenses in both eyes. The doc didn't want to do it, because there are risks and is normally performed only on old folks who really really need it, as when you have cataracts. But it worked out great for my brother. Takes a year or so for the eye muscles to get adjusted, but he is very pleased. My ophthalmologist says in 5-10 years everyone will be able to get new lenses for a grand or so.

I think I'll go for instinctive (point?) shooting, and a laser .... but maybe look at the other options ... I wonder how instructors at Gunsight, Frontsight handle this.

 

[Dave]

POINT
SHOOTING
There is some good info at this site.
~spwenger's DEFENSIVE USE OF FIREARMS: Point Shooting
When I changed from Trifocals to Progressive lenses it helped some.
For self defense it usually is at close range and what i was told and have done is focus on the front site and let the
target be a little fuzzy. Not much help for comp shooting but I gave up on that for pistol a long time ago.
Now if I could just find an ankle holster for an AR and Acog I would be set.

 

[BC1]

Joe, as I got older I found it more difficult to focus on both my sights and the targets. I changed all my sights to TruGlo TFO's. They glow brightly in the sun and at night making it a little easier. When all else fails? CT LaserGrips on your PP guns.

 

[alsipd]

+1 or point shooting. All of the scenarios for self defense are typically within 3-10 ft so point shooting is the solution. Practice this the next time you go to the range with a target about 2-4 steps away (6 to 10 ft away).
Draw the pistol from the holster, rotate the pistol toward the target, extend the pistol just past your body while still at your side, fire two shots into the target, not yourself then access the situation prior to re-holstering. Repeat this until you find the proper stance, and point. then practice to acquire muscle memory and it becomes second nature.

If you just want target practice have the bifocal put at the top of your aiming eye so that you tilt your head down to see the front sight.

 

[tcox4freedom]

Joe: I wear trifocals and have the same basic problem. Hope you find an answer, I haven't.

I wear progressive lenses and have the same issue as well.

It's funny how I can get absolute newbies to shoot better than I can. I usually have students in CWP classes hitting their targets better than me by the end of the day.

 

[bootsdeal]

I used to wear trifocals. Now, I wear progressives and have absolutely no problem. I also practice point and shoot while not wearing glasses, cause that's probably how a defensive situation would come down (middle of the night). I swear by the progressives, although it'll take a week or two to get used to them.

 

[BC1]

CT LaserGrips would be a good idea for in-home PP. Since you can't see the sights and target without your glasses and considering you may not have time to get them, just use the little red dot.

 

[NFTATraining]

In my opinion lasers are not the way to go. It wasn't a horrible idea and I am not putting down anyone's theories, especially trying to help someone, not at all, but to me this is masking the problem instead of solving it. Plus if you can't see the sights, finding a little red dot 6-10 feet away may be hard especially in daylight, plus it makes you a target at night. LOL, we just had a huge debate about this in the other forum and I will admit, because I said I would, lasers have SOME uses, just not for this situation in my mind. I am just not a big fan of them. I also don't recommend point shooting, definatley a good thing to learn and practice but I wouldn't use it as a replacement for this problem because you have to stray away and adjust from your standard tactics to do it, plus its not the most consistant way to shoot. In a fight or flight situation you want to revert to training that you have been consitantly doing over the years because muscle memory will make you do it anyways. My school has had this issue with some students and our research has proved 2 methods to be the most reliable.

1. You could learn to do whats called "Front Sight Focusing" Your brain can't focus on three things at once and if you wear those types of glasses I couldn't even imagine, so you focus on the front sight, this tells your brain to adjust your eyes to distance which makes things alot more clear. You can learn this method and there are tons of materials on the internet and youtube about it. George Harris of the SigArms Academy either developed the method or was one of the first to use it and it has became very popular.

2. The second option that I prefer, is changing your sights. There is a company called Sure Sight and they have came up with a set of sights that work like this; instead of aiming through the back sight to the front you just put a triangle together using the two sights. Your rear sight is the bottom half of the triangle and your front sight is the top. Make it a triangle and there you go. Your brain naturally recognizes and automatically puts shapes together and is actually faster than aim down a standard set of sights having good vision. I prefer this method, because you can still use your standard method of firearms training and not having to adjust for your particular problem. The company website is: SureSight you can go there to see exactly what I am talking about. During testing I bought a set of them myself and I absolutely love them. Its VERY easy to transition and you will be back in the game in no time, plus they are a cheap alternative to anything else.

Our association was founded to find & test the latest tactics and training tools avaiable. I hope this helps you and if you need anymore help please feel to contact me via here or my email.

-Brian Woods

 

[sgtbill]

Learn to do instinct shooting and get a set of Crimson Trace grip's and practice with the grips both turned on and off untill you are comfortable with them. I would learn the tripple tap method in close up combat shooting - 2 two to the chest and one to the head. I do not use the laser grips for up close shooting or sights. If you take the time to line up sight's you are most likely already dead and just don't know it yet.
Bill

 

[Purple]

I wear progressives and have learned to use the front sight and concentrate on the target downrange. If you are closing your eye on the weak side and sighting down the gun with your strong arm side eye, try keeping both eyes open. Tilting the head might help get the sweet spot of your glasses and eye's in the right position as well.

 

[Budreaux39]

Hi folks,
I see a need for the method I teach my students to get here sooner I have planned an article on RAPID FIRE SHOOTING! How it is propery done and and the way to train yourself to build the Muscle Memory so you can control your group...in the dark! Believe it cause it is true. You don't need the sights at certain distances to hit your target. At other distances you need a bit more, but not to align the sights. Sound too confusing? Give me a week or so and I'll have it out for all to try. Sorry but my time is take up by family, job, training and instruction :-(. Plus I have to check out the range every so often
I'll get it in the article section.
Scott Vaughn

 

[lostone1413]

I had the same trouble until I started carrying a Glock 19 with a Red Dot. I conceal without trouble and I'm armed 24/7. Check out at Gabe place warriortalk.com the section on red dots. In my 60s I now hit things that would have been hard to hit if I had the eyes I did at 20

 

[jpm84092]

My Experiences

I recently conducted an NRA Pistol Class and had an older gentleman (about 66) on the firing line for the shooting portion of the class. In his remarks to me before the range portion, he told me that he considered himself a fairly good marksman and that he anticipated no problem doing well in the shooting portion of the class.

However, when it came time to actually shoot, he had great difficulty hitting a paper plate at 5 yards (15 feet) and was very frustrated. He could not understand what he was doing wrong. I shot his handgun and this made him all the more frustrated when he observed my 1-1/2 inch grouping. Then I tried switching him from his Springfield XD-9 to a Glock 19 thinking he might see the sights better. No improvement.

I stood behind him along his line of sight and observed his technique using a "ball and dummy" load (some snap caps mixed with live ammo). He showed good hold control and good trigger control. And I observed all his shots hitting low, but generally on center if they had hit the paper plate.

I noted that he wore glasses and asked him when the last time his eyes were checked. He told me it was 2 weeks before and that he was just 3 days into wearing his new "progressive lenses". He had previously worn bifocals.

I explained that the angle that he used to view the front sight was likely distorting it and advised him to progressively raise his point of vision with each shot taken until he found the "sweet spot". Then to go beyond that to confirm that he had indeed found the "sweet spot". He performed this exercise, found the "sweet spot" for shooting, and gave me a 4 inch group. I then advised him to practice often until sighting from the "sweet spot" became engrained into his memory.

I am not saying that this will work for everyone. Some may need to consult with an eye healthcare professional. But, this is my real time experience with this problem and how it was solved.

 

[cougaram]

New pistol shooter -- and darned if I can get the sights properly in focus. If I'm wearing my reading glasses, no problem -- but how often will that happen in a self-defense situation? Hardly ever.

If I am wearing bifocals I could tilt my head up, but that is really unnatural and unreliable.

If I have no glasses on (burglar in the middle of the night). then it's nearly impossible. (I don't have terrible distance vision, but the near vision is shot) When I practice I find myself doing all kinds of head, eye, shooting position contortions, none of which makes for a smooth efficient sight and shot.

So, you instructors, how do you get guys like me to get a good focus?

I'm about to just say I need to get a laser ...

Wow! What a great question. It was also a great question because it has caused me to re-examine my own marksmanship and just why within the last few years as to why my talents with certain firearms are greatly diminished and with others unaffected. I am going to have my eyes re-examined again and discuss the various options such as tri/bi/polarized focals, lasix, etc. and try experimenting with different lenses and reading glasses. A lot of possibilities now! Thanks!

 

[Hoganbeg]

This is REALLY critical information, considering all of us aging boomers and the swelling ranks of concealed carriers. Is there some way we can turn this into a faq or sticky? In fact, I don't think we have a FAQ article. It would also be a great place for all those "CCW badge" questions.

 

[old codger]

sighting is for compitition or target shooting.

When I first became a LEO my "old timer" (and he was really old and had been walking a beat for many years)took me out to the city cooperation yards by the levee. He set up a 4 X 4 post 6 ft. tall on a wheel and then taught me to shoot in a combat situation. I had to stand in many different postures and quickly point my index finger of my dominate hand to the post. When he could see that I always pointed at the post then I drew and pointed my unloaded 38 at the post. When he could see that I was always pointing at the post then we loaded the revolver. Then it was draw and fire two rounds each time at the post. When I could consistently hit the post then we consentrated on bringing the shots to the vital area and the head. Two rounds each time, drawing and pointing and fireing, not sighting. I became very proficient and could draw and fire at anything I looked at and hit it everytime just as if in a combat situation. In fact when I was involved in a combat situations there was no sighting, no thinking but simply drawing and fireing and unconsiously knowing how many rounds I had fired.
In a combat situation you don't have time to do any fancy sighting, nor adjusting bifocals or trifocal or even looking at your gun. Just protect your life. Learn to point and shoot and live.
Now the experts will disagree with me but I'm still alive after many big city and back country confrontations.
Hope this helps.