Help with this scenario, please.

[nca_mm]

OK, a whole bunch of family is going to the beach this weekend. On Saturday night, 6 of us plan to go out to eat.

Help me out with this.....when we get up in the morning & go down to the beach, I'll consume some beer. Well, around 4:00ish I'm sure I'll come in, shower up, & get ready to go out to eat. Now, given that I've drank some beers previously in the day, can I no longer carry my pistol with me (Yes. I'm a CWP holder)? I know the law about carrying & not drinking while carrying, but my consumption will have happened a couple of hours prior to going out. Given Black Bike Week is going on just up the road from where we'll be, & given the history of that event, I'd like to be carrying.....but I don't wanna be a law breaker in doing so.

Help is appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Robgmn]

'Might want to play it safe and avoid the booze altogether.
Another option would be to find the fomulae that help determine how long it takes for your body to burn off the alcohol.
You can drink, then quit in time to be clean should you need to use the gun.

 

[NavyLCDR]

The only applicable South Carolina law I can find is:

SECTION 16-23-465. Additional penalty for unlawfully carrying pistol or firearm onto premises of business selling alcoholic liquor, beer or wine for on-premises consumption; exceptions.

(A) In addition to the penalties provided for by Sections 16-11-330, 16-11-620, 16-23-460, 23-31-220, and Article 1, Chapter 23, Title 16, a person convicted of carrying a firearm into a business which sells alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine for consumption on the premises is guilty of a misdemeanor, and, upon conviction, must be fined not more than two thousand dollars or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

In addition to the penalties described above, a person who violates this section while carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23 must have his concealed weapon permit revoked for a period of five years.

(B)(1) This section does not apply to a person carrying a concealable weapon pursuant to and in compliance with Article 4, Chapter 31, Title 23; however, the person shall not consume alcoholic liquor, beer, or wine while carrying the concealable weapon on the business' premises. A person who violates this item may be charged with a violation of subsection (A).

(2) A property owner, holder of a lease interest, or operator of a business may prohibit the carrying of concealable weapons into the business by posting a "NO CONCEALABLE WEAPONS ALLOWED" sign in compliance with Section 23-31-235. A person who carries a concealable weapon into a business with a sign posted in compliance with Section 23-31-235 may be charged with a violation of subsection (A).

(3) A property owner, holder of a lease interest, or operator of a business may request that a person carrying a concealable weapon leave the business' premises, or any portion of the premises, or request that a person carrying a concealable weapon remove the concealable weapon from the business' premises, or any portion of the premises. A person carrying a concealable weapon who refuses to leave a business' premises or portion of the premises when requested or refuses to remove the concealable weapon from a business' premises or portion of the premises when requested may be charged with a violation of subsection (A).

 

[Robgmn]

Law is law, but what happens when you have to shoot someone and you've got a BAC that exceeds 0.0 ?
The vultures love to eat that stuff up.
Guess who becomes the "victim of a shooting" while you spend hundreds of thousands in vulture fees to show you were in the right to draw and fire?
Better safe than sorry, even if you've got the money to burn...

 

[NavyLCDR]

Law is law, but what happens when you have to shoot someone and you've got a BAC that exceeds 0.0 ?
The vultures love to eat that stuff up.
Guess who becomes the "victim of a shooting" while you spend hundreds of thousands in vulture fees to show you were in the right to draw and fire?
Better safe than sorry, even if you've got the money to burn...

That is a very common statement made on the internet - however there are no real cases to point to that suggests it's true. Any time you see charges against an "under the influence" person using a gun there are a lot more shady circumstances involved other than just using it in self defense and being under the influence at the time. Now if someone would care to validate the theory with actual cases happening in real life, I would welcome to see it.

 

[Eidolon]

Law is law, but what happens when you have to shoot someone and you've got a BAC that exceeds 0.0 ?
The vultures love to eat that stuff up.
Guess who becomes the "victim of a shooting" while you spend hundreds of thousands in vulture fees to show you were in the right to draw and fire?
Better safe than sorry, even if you've got the money to burn...

Got some case law to back this hypothesis up?

 

[Eidolon]

The simplest solution is to forgo the alcohol

 

[Robgmn]

Got some case law to back this hypothesis up?

There's a heckuva lot to offer.
Victim blaming is a very easy go-to when a vulture wants to show how innocent their defendant is. They will use ANYTHING they can.


(Too long to copy and paste): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victim_blaming
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Goetz
As Steubenville Rape Trial Opens, Victim-Blaming Begins in Court of Law and Public Opinion - Rewire
Defense Attorney Blames Child Victim for Being Gang Raped - Truthdig

Here is the Texas penal code on self-defense (other states have similar statutes): Texas Penal Code - PENAL § 9.31 | FindLaw
Now, give that to the opposing attorney along with the proof that you had alcohol in your system at the time of the justified shooting.
Guess what they will use in the defense of their "innocent" client? The fact that you were "impaired" and unable to make good judgement in the heat of the moment due to the alcohol in your system (or anything else, for that matter).
You've now killed someone unnecessarily (he was a "good boy" who "never hurt anyone", and was only holding the Bowie knife in order to cut an apple he was going to share with you) and are criminally negligent per the vulture (who will try to convince the jury of the same).

In Alabama: "making a mistake in judgment due to intoxication and illegally threatening or shooting a person while under the influence could be charged from a range of misdemeanors including harassment and simple assault to felonies such as criminally negligent homicide and murder if the victim succumbed to injuries from an illegal use of force"

In Michigan, "any amount of detectable alcohol via a breathalyzer, urinalysis, or blood sample will result in civil forfeiture of that pistol, a misdemeanor offense, and revocation of that CCW permit for a year. A concealed carry permit can be permanently revoked if a concealed carrier has a BAC of over .10."

But, if you don't believe the vultures would use alcohol in your system in a legal argument against, then by all means test the theory.
You may find yourself wishing you believed.

 

[nca_mm]

The only applicable South Carolina law I can find is:

Yeah, I've read this several times over. It says "the person shall not consume.......while carrying the concealable weapon." Law is written in present tense & doesn't include past tense.

I understand that it would just be easiest to not drink a drop, but here I'll be at a large family gathering, having a good time, grilling, enjoying the beach & the company.......I'll want to enjoy a few beers. I'll not get the least bit drunk, as it takes about a case of beer to do that to me. I just want to do what I normally do, then when some of us go out for seafood, be able to carry my pistol as I always do....especially given it's black bike week.

 

[Robgmn]

Sorry to be a ****. but what was the point of the "help please" if the result is just that you're going to do what you wanted to do in the first place, without regard to either "side" of the ideas presented?
That just seems odd to me.

 

[NavyLCDR]

I understand that it would just be easiest to not drink a drop, but here I'll be at a large family gathering, having a good time, grilling, enjoying the beach & the company.......I'll want to enjoy a few beers. I'll not get the least bit drunk, as it takes about a case of beer to do that to me. I just want to do what I normally do, then when some of us go out for seafood, be able to carry my pistol as I always do....especially given it's black bike week.

Well, that's exactly what I would do. However, just remember "drunk" is not defined by how you feel, it is defined by your BAC. We don't have a "no drinking while carrying" law in Washington and I won't hesitate to have a beer or two with dinner while carrying. We even have open carry get togethers here and we enjoy frosty beverages during those events. Never been a problem here.

Sorry to be a ****. but what was the point of the "help please" if the result is just that you're going to do what you wanted to do in the first place, without regard to either "side" of the ideas presented?
That just seems odd to me.

Seems to me that the OP was soliciting factual information that would indicate a real problem. He didn't get any factual information to dissuade him so he is going with his initial feelings/plans on the matter. If he had factual information presented to indicate a problem I am sure that he would change his plans.

 

[nca_mm]

Sorry to be a ****. but what was the point of the "help please" if the result is just that you're going to do what you wanted to do in the first place, without regard to either "side" of the ideas presented?
That just seems odd to me.

I think you might be perceiving me wrong. I just want facts, interpretations, & opinions & all are welcome & appreciated.

 

[nca_mm]

Seems to me that the OP was soliciting factual information that would indicate a real problem. He didn't get any factual information to dissuade him so he is going with his initial feelings/plans on the matter. If he had factual information presented to indicate a problem I am sure that he would change his plans.

Bingo!

 

[Eidolon]

I understand that it would just be easiest to not drink a drop, but here I'll be at a large family gathering, having a good time, grilling, enjoying the beach & the company.......I'll want to enjoy a few beers. I'll not get the least bit drunk, as it takes about a case of beer to do that to me. I just want to do what I normally do, then when some of us go out for seafood, be able to carry my pistol as I always do....especially given it's black bike week.

I quit drinking 30+ years ago so I don't see the appeal but given the information we have I don't see that you have any option than don't drink or don't carry

 

[Eidolon]

There's a heckuva lot to offer.
Victim blaming is a very easy go-to when a vulture wants to show how innocent their defendant is. They will use ANYTHING they can.


(Too long to copy and paste): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victim_blaming
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernhard_Goetz
As Steubenville Rape Trial Opens, Victim-Blaming Begins in Court of Law and Public Opinion - Rewire
Defense Attorney Blames Child Victim for Being Gang Raped - Truthdig

Here is the Texas penal code on self-defense (other states have similar statutes): Texas Penal Code - PENAL § 9.31 | FindLaw
Now, give that to the opposing attorney along with the proof that you had alcohol in your system at the time of the justified shooting.
Guess what they will use in the defense of their "innocent" client? The fact that you were "impaired" and unable to make good judgement in the heat of the moment due to the alcohol in your system (or anything else, for that matter).
You've now killed someone unnecessarily (he was a "good boy" who "never hurt anyone", and was only holding the Bowie knife in order to cut an apple he was going to share with you) and are criminally negligent per the vulture (who will try to convince the jury of the same).

In Alabama: "making a mistake in judgment due to intoxication and illegally threatening or shooting a person while under the influence could be charged from a range of misdemeanors including harassment and simple assault to felonies such as criminally negligent homicide and murder if the victim succumbed to injuries from an illegal use of force"

In Michigan, "any amount of detectable alcohol via a breathalyzer, urinalysis, or blood sample will result in civil forfeiture of that pistol, a misdemeanor offense, and revocation of that CCW permit for a year. A concealed carry permit can be permanently revoked if a concealed carrier has a BAC of over .10."

But, if you don't believe the vultures would use alcohol in your system in a legal argument against, then by all means test the theory.
You may find yourself wishing you believed.

OK case law would be actual evidence that in an otherwise justified shooting the shooter was prosecuted because s/he had any level of alcohol in their blood

 

[Reba]

The simplest solution is to forgo the alcohol

Ditto.

 

[Reba]

You seem to be anxious about Black Bike Week happening in Myrtle Beach while you're there. If that's really a concern to you, it would seem even more important that you stay sober for maximum situational awareness and reaction capability.

 

[Eidolon]

You seem to be anxious about Black Bike Week happening in Myrtle Beach while you're there. If that's really a concern to you, it would seem even more important that you stay sober for maximum situational awareness and reaction capability.

I didn't quite want to go there but that almost falls under the heading of "Daniel-san best block no be there".

I'm a big believer in mitigating every risk I can and if not drinking alcohol solves most of my problems then don't drink alcohol.

Again, I don't drink but I can't imagine alcohol adding that much to the experience that I just have to have it.

Now if it was weed.....

 

[NavyLCDR]

I'm still trying to figure out what color of bike people ride has anything to do with it? Or is it like the evil black "assault" rifles that we here so much about? Can't people riding orange, red, green, blue or white bikes be just as dangerous as those riding black bikes?

 

[nca_mm]

Too much to post here with regards to black bike week. Kinda surprised no one has heard of all the shenanigans. Just google it. Pretty much the biggest lawlessness charade in the lower 48 every single year. Gotten so bad that the governor has stepped in & all but demanded the event stop happening. It's bad.

We're gonna be at Surfside Beach, which is south of Myrtle Beach where the event happens, but spillage happens, I'm sure.