How to respond to anti-gun types


sdismukes

New member
It seems odd to me that people think the gun is the evil thing when someone is shot with an illegally possessed gun. Is it the gun, or the person, that's in the wrong?

The anti-gun types (and anti tea-party, and anti- you-name-it types) came out of the woodwork over the Giffords incident in AZ. Even though the shooter was apparently nuts, it still wasn't the gun in the wrong. But the anti-gun types believe no guns equals no gun crimes. They believe it's the gun that's evil.

We in this forum know that's not the case. Regardless where guns are legal or illegal, criminals carry them for many reasons. One may be because the rap for possession is far less than the rap for half the things they have already done or will do. Possession vs. manslaughter-1? The possession rap is nothing compared to man-1. Possession vs aggravated robbery? Big deal. They just don't give a flip about the law - it's meaningless to them. There is the difference - it's NOT meaningless to us.

Try this - instead of taking the approach of telling the anti-gun folks they are wrong, just ask them if they are evil and murderous - do they right now desire to go out and murder someone? Rob a 7-11? Do a drive-by and spray a house indescriminately?

Of course the answer is no...

Then ask them this - say they were walking by a school, and found a loaded gun on the ground. Of course no one would want to leave it there for a child to find. And they needed to go somewhere so couldn't stand around all day guarding it. By calling 911, they hear the cops were all involved in a major bomb-threat elsewhere and unavailable to come to the scene. They are asked to carefully bring it 2 blocks to the police station. They pick it up - a loaded gun. Would they now want to go out and murder someone, or rob a 7-11? The gun is in their hands - does it cause them to want to commit a gun felony?

Again, they'd say no, likely with a look of disgust. They would never go out and rob a 7-11. Gun or no gun, they wouldn't commit the crime - that's right, isn't it?

The gun is therefore irrelevant to the desire to do the crime. It's the person, not the gun, that does the evil thing.

If by this time they haven't had a moment's introspection over their position, they've drunk way too much of the kool-aid.
 

fuhr52

New member
You are trying to use logic to argue with people that are not intersested in logic. They only care about their agenda and how good they feel about themselves because they care more than you do.
 

sdismukes

New member
I concur. For too many the agenda trumps intelligence and reasoning. I hope that amongst those spewing the party-line, there may be a few that are struck by reason, reasonably presented, and have the spine to change their minds.
 

Skiluvr03

New member
The same people that protest guns protest everything else; they are professional protesters/whiners. Years ago I saw a Rush Limbaugh program where he showed several different protest marches and he pointed out all these people that were at each one
 

nymoose

New member
It does crack me up though....these people who think that if we outlaw legal guns/ownership today, violent gun crime will just 'disappear' tomorrow.

There's also an old saying, "You can't talk horse sense to a jack ass". Whether it's gun rights, abortion, gay rights, or whatever; some people are so sewt in their ways they will not even consider the other side of the argument.
 

Tucker's Mom

New member
I concur. For too many the agenda trumps intelligence and reasoning. I hope that amongst those spewing the party-line, there may be a few that are struck by reason, reasonably presented, and have the spine to change their minds.

Well...hubby and I were invited to a neighbour's house the other week. The woman of the house who owns the house grew up with plinking cans in her youth. Her ex-husband was an airline pilot and have a lot of guns. After her husband died, she never touched the guns again and plan to give it to her son one day. She is not against guns but her boyfriend is. Just like any other person who hasn't touched guns since whenever, she is scared it might go off on its own. I explained to her that is not the case. Meanwhile my husband went into rhetorics and defended his position on carrying. Before our visit was over, we were all talking like human beings usually do after a heated argument. We're going to the range this weekend.
 

SGB

New member
You can not have a rational conversation with an irrational individual, it isn't possible.
 

wild eyed willy

New member
Major General Peter Cosgrove is a Pure Australian treasure!'





This is one of the best comeback lines of all time.. It is a portion of an ABC radio interview between a female broadcaster and General Cosgrove who was about to sponsor a Boy Scout Troop visiting his military Headquarters.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
So, General Cosgrove, what things are you going to teach these young boys when they visit your base?

GENERAL COSGROVE:
We're going to teach them climbing, canoeing, archery and shooting.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
Shooting! That's a bit irresponsible, isn't it?

GENERAL COSGROVE:
I don't see why, they'll be properly supervised on the rifle range.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
Don't you admit that this is a terribly dangerous activity to be teaching children?

GENERAL COSGROVE:
I don't see how. We will be teaching them proper rifle discipline before they even touch a firearm.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
But you're equipping them to become violent killers..

GENERAL COSGROVE:
Well, Ma'am, you're equipped to be a prostitute, but you're not one, are you?

The radio cast went silent for 46 seconds and when it returned, the interview was over.

One of my friends emaild this to me, it fits this discussion
 

fuhr52

New member
I received this in an e-mail several months ago. This goes along with another one I got about a reporter interviewing a Marine sniper. She asked him what he felt when he took out a target. His answer was "recoil mam".
 

nogods

Active member
I received this in an e-mail several months ago. This goes along with another one I got about a reporter interviewing a Marine sniper. She asked him what he felt when he took out a target. His answer was "recoil mam".

And you find that impressive?

Sounds "cool" but it is BS.

Any human who has just killed another human and claims they have no personal emotional reaction to it is either a liar or a nut case who should never be allowed to live in a civilized society without 24/7 supervision.
 

wild eyed willy

New member
And you find that impressive?

Sounds "cool" but it is BS.

Any human who has just killed another human and claims they have no personal emotional reaction to it is either a liar or a nut case who should never be allowed to live in a civilized society without 24/7 supervision.
Not so! If all of us felt something when killing another human being, we would have very few people able to do it.... I am sure I could off a BG and think nothing of it, but I won't know and I hope I never have to find out.. Not everyones feelings work the same way....
 

nogods

Active member
Not so! If all of us felt something when killing another human being, we would have very few people able to do it.... I am sure I could off a BG and think nothing of it, but I won't know and I hope I never have to find out.. Not everyones feelings work the same way....

Again, not true. What one might do, and what one might feel after doing it, are two separate independent things.

Ever hear a judge sentencing a convicted murderer to a maximum sentence? They often say "you have exhibited no remorse for your actions, no emotional recognition that you took the life of another human. You are an animal. You deserve to spend the rest of your pathetic life in jail...."

We expect humans to feel remorse about killing another human regardless of the circumstances. We expect returning soldiers and LEO's who have killed to have emotional reactions to the event, no matter how justified. Those that claim they don't have such reactions are either liars or insane.
 

MarkX

New member
Disarm the BGs first

My response to anti-gun people is, I'll give up my gun when the BGs have been disarmed.
While I don't completely believe that, it is hard to argue against. If they are still vehemently opposed, I figure their stance is emotional and drop it.
 

fuhr52

New member
And you find that impressive?

Sounds "cool" but it is BS.

Any human who has just killed another human and claims they have no personal emotional reaction to it is either a liar or a nut case who should never be allowed to live in a civilized society without 24/7 supervision.
What makes you think I find this impressive. You can call BS on this all you want. I happen to know some former military snipers. Their training instills a mind set in them that allows them to deal with what they are doing. You can meet these people every day and not have a clue what they did. By the way Mr. Rodgers was a sniper during WWII. How do you think medics deal with the daily carnage they get into. Getting off subject here so I will let this go.:pleasantry:
 

wild eyed willy

New member
Again, not true. What one might do, and what one might feel after doing it, are two separate independent things.

Ever hear a judge sentencing a convicted murderer to a maximum sentence? They often say "you have exhibited no remorse for your actions, no emotional recognition that you took the life of another human. You are an animal. You deserve to spend the rest of your pathetic life in jail...."

We expect humans to feel remorse about killing another human regardless of the circumstances. We expect returning soldiers and LEO's who have killed to have emotional reactions to the event, no matter how justified. Those that claim they don't have such reactions are either liars or insane.
I have given this a lot of thought, and I really don't think I would have bad feelings for offing a BG that was out to off me....Wouldn't it be just like slapping a misquito... Especially if I didn't know the person... You can say I am insane for feeling that way, but I feel bad if I kill a fish I planed to release, or run over a squirrel because I couldn't slow down fast enough, I value most life very high, but I think I could end the life of a BG and not give it any thought at all, beyond being thankfull it wasn't me...

Again I have no experiance to draw from and I hope I never need to find out..... I really don't think all peoples emotions work the same way....
 

6shootercarry

New member
Oh here we go again with the "NOGODS SAYS" s h i t e again... LOL... Another rights trampling Dr. Phil wannabe we have here...

Who cares what you have to write or say... I think it's funny... It was said or written to get that type of reaction from anal retentive control freaks who feel the need to perform amateur Dr. Phil like psychoanalysis... Were you toilet trained at gunpoint or under some form of duress? Were you a bed wetter that was unfairly punished?

Fuhr52, I thought it was funny, for what that may be worth... LOL...
 

6shootercarry

New member
Again, not true. What one might do, and what one might feel after doing it, are two separate independent things.

Ever hear a judge sentencing a convicted murderer to a maximum sentence? They often say "you have exhibited no remorse for your actions, no emotional recognition that you took the life of another human. You are an animal. You deserve to spend the rest of your pathetic life in jail...."

We expect humans to feel remorse about killing another human regardless of the circumstances. We expect returning soldiers and LEO's who have killed to have emotional reactions to the event, no matter how justified. Those that claim they don't have such reactions are either liars or insane.

"We expect"??... Presumptuous... Another liberal trait... Tell others how they should feel in any given situation and sit in judgement when the reaction differs from the one expected... GFY...
 

Ringo

A WATCHMAN
Oh here we go again with the "NOGODS SAYS" s h i t e again... LOL... Another rights trampling Dr. Phil wannabe we have here...

Who cares what you have to write or say... I think it's funny... It was said or written to get that type of reaction from anal retentive control freaks who feel the need to perform amateur Dr. Phil like psychoanalysis... Were you toilet trained at gunpoint or under some form of duress? Were you a bed wetter that was unfairly punished?

Fuhr52, I thought it was funny, for what that may be worth... LOL...
Yep, totally ridiculous.
 

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