Handloads: Not a Good Idea for Concealed Carry?

longslide10

longslide10

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:yes4:Thank you, Longslide10, for posting this. I have a duaghter (with ccw) and she is dating an avid reloader (also with ccw). I had mentioned that the use of reloads was great in cutting practice expense, but bad for defensive carry. You have just made my case.:yes4:
 
I practice with what I carry, mostly Federal JHP. But, in the “Armory” the backup is from the Dillon 550. I certainly could not afford to have a well-stocked WTSHTF plan without my tried and true loads. I hope to always have the in gun and spare mags loaded with the factory made but the majority shall be my loads. They are not up to max pressure but they certainly are the most accurate.
I have been loading since 1974 and the perfected pet loads for my weapons are (Here is a value judgment) better. +P or hotter is neither my options nor loads.
 
I read an column the other day by Massad Ayoob (don't ask me where) they were talking about the use of hard bullets & FMJ bullets and they said that the JHP bullet is much better for a concealed carry gun, because they wont go complety through the person getting shot and stay in the body. Massad talked about a shooting where a person shot someone with a 45 Automatic FMJ and out of the 7 shots that were fired 4 of them went complety through the body and continued on out the other side, where if there was someone was behind the person getting shot would have been shot also, to which Massad said to use only JHP's in self defence.
 
While this makes for a good read, and for good argument, I have yet to find one actual case where the fact that hand loaded ammo convicted anyone, solely on the merits of hand loaded ammo alone.

I understand the argument, but find it difficult to 'track down' an actual case that I can read ... just keep hearing the 'testimony' of some 'expert'.... but, where did this happen, and when?

I have legal-beagle friends, and they have never heard of a hand-loaded cartridge, alone, convicting anybody, in what would otherwise have been a case of legal self defense.

Out of fear of this type of reprisal, I DO use factory ammo only for my CCW, but, I'd like to read up on an actual self defense case (JUST ONE) that went to a shooter's conviction based solely on a hand-load.

Happy Shootin'
 
I not only handload, but cast my own bullets. My loads are every bit as good as, if not better than, factory loads. At about 1/10th the price.
What I would be more worried about if I had to go to court, would be any gunsmithing work that had been done to the gun. Trigger jobs, etc.

It ain't gonna stop me from having the work done to get a trigger where I like it though.
 
If the gun fired with out you pressing the trigger, then any work done on the gun would be in question.
But if you pressed the trigger and shot someone, the questions would be about you and was it justified, NOT about the gun being worked on.
 
I have been reloading for many years and have been a student of self defense, family members are lawyer, they nor I have ever heard of a case where a reloaded ammunition from a upright citizen was an issue.
 
If it's a good shoot, it's a good shoot. What else is there to say about that?

What if it's a questionable shoot? Like Zimmerman...did they look into his ammunition? Did they look into his firearm alterations? Nope and nope.

No factory load will have the dedication and precision that I will put into my own reloaded rounds....now if only I had reloading equipment!
 
I found the magazine I saw the article talking about FMJ bullets going through a person, it's the Sept/Oct edition of American Handgunner Magazine in the Ayoob Files talking about the James Patterson shooting.You can download digital copies of this magazine for free along with the Guns, Shooting Industry and american cop magazines, just google the magazines name and go to the bottom of the webb site and hit digital copies.
 
WB9IIE said:
:yes4:Thank you, Longslide10, for posting this. I have a duaghter (with ccw) and she is dating an avid reloader (also with ccw). I had mentioned that the use of reloads was great in cutting practice expense, but bad for defensive carry. You have just made my case.:yes4:[/QUOTE

Glad the article was of help. Anything Massad says should be taken to heart. The man is full of serious wisdom when it comes to firearms and self defense.
Click to expand...
 
Almost_Blameless said:
While this makes for a good read, and for good argument, I have yet to find one actual case where the fact that hand loaded ammo convicted anyone, solely on the merits of hand loaded ammo alone.

I understand the argument, but find it difficult to 'track down' an actual case that I can read ... just keep hearing the 'testimony' of some 'expert'.... but, where did this happen, and when?

I have legal-beagle friends, and they have never heard of a hand-loaded cartridge, alone, convicting anybody, in what would otherwise have been a case of legal self defense.

Out of fear of this type of reprisal, I DO use factory ammo only for my CCW, but, I'd like to read up on an actual self defense case (JUST ONE) that went to a shooter's conviction based solely on a hand-load.

Happy Shootin'
Click to expand...

I agree. What makes a handloaded cartridge any different than a factory load. They are both designed to do a specific job. Create a incapacitating or fatal wound. I think by handloading you can control the consistency of each round compared to factory loads and that to me is the only difference. The problem is, a Lawyer / DA /ADA knows how to work that and a crowd to his advantage. Lawyers are skilled wordsmiths and the general populace is not. He could very easily turn a jury against you if you have no or poor representation or if you yourself can't convince the usually ignorant jury the DA / ADA have bad intel and no leg to stand on.
 
Stan45 said:
If the gun fired with out you pressing the trigger, then any work done on the gun would be in question.
But if you pressed the trigger and shot someone, the questions would be about you and was it justified, NOT about the gun being worked on.
Click to expand...

I could almost guarantee you any mods to the firearm would come into question at some point as would the ammo. They would play any angle for a conviction. Remember, the DA is trying to get convictions and money for the court and the county as are all lawyers btw. If there are no convictions, no crimes then there are no jobs for lawyers and judges. The same goes for health-- no sick people, no scrip drugs, no doctors and no big Pharma companies to keep people sick.
 
My ccw's instructor said to use JHP for concealed carry. Since he has been a leo for several years and seems to be very knowledgeable, I am taking his advice.
 
longslide10 said:
I could almost guarantee you any mods to the firearm would come into question at some point as would the ammo. They would play any angle for a conviction. Remember, the DA is trying to get convictions and money for the court and the county as are all lawyers btw. If there are no convictions, no crimes then there are no jobs for lawyers and judges. The same goes for health-- no sick people, no scrip drugs, no doctors and no big Pharma companies to keep people sick.
Click to expand...

Can you find any trend, or even a singular conviction, based on a firearm modification (ie trigger modification) or FMJ vs JHP that led to a person conviction? Even more so, led to a persons conviction in a self defense that was deemed a good shooting by police at the scene of the incident (ie Zimmerman)? I can't find either...as SGB put it earlier, it's a theoretical hypothesis that is immaterial to a good shoot.

superprincess said:
My ccw's instructor said to use JHP for concealed carry. Since he has been a leo for several years and seems to be very knowledgeable, I am taking his advice.
Click to expand...

Just for clarification, this is not about JHP vs FMJ rounds. This is about reloading ammunition and factory loaded ammunition, both can be JHP ammunition.
 
Firefighterchen said:
Can you find any trend, or even a singular conviction, based on a firearm modification (ie trigger modification) or FMJ vs JHP that led to a person conviction? Even more so, led to a persons conviction in a self defense that was deemed a good shooting by police at the scene of the incident (ie Zimmerman)? I can't find either...as SGB put it earlier, it's a theoretical hypothesis that is immaterial to a good shoot.




Just for clarification, this is not about JHP vs FMJ rounds. This is about reloading ammunition and factory loaded ammunition, both can be JHP ammunition.
Click to expand...


I'm not saying there has been a conviction, it's a broad statement saying if a DA knew of mods or custom ammo they would more than likely use that to their advantage and I think that's what Massad is trying to point out, to remove the doubt by not using handloads.
 
Leaving aside the impact on a defensive situation, there is a good chance that your firearm's warranty etal will be voided by use of handloaded and not factory ammunition. In some instances, particularly on a semi, a potential failure of the firearm, with significant resulting injuries, can occur that can occur if handload is not done within specs and procedures.
 
This is a non-issue after all. I only carry and use what I am the most comfortable with. I follow the training I have had not the advice of others, just a thought on this issue. If we feel comfortable about our ways and it is good sound self-defense doctrine is this not good enough?
 
This is part of the old, well why didn't you shoot just to wound or dis-able bull crap.
If you are not shooting to kill, you shouldn't be shooting at all.
 
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